Best Work of Frank Yang

[Davino]

@Leo Gura 

My real question about Frank Yang is the following: What do you think of his baseline consciousness?

Let's not talk about the peaks of Awakening but someone that is interested in achieving the highest permanent realization possible.

In this line, I find Frank Yang to be in an extraordinary base line of consciousness. He perceives a boundless 360º centerless sky of sensations. Where he is holographically conscious of all nanocorners of reality as empty & full simultaneously. He is in a flow present state 24/7 and is free from all suffering and identification with his own body and mind, everything appears as clouds of sensations indistinguishable from Awake Luminous Spacious Infinite Reality.  

I honestly find this remarkable, this is not something to casually dismiss. This is the peak of what is achievable in constant everyday life. I do unstertand and have experienced myself how infinite Awakening can become, in a way that makes ridiculous wishing it to be permanent. However, I am working on both axis, in the deepest Awakenings possible but also, why not, in an impressive baseline consciousness. I find that you have traded baseline consciousness for higher Spiral Dynamics Evolution. Fair enough. But something is off with your baseline consciousness, it sometimes feel you have neglected that, in contrast with your other well polished facets like Maturity and Peak Awakenings. Have you thrown the towel after Awakening so hard?

 

[Leo Gura]

5 hours ago, Davino said:

I disagree also with him on that.

For me his point 3 is more on expansion and everythingness. Not on Infinity or God. If you look it through that lens it makes more sense.

Infinity = God = Everything

To make distinctions between these things is bonkers.

3 hours ago, Davino said:

@Leo Gura 

My real question about Frank Yang is the following: What do you think of his baseline consciousness?

I have no idea because there is no simple way to measure this.

[Arthogaan]

8 hours ago, Davino said:

@Leo Gura 

My real question about Frank Yang is the following: What do you think of his baseline consciousness?

Let's not talk about the peaks of Awakening but someone that is interested in achieving the highest permanent realization possible.

In this line, I find Frank Yang to be in an extraordinary base line of consciousness. He perceives a boundless 360º centerless sky of sensations. Where he is holographically conscious of all nanocorners of reality as empty & full simultaneously. He is in a flow present state 24/7 and is free from all suffering and identification with his own body and mind, everything appears as clouds of sensations indistinguishable from Awake Luminous Spacious Infinite Reality.  

I honestly find this remarkable, this is not something to casually dismiss. This is the peak of what is achievable in constant everyday life. I do unstertand and have experienced myself how infinite Awakening can become, in a way that makes ridiculous wishing it to be permanent. However, I am working on both axis, in the deepest Awakenings possible but also, why not, in an impressive baseline consciousness. I find that you have traded baseline consciousness for higher Spiral Dynamics Evolution. Fair enough. But something is off with your baseline consciousness, it sometimes feel you have neglected that, in contrast with your other well polished facets like Maturity and Peak Awakenings. Have you thrown the towel after Awakening so hard?

 

Yes! Baseline is what I am interested in now. For Leo highest value of his life is Understanding. So his exploring of highest, dangerous states with psychedelics is perfectly in line with that.

But for me, for this body it's about Freedom, Fun, Lightness, Joy. All of that comes from mastering baseline.

And I had major shift two weeks ago and altough I am not there yet it's totally obvious that Frank's levels of baseline are genuine and possible.

Dissolving the feeling of center is crucial for baseline. When you look at the world and have no sense of location then it's like the universe takes care of your baseline on itself.

[Davino]

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Infinity = God = Everything

To make distinctions between these things is bonkers.

Do you really think that? I mean all are facets of the one and identical in the ultimate sense but there is a genuine point on making these distinctions.

Everything is the expansion side and nothing is the contraction side of the Absolute. I became one with everything dozens of times before even glimpsing God or Infinity. You can become conscious of God but not breakthrough into Infinity. Infinity certainly feels Godly but you may not fully take control of your Sovereignty & Godhood. Why are you oversimplifying things? There is an irreducible complexity to this facets

 

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

I have no idea because there is no simple way to measure this.

Why are you avoiding my question?

I just told you what his baseline consciousness is. I studied deeply his work, that's what he communicates through his videos, the 360º camera and the cool shots he makes are not just art, they are the closest he can make to transmit how his moment to moment experience unfolds. If you deny this in others, as there is no simple way to measure it, you have to also deny it also to yourself, as there is no simple way of measuring your Alien Awakening. As an experiment, let's just assume, that the previous description I made was accurate. What do you say about this axis of Awakening? The base line ant worker that forever dissolves all centers, solidities, persona identity and ego into the Infinite Awake Space and self abides as Reality itself ever-present?

Agree it is not the highest peaks of consciousness possible but it is constant, so stick your neck out and say what you really think

[Davino]

@Leo Gura What do you think of this video?

[Leo Gura]

Quote

Do you really think that? I mean all are facets of the one and identical in the ultimate sense but there is a genuine point on making these distinctions.

They can be distinguished as facets or aspects, but to make linear stages out of them is wrong.

Quote

Why are you avoiding my question?

I just told you what his baseline consciousness is. I studied deeply his work, that's what he communicates through his videos, the 360º camera and the cool shots he makes are not just art, they are the closest he can make to transmit how his moment to moment experience unfolds.

I didn't avoid your question.

Whatever his baseline is, it's one state of possibly millions. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with his state. But to frame it as some kind of 'natural' or ultimate state is silly. Different people will have different "natural" states. Your state is a function of your genetics, first and foremost.

Comparing all these states is very hard because they are just qualitatively different from each other.

Just because he was able to achieve that state does not mean you will be able to. You might have a different natural state. You guys are overlooking just how different people are and all the wild variations that exist with consciousness.

Edited March 16 by Leo Gura

[Davino]

19 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

They can be distinguished as facets or aspects, but to make linear stages out of them is beyond wrong.

Agree

19 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Whatever his baseline is, it's one state of possibly millions. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with his state. But to frame it as some kind of 'natural' or ultimate state is silly.

He doesn't frame it like such, altough it may seem so at first glance. My understanding is the following, in the axis of constant awakening you break the speed of sound that is the duality between subject and object forever and after that point, the one reality takes care of itself. It is not a ultimate state but rather a crossing point of no return in baseline consciousness, the end of all identification with the body/mind. Imagine being dead while alive, something like that. It is a no return point. 

19 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Comparing all these states is very hard because they are just qualitatively different from each other.

Okay now I got what you wanted to say before. I get your position now

 

Edited March 16 by Davino

[Leo Gura]

20 minutes ago, Davino said:

My understanding is the following, in the axis of constant awakening you break the speed of sound that is the duality between subject and object forever and after that point, the one reality takes care of itself. It is not a ultimate state but rather a crossing point of no return in baseline consciousness, the end of all identification with the body/mind. Imagine being dead while alive, something like that. It is a no return point.

Sure. That's something that exists. Among many other states of consciousness.

But don't forget. You ARE the body and mind. You can't experience anything which you are not.

Edited March 17 by Leo Gura

[Princess Arabia]

29 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

But don't forget. You ARE the body and mind. You can't experience anything which you are not

Thought we couldn't be what we can observe. I was under the impression that I am not the body nor the mind.

[Leo Gura]

27 minutes ago, Princess Arabia said:

Thought we couldn't be what we can observe. I was under the impression that I am not the body nor the mind.

This is exactly why I am critical of those kind of teachings.

You are EVERYTHING.

Teachings that try to distinguish oneself from material reality are incomplete and lopsided. It's a lack of God-Realization and a lack of understanding of Consciousness.

Anything that you experience must be you.

Edited March 17 by Leo Gura

[Princess Arabia]

Just now, Leo Gura said:

This is exactly why I am critical of those kind of teachings.

You are EVERYTHING.

Makes sense, because I know I am everything but then you are not the body didn't make sense with that. This was why a couple weeks ago I took a break from Spiritual teachings because a lot started to not make sense as I started evolving. Thanks.

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Princess Arabia said:

you are not the body didn't make sense

What "you are not the body" really means is: you are not exclusively the body. You are Consciousness and all the contents within consciousness, of which the body is one part. You are the body, the mind, the dog, the tree, the rock, the sky, the stars, and the people. You are the whole universe. And when the whole universe disappears, you will be the void that remains.

It's all one thing.

Edited March 17 by Leo Gura

[Princess Arabia]

Just now, Leo Gura said:

What "you are not the body" really means is: you are not exclusively the body. You are Consciousness and all the contents within consciousness, of which the body is one part. You are the body, the mind, the dog, the tree, the rock, the sky, the stars, and the people.

Leo. Lol

[CosmicExplorer]

On 16.03.2024 at 2:28 AM, Davino said:

and is free from all suffering and identification with his own body and mind

He is not. 

 

If we're talking about the basic definition of suffering, he is not free from it. Increased tolerance to pain is completly different than being free from it. Look up my Reddit post about it https://www.reddit.com/r/streamentry/s/oPm1KmCPTr

[Leo Gura]

Emotional suffering will also arise when shit hits the fan. Don't be fooled. No one is above that. They are just pretending.

Edited March 17 by Leo Gura

[Jannes]

11 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Sure. That's something that exists. Among many other states of consciousness.

 

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Emotional suffering will also arise when shit hits the fan. Don't be fooled. No one is above that. They are just pretending.

With all your comments in this thread I have the impression that you have a very low opinion of these states of consciousness. It seems to me that you try to be the realistic counterweight and I appreciate that because it's easy to get soaked into these fantasies. 

But on the other hand I think you might discredit these states too much. While they might not be the highest and deepest states or all perfect states there is the possibility that they could give people a huge jump in life quality. In our society where so many of us suffer deeply/ are super depressed/ mental health crisis etc. it seems a bit negligent to discredit these states like that. Even if they reduced our everyday suffering by 50% that would be an insane improvement for society. You also dont really offer an (edit: spiritual) alternative. High awakenings are great but as you said they dont really help with everyday life that much.  

Just as a side point: I think with your spiritual journey you built a huge spiritual confidence/ ego, feeling invincible and superior to everybody and that ego got crushed when you had personal issues recently because it made you feel weak and small like everybody. Just want to point out the possible trap that your ego might have a backlash which shows itself in discrediting other teachings because they reveal weaknesses in your (edit: spiritual) teachings. (covering everyday life quality)

Edited March 17 by Jannes

[Leo Gura]

Quote

With all your comments in this thread I have the impression that you have a very low opinion of these states of consciousness.

I appreciate all higher states of consciousness. Just gotta be careful not to get stuck in them.

Quote

Just as a side point: I think with your spiritual journey you built a huge spiritual confidence/ ego, feeling invincible and superior to everybody and that ego got crushed when you had personal issues recently because it made you feel weak and small like everybody.

1) I have experienced levels of consciousness which rendered all human spirituality teachings as ridiculous. This made me disillusioned with all human spiritual teachings, because they are all wrong in the end. I can't be bothered to take human spiritual teachings seriously any more because that illusion has been shattered for me. I place very little value in anything spiritual that humans say. That's just where I'm at. With that said, as you say, for everyday human life those teachings are still valuable. Because the consciousness I experienced is impractical and even dangerous and antithetical to human life.

2) Ironically, it's the teachers who I am critical of who sell you on the fantasy of being invincible, or reaching some final state. I've sufferred a lot and faced a lot of limitation, so I appreciate how limited the human experience is. What I see is that a lot of spiritual people are kidding themselves. They have brainwashed themsleves with spiritual ideas and fantasies. Because in truth they were never thinking critically about anything. They were just lapping up what some guru was telling them. And then they fused those fantasies with their legit higher states of consciousness, thereby locking in the fantasy. But eventually life will shatter those fantasies. But they probably won't tell you when that happens.

Edited March 17 by Leo Gura

[Leo Gura]

30 minutes ago, Bandman said:

Are you familiar with the pythagorean metaphysical ontology of the monad, dyad and numbers?

Loosely.

Quote

What is boggling my mind lately is that the numbers 1 and 2, seem to have more metaphysical significance than numbers above them. 

What i mean is that in the end there is only one thing, monism, which is the number 1. however duality, the number 2, seems to be as significant as monism in the end. similar to what is discussed in the aztec metaphysics.. we seem to live in a world of opposites, hot and cold, awareness and unawareness, night and day. it seems like a continuous marriage of duality and non-duality, merging and seperating... god being everything , the entire universe, but also being ever transcendant...

But why duality? what is so important about the number 2 or the dyad? once we go from the number 3 the numbers seem to lose their metaphysical importance. 

the numbers 0,1,2 and infinity seem to be abstract discriptors of metaphysical realities. why aren't the other numbers? or is this just an illusion?

Yes, of course.

0, 1, 2, and even 3 are rather special numbers.

0 is the ground. 1 is the unity of all things. 2 is the duality of forms. And 3 is the count of 0, 1, and 2.

But in the end numbers are just one way to look at reality. Don't give numbers too much importance as the scientists do. You could look at reality in a completely non-numerical way.

Don't make numbers into your God.

Quote

Is the entire notion of duality and non-duality even worth contemplating about when trying to get to the ultimate truth?

Sure it is. I have episodes about duality and its importance. But also remember that duality and even nonduality are one lens to see reality, and you can look at reality in even more advanced ways.

Edited March 17 by Leo Gura

[Ishanga]

12 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

What "you are not the body" really means is: you are not exclusively the body. You are Consciousness and all the contents within consciousness, of which the body is one part. You are the body, the mind, the dog, the tree, the rock, the sky, the stars, and the people. You are the whole universe. And when the whole universe disappears, you will be the void that remains.

It's all one thing.

On one level You are correct, everything is a part of everything else, there is a connection of course, but body and mind are accumulated, no food then no body, no 5 sense then no what we call as mind (data, thinking process, ego, memories, etc... of course mind is other "things" but generalizing here), so there is a paradox at play.

What we have to be careful of is Absolutism. And we have to come from the same definition of words, Consciousness for me is Grand Intelligence, Intelligence that is not laced with memory, its always there, responsible for everything and is the essence of everything material and non material, that is our true essence, within that we have accumulated/gathered a body via food eaten, Earth Body, and Mind via our 5 senses bringing in data and an ingrained intellect that allows us to put it all together. organize it for some sort of way of functioning within this world and society...

Having Space btwn what we are and what we are not is crucial! Just because we experience something does not mean it is Us, its just an experience we are having, most of it is derived from past memories and our inner most unconscious desires, which more than likely are conditioning put into via the society we are living in.. We are inputting so much data everyday we cannot consciously be aware of it, most of it is not within our Awareness, but it manifests in our lives in many ways, in the East they call this Karma, Vasana/Samara is just the result of this Karma playing out in your life that you are mostly unaware of, which some may call Maya or Illusion, which is somewhat true, if You will fully Realized of what Your Nature is (I am Consciousness) then all of this would be nothing for You to handle, life here would be a game of sorts to play with, and when You don't want to play anymore You leave...

Being Fully Aware is what makes all of this happen, once Fully Aware (have access to conscious, unconscious, subconscious mind, karma in place and being created, illusion of time, how this body and mind work, etc) then Realization happens spontaneously, but can one be fully Aware, and if not why Not, that is why Sadhana, Accepting Now, Living Now, Responding to Now, these are just the simple tools that allow us to get thru the crap and dirt we created unconsciously and can Realize Reality that we are..

[Leo Gura]

13 minutes ago, Ishanga said:

What we have to be careful of is Absolutism. And we have to come from the same definition of words, Consciousness for me is Grand Intelligence, Intelligence that is not laced with memory, its always there,

That's a limited and conceptually skewed notion of Consciousness.

Ironically, you are engaging is some kind of absolutism there.

Quote

Having Space btwn what we are and what we are not is crucial!

There is nothing you are not and there is no space for space.

Quote

Just because we experience something does not mean it is Us

It absolutely does.

Quote

Its just an experience we are having,

Not "just". Experience is Absolute Truth.

Quote

most of it is derived from past memories and our inner most unconscious desires, which more than likely are conditioning put into via the society we are living in.

This is irrelevant to the issue.

Edited March 17 by Leo Gura