Reincarnation doesn't make sense

[Someone here]

 

 Because what exactly the thing that reincarnates? The body? The soul? The self? The Self? The awareness? The ego? All? Some? What??? 

Because as a matter of observable fact the body decays into dust and rot alright?.. Once your physical body dies it just dissolves into it's essential elements and just evaporates in nature.. Gets diffused into the soil etc.  So that's that.  What is it exactly that reincarnates then because obviously it's not the body?  The self? There is no self "inside "the body lol !.  The body is inside the" Self".  There is no ghost inside the machine. What you really have is a machine inside the ghost lol. The self (ego) is a negative hole that appears as a consequence (byproduct) of entanglement of thoughts.. perceptions.. feelings etc. It's a misidentification really. It's a negative.. not an existing entity onto itself.  So there is no self to reincarnate.   IMO reincarnation is no different from Abrahamic religion's notions of hell and heaven.. Both have ZERO evidence!. 

As for karma as an evidence that supports reincarnation.. Well it's simply that for each up there is a down and for each action there is a reaction. You throw up a ball in the sky.. It falls down in the opposite direction taking the exact time that it took to reach the highest peak to fall from it into the ground. That's karma.   The universe is already at perfect balance. There is no need for reincarnation to achieve balance as if balance could be lost to begin with. Balance is already the case.  It's inconceivable that something unbalanced could even exist!  And if you look at it from a pantheistic worldview.. You are already living inside every creature in this planet.. So at the moment that you are beheading a chicken you are the chicken that's being beheaded and the human who is beheading it simultaneously. Karma is instant. 

Edited February 28 by Someone here

[Arthogaan]

At night, when one dream ends and next begins - what remains?

7 minutes ago, Someone here said:

matter of observable fact the body decays into dust and rot alright?.. Once your physical body dies it just dissolves into it's essential elements and just evaporates in nature.

Once the first dream ends, all dreamed up matter with its essential elements are gone, and in the next dream they are dreamed up anew. What remains is Consciousness/Dreamer.

[Someone here]

5 minutes ago, Arthogaan said:

At night, when one dream ends and next begins - what remains?

 

Nothing .

6 minutes ago, Arthogaan said:

Once the first dream ends, all dreamed up matter with its essential elements are gone, and in the next dream they are dreamed up anew. What remains is Consciousness/Dreamer.

And why are you making real life so to speak analogous to a dream ?

You just don't want to accept that death is either an endless bottomless void of nothingness or the mysterious unknown. 

[Arthogaan]

33 minutes ago, Someone here said:

Nothing .

Consciousness. You can train yourself to realize that it does not fully shut off even in deep sleep.

 

34 minutes ago, Someone here said:

And why are you making real life so to speak analogous to a dream ?

Because This is a dream.

 

35 minutes ago, Someone here said:

just don't want to accept that death is either an endless bottomless void of nothingness or the mysterious unknown. 

You just don't want to realize that upper case YOU ARE ETERNAL.

[Someone here]

@Arthogaan the upper case me is indeed eternal but guess what ?...it Is nothingness itself .

The ego is gonna vanish forever. 

[Arthogaan]

4 minutes ago, Someone here said:

The ego is gonna vanish forever. 

Oh, yeah - with that I agree.

[Water by the River]

2 hours ago, Someone here said:

Both have ZERO evidence!

Besides endless amounts of NDEs, OBEs and past life memories...

See the books of Christopher Bache for example, Jürgen Ziewe, Stanislav Grof. And countless reports all over the ages, derived from altered states (psychedelic, meditation, OBE, psychics,...).

If you can keep the Absolute Perspective all the time in this life in fulltime awakened nondual states 24/7 and no longer suffer&resist, and expect that to hold in the next cycles, your reasoning is partly correct. If that is not the case, the attitude there is no next reincarnation & who cares about Karma will kick back big time in the next existence. Like it already does right now.

Basically, its confusing Absolute Truth with Relative Truth.

 

2 hours ago, Someone here said:

What is it exactly that reincarnates then because obviously it's not the body?  The self?

Do you think Infinite Reality is stupid enough to not to be able to store a bunch of tendencies of your relative self going from life to life (called Karma, mainly consisting out of wisdom/transcendence and compassion/love, and a lot of other imprints/tendencies/Karma) in an information bundle called "soul" on a higher dimension in Indras Net, as pretty much all above mentioned sources report? That is what reincarnates. On the relative/illusion-level, not on the absolute level. But I guess for most is the relative/illusion-level still quite "real" and "serious", like in suffering/resisting...

All of that is relative appearance, part of the illusion/manifestation. Are you free of anything that reality can throw at you on the appearance level, like totally liberated 24/7? Then you can stop caring about these matters pretty much. But even for Enlightenments-gone-sour (lets make a nice cult to satisfy the remaining needs of a halfway-up-the-moutain not really stabilized Enlightenments that expresses itself not in all dimensions of the enlightened being in an integrated and loving way) that attitude of not caring will be kick-back, this life or the next. Mostly already this life.

Anyway, this here is in the opinion of yours truly a quite smart idea:

Although my view is higher than the sky,
My respect for the cause and effect of actions is as fine as grains of flour. - Padmasambhava

But I agree the show-factor (for the spectators) of spiritual bypassing and/or not taking relative truth ("Karma/Reincarnation") serious is way higher.

 

[Soul Flight]

I think we need concepts to communicate. So we use these words to express truth as best we can. Words like heaven, hell, god, reincarnation, etc are just shortcuts and short hand of language. I feel it is progress toward truth. Christians start out with god, heaven, and hell and then move on to reincarnation and eventually god realization. The dominoes must fall in sequence in their head to get to the ultimate truth.

[Yimpa]

3 minutes ago, Soul Flight said:

I think we need concepts to communicate.

There are states of consciousness in which this is not true. It’ll be as if you’re communicating in a foreign language fluently for the first time. 

[Breakingthewall]

If you observe reality you will see that everything is evolutionary, reality copies itself, modifying itself step by step, from bosons to the human brain there are many steps.

It would be logical to think that at a metaphysical level there is a similar evolution, that the energetic patterns that constitute the essence of what we are are taken as a mold for a next pattern. How exactly we cannot know, but it seems obvious that each person is born with clear tendencies, defined patterns. It seems plausible that everything is an evolutionary movement, the cosmos moves that way. How does that affect you personally? Well, perhaps more than it seems, many talk about remembering past lives, karmic evolution, etc. We will see it in a few years, or months, or days, or minutes, when the machine stops.

[Inliytened1]

4 hours ago, Someone here said:

 

 Because what exactly the thing that reincarnates? The body? The soul? The self? The Self? The awareness? The ego? All? Some? What??? 

Because as a matter of observable fact the body decays into dust and rot alright?.. Once your physical body dies it just dissolves into it's essential elements and just evaporates in nature.. Gets diffused into the soil etc.  So that's that.  What is it exactly that reincarnates then because obviously it's not the body?  The self? There is no self "inside "the body lol !.  The body is inside the" Self".  There is no ghost inside the machine. What you really have is a machine inside the ghost lol. The self (ego) is a negative hole that appears as a consequence (byproduct) of entanglement of thoughts.. perceptions.. feelings etc. It's a misidentification really. It's a negative.. not an existing entity onto itself.  So there is no self to reincarnate.   IMO reincarnation is no different from Abrahamic religion's notions of hell and heaven.. Both have ZERO evidence!. 

As for karma as an evidence that supports reincarnation.. Well it's simply that for each up there is a down and for each action there is a reaction. You throw up a ball in the sky.. It falls down in the opposite direction taking the exact time that it took to reach the highest peak to fall from it into the ground. That's karma.   The universe is already at perfect balance. There is no need for reincarnation to achieve balance as if balance could be lost to begin with. Balance is already the case.  It's inconceivable that something unbalanced could even exist!  And if you look at it from a pantheistic worldview.. You are already living inside every creature in this planet.. So at the moment that you are beheading a chicken you are the chicken that's being beheaded and the human who is beheading it simultaneously. Karma is instant. 

Consciousness imagines itself incarnating into a physical body.  There actually is onlly Consicousness.  It is absolutely amazing.

[Thought Art]

It is simply being. Reality is Mind, Top down

[Guest Bazooka Jesus]

7 hours ago, Someone here said:

Because what exactly the thing that reincarnates?

THIS, of course.

Reincarnation is simply change of form. So, look around. Does form change? Yes or no?

 

Edited February 28 by Bazooka Jesus

[MellowEd]

9 hours ago, Bazooka Jesus said:

THIS, of course.

Reincarnation is simply change of form. So, look around. Does form change? Yes or no?

 

Who created form? 

[Guest Bazooka Jesus]

17 minutes ago, MellowEd said:

Who created form? 

Probably this guy:

[Hojo]

Consciousness respawns. You can find conciousness by contemplating this question what is going to respawn. The thing that has always been there and never aged respawns. There is a part of you that has remained consistent your entire life but its invisible.

Edited February 29 by Hojo

[Inliytened1]

 

57 minutes ago, Hojo said:

Consciousness respawns. You can find conciousness by contemplating this question what is going to respawn. The thing that has always been there and never aged respawns. There is a part of you that has remained consistent your entire life but its invisible.

Precisely.  Sadly the cost for this is the attachment God has for the form its currently in.  It is to forfeit that.  Depending on how attached God got, that could be a fuckery.    But that was precisley by intention.  And as a bonus, if you can realize you are God while in a particular form, especially one you got attached to - it is most satsifying.

Edited February 29 by Inliytened1

[Hojo]

@Inliytened1 it feel like atlas putting down the earth. You feel like you will start flying as your soul stretches.Its like someone carrying a 1000 pound backpack and the someone say why don't you just put it down. I can do that?! OH MY GOD!

Edited February 29 by Hojo

[Brandon Nankivell]

I haven't recalled past lives in this lifetime so I don't claim to know the Truth of reincarnation, my acceptance of it has been shaped however by the influence of Paramahansa Yogananda, saints of similar aptitude claiming its reality, the countless NDE experiences expressed on YouTube, and The Big Book of Reincarnation.

[nistake]

When you reflect that this world is filled with death, and that your body, too, has to be relinquished, God’s plan seems very cruel. You can’t imagine that He is merciful. But when you look at the process of death with they eye of wisdom, you see that after all it is merely a thought of God passing through a nightmare of change into blissful freedom in Him again. Saint and sinner alike are given freedom at death, to a greater or lesser degree according to merit. In the Lord’s dream astral world- the land to which souls go at death- they enjoy a freedom such as they never knew during their earthly life. So don’t pity the person who is passing through the delusion of death, for in a little while he will be free. Once he gets out of that delusion, he sees that death was not so bad at all. He realises his mortality was only a dream and rejoices that now no fire can burn him, no water can drown him; he is free and safe.

But such is the delusion of desire for material things that, after a time of freedom from the body, he wants to come back to earth. Even though the soul knows that the body is subject to disease and troubles, these delusive desires for earthly experience veil that knowledge and deceive his consciousness. So after a karmically predetermined time in the astral world, he is reborn on earth. When death comes, he goes forth once more from the gross dream of this earth experience to the finer dream of the astral plane, only to be drawn back to this world. And again and again he returns, until he is no longer desirous of an earthly life.

Birth and death are doors through which you pass from one dream to another. All you are doing is going back and forth between this gross dream world and the finer astral dream world; between these two chambers of dream nightmares and dream pleasures. Thus reincarnation is a series of dreams within a dream; man’s individual dreams within the greater dream of God.

Someone is born on earth in France as a powerful king, rules for a time, then dies. He may be reborn in India, and travel in a bullock cart into the forest to meditate. He may next find rebirth in America as a successful businessman; and when he dreams death again, reincarnate perhaps in Tibet, as a devotee of Buddha and spend his life in a lamasery. Therefore hate none and be attached to no nationality, for sometimes you are a Hindu, sometimes a Frenchman, sometimes an Englishman, or an American, or a Tibetan. What is the difference? Each existence is a dream within a dream, is it not? Will you continue helplessly to go through all these delusions and the difficulties they create? Each nation thinks its ways are justified, its customs the best. Are you going to go on with this delusion? I am not. For unless wisdom is supreme, reincarnation is a very troublesome experience. One should avoid forced reincarnation because it is a painful continuation of this dream delusion. For how long will you pass through these changes called life and death? Until you realise fully the dream nature of creation, and awaken in God from its nightmares.

Extract from the book “Divine Romance” by Sri Sri Paramahansa Yogananda.