Why Can’t Enlightened People Manipulate “Physical Reality”

[BlessedLion]

When I’m a state of God Realization it becomes apparent that all of this is your consciousness. I’m curious as to why, no matter how conscious we become, we are limited to only being able to manipulate from within our bodies and minds. Any thoughts

[Ishanga]

3 minutes ago, BlessedLion said:

When I’m a state of God Realization it becomes apparent that all of this is your consciousness. I’m curious as to why, no matter how conscious we become, we are limited to only being able to manipulate from within our bodies and minds. Any thoughts

Just because You have a feeling of Oneness within Yourself, which is the only place you can have it, in the end everything is subjective because all experience happens within You, at the sametime we are just individuals, with individual bodies and minds, that can have Enlightening experiences but there is an objective world out there, separate from our individual body/mind complex, no matter how your inner experience is, others are not having it or may never have it, so in most ways you cannot manipulate others or things outside yourself, although I have researched that this is also possible on some Guru/Master levels, like a jedi of sorts, but most ppl that realize Enlightenment also lose their individuality Body/Mind complex as well, only Guru/Master level types stay on in my understanding. So the key to it all is that our potential/possbility within ourselves and everyone is the same, if we make the fundamental experience that of Oneness/Connectedness/God Realization, then the world would be a better place, right now the opposite is true, most everyone has an experience of Separation and Division, this is due to wrong identification, they think/believe they are the body/mind which is all individualistic, not God Realization experience...

[BlessedLion]

That helps. Thanks

[Yimpa]

Bodies and minds are Pure Imagination. It takes an insane level of consciousness to realize this at ever greater depths beyond bodies/minds/humans. Just note that it’s not necessary to explore that exclusively (and neither would you want to limit yourself to that). You can continue exploring life as a human and make wonderful human advances as well.

[Yimpa]

1 hour ago, Ishanga said:

So the key to it all is that our potential/possbility within ourselves and everyone is the same

It is not. This is not a bug, this is a feature. 

God is Infinite Diversity. 

[Ishanga]

4 minutes ago, Yimpa said:

Bodies and minds are Pure Imagination. It takes an insane level of consciousness to realize this at ever greater depths beyond bodies/minds/humans. Just note that it’s not necessary to explore that exclusively (and neither would you want to limit yourself to that). You can continue exploring life as a human and make wonderful human advances as well.

I wouldn't say that bodies and minds are "Pure" Imagination, this is top level down sort of thinking and realizing, top level down is non duality teachings and Ramana and such things, where there is only one existence, one reality and only permanent things exist, everything else is considered non existence because its non permanent, but drop a brick on your foot and tell us what it feels like and if that pain is imagined lol...you won't do it because you know its going to hurt...

Edited January 7 by Ishanga

[Ishanga]

1 minute ago, Yimpa said:

It is not. This is not a bug, this is a feature. 

God is Infinite Diversity. 

God is infinite Inclusiveness, expressed via infinite forms which create diversity, its all on levels of perception and reality.

[Yimpa]

6 minutes ago, Ishanga said:

drop a brick on your foot and tell us what it feels like and if that pain is imagined lol...

Tetris Brick 

Not to be confused with TB. You don’t want that illness. Yet, you can learn a lot about yourself by understanding and eventually overcoming it.

Edited January 7 by Yimpa

[Devin]

1 hour ago, BlessedLion said:

we are limited to only being able to manipulate from within our bodies and minds. Any thoughts

You're not even able to manipulate your body and mind.

Edited January 7 by Devin

[BlueOak]

2 hours ago, BlessedLion said:

When I’m a state of God Realization it becomes apparent that all of this is your consciousness. I’m curious as to why, no matter how conscious we become, we are limited to only being able to manipulate from within our bodies and minds. Any thoughts

The way you are describing reality, you still think there is a separation of your mind/body and the rest of reality. There isn't.

Reality is created before it is visually relayed to you. People who can predict the future, are not really doing so, they are just seeing reality happen before it is visually in front of them. This is largely because things move in a predictable pattern. Its no different to a great investor understanding the stockmarket, or a sportsman pulling off the perfect reflection of his sport at the right time. They just know the pattern that is ongoing.

The concept of yourself is a pattern inside infinity. Though you can influence the pattern, most of us rarely do to any significant extent.

So what you are trying to do here, is change the result of many patterns that have already occurred. If you want to for example put someone in a different spot, why would you do that as it's happening, and the result of so many things happening to put them there? That's hard to change. Why not ask them the day before? Understanding that do you still think you are unable to manipulate events outside of the concept of yourself?

Do you think this message has no external impact, to any pattern outside the concept of yourself, or do you think it is the result of a complicated series of universal patterns that have taken place to bring it to this place? As it occurs do you think all these other representations of people here replying are affecting and being affected by it (same thing). 

What humanity often does it consider normal actions mundane, like asking someone to be somewhere a week in advance, when they are anything but mundane.

[UnbornTao]

You assume that enlightenment changes or has to change, something, which it may not.

Where else do you expect to act from? Action occurs mainly through a body. This is a relative concern.

Edited January 7 by UnbornTao

[gettoefl]

reality is but pretty smoke signals, the fire is where the juice is at, after all in the theater do you mess with the movie screen

when you're everything the movie isn't a big deal and if it is a big deal and you want to mess with it you probably have a lot of work to do

[Phoenix Garfield]

There's a reason why in Gnostic thought and circles that the Demiurge is considered to be an evil entity or at least and misguided, foolish figure.

Imagine, if you will, you were given the chance to create or manipulate physical reality from scratch and you can fulfill your wildest dreams and desires but spiritually speaking you were still a young and naïve child in your development. If you had no consideration for anyone else, any other lifeform or for the pre-existing rules in this reality of yours, it would end very, very badly for you and everyone else. You wouldn't know the can of worms you could be opening.

A lot of the early Christians and Gnostics believed this and considering what time period they came from, it makes sense.

On a side note, there's also a reason why Jains believe that when once you escape the cycle of death and reincarnation, you enter a realm where the most enlightened beings just sit, chill and watch Creation from afar, without ever needing to manipulate or touch up reality to their wishes.

Think about it this this way, we're limited with our bodies and we can only manipulate reality with our 8 fingers and 2 thumbs.

But with those fingers and thumbs, we've (humanity as a whole), has created some truly amazing and exceptional things.

This simple comic could have only been drawn by a human being, but like what Leo said about transhumanism: Man becomes God.

A cat has got your Pipe:

(a relevant video in line with this thread I promise you)

[BlueOak]

Let's give you something practical:

The more selfless you are, the more you are out of yourself. It is much easier to influence the outside world when acting in a selfless manner. For those who say it is impossible, i'll rephrase: The more you are in alignment with the universe, the easier things are. 

Here again is a good predictor giving you the universal pattern of 2024:
 

If you try to act against the current pattern, you will have more difficulty in manifesting or influencing the reality outside your self-concept.

Edited January 7 by BlueOak

[jimwell]

4 hours ago, BlessedLion said:

When I’m a state of God Realization it becomes apparent that all of this is your consciousness. I’m curious as to why, no matter how conscious we become, we are limited to only being able to manipulate from within our bodies and minds. Any thoughts

That means you were never as "conscious" as you thought.

The only way you and I will be able to manipulate existence completely is if we are unlimited or at least close to it. That's the ultimate God Consciousness - unlimited consciousness. But how can an entity with a human brain and body contain unlimited consciousness? That limited entity will explode!

[Yimpa]

Love so much you realize there’s nothing to manipulate at all

[LfcCharlie4]

Well for one because Enlightened beings know there's no such thing as physical reality in actuality lol

In all seriousness tho, some sages over the years have & many have psychic powers / intuition beyond comprehension, 'Siddhis' 

[Osaid]

Maybe your "God-realization" is false or partial? Maybe you're just imagining that you should be able to manipulate things because it is "your consciousness." How did you reach that conclusion again?

Edited January 8 by Osaid

[Breakingthewall]

8 hours ago, BlessedLion said:

When I’m a state of God Realization it becomes apparent that all of this is your consciousness.

Your implies that there is you and something that is yours, so you should be able to change that which is yours, because if not, who could? but it is not something yours, it is what you are, directly. The question is, what are you?

[Osaid]

It is very important not to get your awakenings or insights confused with enlightenment or absolute truth, because those experiences are temporary and partial. All awakenings can essentially be seen as "makyo" as it is called in Zen. They are just glimpses. Don't hold on to them. They are just something to speculate about.

Edited January 8 by Osaid