climate change answer: moving to places with reliable solar power

[Jannes]

The problem with renewable energy is that 1) it's not accessible everywhere, 2) it can't be transported over large distances yet. 

So if there are no other options couldn't the population of first world countries "just" move to global places with lots of solar power? Of course these countries have a population of their own and many of them aren't as developed. In Africa Mauritius has at least a human development index of 0.8. Australia is hot, has very little population and is has the most developed country in the world Australian Capital Territory HDI 0.98. 

[Leo Gura]

No one's moving anywhere.

[Jannes]

6 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

No one's moving anywhere.

 

Maybe. If this is a real solution and influencer do it they might start a trend and pull parts of society with them. Just like the vegan movement. Moving to another country is also adventurous. If they shape existing countries into popular ones who knows.

Or maybe countries in the future will have to pay for their environmental pollution and hot countries with los of renewable energy will be a lot cheaper. 

[Girzo]

@Jannes how my man,mit's impossible to move even 10% od population without some kind of collapse.

[Recursoinominado]

12 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

No one's moving anywhere.

Speak for yourself, i am going to the Sahara Desert.

[Jannes]

16 hours ago, Recursoinominado said:

Speak for yourself, i am going to the Sahara Desert.

Dont meme me. 

[Jannes]

 

16 hours ago, Girzo said:

@Jannes how my man,mit's impossible to move even 10% od population without some kind of collapse.

When all the cool kids go to Australia. 

 

Look it's just a possible solution. Maybe it's not realistic but maybe it will have a partial implementation because it is a real possible solution. 

Edited December 27, 2023 by Jannes

[Girzo]

@Jannes It's not possible at all. People live where they live because there is infrastructure that supports their lifestyles. And in most places in the world this infrastructure is maxed out. Moving large populations under these conditions equals war and misery.

It's easier to move energy resources or just cutdown energy use than move people closer to solar panels. Moving people just because you can mount solar panels there is, in simple words, plain stupid.

 

[Jannes]

14 minutes ago, Girzo said:

@Jannes It's not possible at all. People live where they live because there is infrastructure that supports their lifestyles. And in most places in the world this infrastructure is maxed out.

Not in Australia for example. Small population for the amount of land. Of course I am not talking about conquering land that is already taken. 

 

[Girzo]

@Jannes Shitty, worthless for everyday living land, that's true.

[Jannes]

8 hours ago, Girzo said:

@Jannes Shitty, worthless for everyday living land, that's true.

Okay perhaps I am no geographical expert. But you dont need green farmland for every place, if it's just a city wouldn't everything do as long as you have energy? Also you could turn many shitty places around. With solar parks some deserts could built savannas so not unattractive at all. Dont ask me about the mechanisms though. 

[Girzo]

@Jannes Your idea is so absurd and detached it's hard to pinpoint a place to start to unravel this craziness. Even if you don't care about farmland, you still need a shit-ton of water. And 100s of other things. 

Logistically it's crazy, you would need to move all the products needed for living to desolate areas, on ships and trucks that run on diesel, how are you going to solar-generate that?

The most important thing is, humanity is not short on electricity! If we were desperate for electricity we would be collectively building way more nuclear plants like 20 years ago. Meanwhile, Germany had been closing their nuclear plants, why? Why were they not caring about nuclear, but were very much keen on importing Russian gas before the Russia-Ukraine war? Educate yourself by thinking why the world looks like it does, and why you haven't heard about your next great idea from anywhere else. 

Edited December 28, 2023 by Girzo

[Jannes]

15 hours ago, Girzo said:

@Jannes Your idea is so absurd and detached it's hard to pinpoint a place to start to unravel this craziness. Even if you don't care about farmland, you still need a shit-ton of water. And 100s of other things. 

Like what?

15 hours ago, Girzo said:

Logistically it's crazy, you would need to move all the products needed for living to desolate areas, on ships and trucks that run on diesel, how are you going to solar-generate that?

I haven't thought about that. But most countries import and export all kinds of stuff. That wouldnt be unique to this place. It's about making local energy expenditure like for driving, cooling, light, etc. green. 

BUT with lots of energy you could potentially produce all kinds of stuff by manipulating the environment with energy. If it's too hot you could potentially built giant air conditioning and grow plants with that etc. If you lack water more energy demanding ways of getting water get accessed. Maybe that's all not profitable maybe it is, I just want to analyze the possibility. 

15 hours ago, Girzo said:

The most important thing is, humanity is not short on electricity! If we were desperate for electricity we would be collectively building way more nuclear plants like 20 years ago. Meanwhile, Germany had been closing their nuclear plants, why? Why were they not caring about nuclear, but were very much keen on importing Russian gas before the Russia-Ukraine war?

Because there was a massive worldwide shock when big nuclear power plants exploded. (Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Plant explosion march 2011)

In Germany which is very far ways kids couldn't play in sandboxes for 3 months, all kinds of mushrooms weren't eaten. There were all kinds of symptoms like higher death rate of children which were associated with atomic radiation. If one of these suckers exploded near a an important big city it would be a disaster for the health and the economy of the whole country. Nuclear power plants have two huge problems. 1) they can explode, 2) you can't properly store the nuclear waste.

It got very popular to be against all nuclear power plants. "Die Grüne" a Democratic Party in Germany were becoming very popular because they were against nuclear power plants. The thread of them becoming a big party let chancellor Angela Merkel decide to join that popular opinion so her party wouldn't loose so many votes. 

The Germany overshot with their goals though. Russian gas was a good interim solution before going all green as it is half as damaging as petroleum.

15 hours ago, Girzo said:

Educate yourself by thinking why the world looks like it does, and why you haven't heard about your next great idea from anywhere else. 

You can learn a lot by coming up with questions like these. Even if at the end it shows that there is good reason for why it doenst work, you understand why. Or maybe you actually find a new solution. It's the best from both worlds. 

[sholomar]

Now is the time to start to embrace smart nuclear technology and actually get some funding for it by governments. Wind and Solar are great, but you still need a backup source for when the wind isn't blowing and the sun isn't shining. We are overdue for this with the computing power and engineering abilities at our disposal. This outdated notion we are going to have another Chernobyl needs to be put aside.

https://www.energy.gov/ne/articles/5-fast-facts-about-spent-nuclear-fuel

 

 

Edited December 29, 2023 by sholomar

[BlueOak]

Get more countries to start selling power and water between their grids. Interconnect more countries.

The effect populations have on climate or social conditions can also be 'moved' based on how fast their transport networks are. Living in one place, working in another. Industry in one place, clean air in the other. Lessening of migration tensions. Landfill etc.

The same is more than true for power generation, which moves a lot faster than people do across boundaries, and can be stored in advance of being needed. 

I was trying to convince a person in a country bordering Iraq, that they could be making a fortune selling water to Iraq from their ocean connections. But all people would say is how expensive salt water is. Well yes, but water is worth more than gold when you don't have it. Anyone with an ocean connection should be using it. Anyone with a solar power advantage should be using it.

Just have to get the oil barons onboard. If they are selling this, they aren't fighting it as much.