This is why conscious politics is important.

[Danioover9000]

   And this much asymmetry of power from one lobby group, and how much enormous influence this lobby group, AIPAC, has on USA discourse, how they shadow banned fair criticisms of it, is part of a larger issue of lobbying itself in the American political landscape. They get away with thought terminate cliche critics and critical thinkers on the middle east and Israel/Palestinian conflict.

   Among many other problems within the American political system is why we need more conscious politics:

 

 

 

 

[DawnC]

Frankly, I don't perceive much depth in their perspective. 

Simply put, it appears that the research question they addressed was 'Why does the US have a special relationship and support for Israel?' and the answer they presented was 'because of Israel-favored lobbies.' Their answer and analysis seem a bit shallow. Those lobbies may exert influence on policy, but the support for Israel involves intricate and multifaceted interests of the US that cannot be dismissed with a mere wave of the hand. The manner in which they approach the question lacks depth and seriousness. I don't think they see the full picture here. 

Some follow-up questions I think it's important to ask:

- How and when did the Israel-U.S. special relationship form? What historical events or circumstances contributed to the establishment of this alliance?

- In what ways did they specifically address the strategic aspect of the U.S.-Israel relationship? Did their analysis recognize the alignment of strategic interests, or was the focus primarily on areas of divergence?

- How did they evaluate the significance of Israel as an ally for the U.S.? Did they seriously ask - what particular aspects make Israel special in the eyes of the U.S. regarding strategic interest?

- Did the analysis delve into the key players in global affairs, especially in the Middle East, and explore the role of Israel in this complex landscape? How did they characterize Israel's role in dealing with regional dynamics and adversaries? What are the regional alternatives in safeguarding US interest?

- How did they portray the role of the U.S. in global affairs? Did they discuss the specific part that Israel plays in this broader U.S. role? How does Israel contribute to or influence the larger framework of U.S. global engagement?

[Danioover9000]

@DawnC

43 minutes ago, DawnC said:

Frankly, I don't perceive much depth in their perspective. 

Simply put, it appears that the research question they addressed was 'Why does the US have a special relationship and support for Israel?' and the answer they presented was 'because of Israel-favored lobbies.' Their answer and analysis seem a bit shallow. Those lobbies may exert influence on policy, but the support for Israel involves intricate and multifaceted interests of the US that cannot be dismissed with a mere wave of the hand. The manner in which they approach the question lacks depth and seriousness. I don't think they see the full picture here. 

Some follow-up questions I think it's important to ask:

- How and when did the Israel-U.S. special relationship form? What historical events or circumstances contributed to the establishment of this alliance?

- In what ways did they specifically address the strategic aspect of the U.S.-Israel relationship? Did their analysis recognize the alignment of strategic interests, or was the focus primarily on areas of divergence?

- How did they evaluate the significance of Israel as an ally for the U.S.? Did they seriously ask - what particular aspects make Israel special in the eyes of the U.S. regarding strategic interest?

- Did the analysis delve into the key players in global affairs, especially in the Middle East, and explore the role of Israel in this complex landscape? How did they characterize Israel's role in dealing with regional dynamics and adversaries? What are the regional alternatives in safeguarding US interest?

- How did they portray the role of the U.S. in global affairs? Did they discuss the specific part that Israel plays in this broader U.S. role? How does Israel contribute to or influence the larger framework of U.S. global engagement?

   For sure, their analysis wasn't as deep or complex with breadth of knowledge and multifaceted aspects that contributed to this lobbying issue and the geopolitical issue, and frankly there are hundreds more videos showing examples of political corruption and other events that could've been better. My point was that we do need to take conscious politics seriously so to minimize any one lobby movement from having this much leverage of the USA government. That's basically behind the scenes overrepresentation of one minority group as the majority. No inside or outside movement should have this much disproportionate power that causes one of the most powerful countries on earth to show so much unconditional support for another country, and it can be any other country besides Israel. We should have some transparency, and move towards systems thinking and Game B more so than Game A frames, based off of game theoretic

   Same with Neoliberalism as an ideology, same with late stage capitalism, same when feminism and egalitarianism is run amok, contributing to decline in birthrates, higher divorce rates, more detached households, increases in unemployment, and so on. 

[zazen]

The problem with power as is often said is that power corrupts - but it also seems to attract the corruptible. Certain systems allow power to be checked better than others.

Here's a interesting critique of Democracy though tilting a bit conspiratorial in the end but still some good insights:
 

Example of external or internal lobby influence - old clip of Netenyah:

In the domain of political or social organizations, the challenge is when the bureaucracy and elites within them prioritize self-preservation when the issues they were established to address become rare or negligible. Once their primary objectives are mostly achieved they rarely scale down.

The survival instinct of the organization, coupled with the need to sustain a chain of salaries and relationships, distorts its incentive structure. What was once a noble (social cause) or neutral (political) endeavor becomes corrupted, as the motive extends beyond the original social or political cause to also safeguard the jobs of those benefiting from these causes.

Introducing a profit motive to a political or social cause skews the incentive structures.

Edited December 19, 2023 by zazen

[Danioover9000]

   This is quite an interesting video:

   When @Leo Gura was talking about how sick Americans would feel if they knew chunks of their tax is funneled and leveraged by A.I.P.A.C and Israel lobby groups, I didn't understand nor empathized as much, but then this video came up, and now I feel similarly, and I get it, I have some more understanding and empathy of that sick feeling, like WTF?

Edited December 22, 2023 by Danioover9000