Respectfully disagreeing with Leo about Crypto

[Dodo]

1 hour ago, FourCrossedWands said:

But you know who will eventually always have the best analysis ever... AI.

No, me hehe, NI

[bebotalk]

20 hours ago, Dodo said:

I have no idea who you're talking about, traders??  Whats egocentric about profiting from something you understand? You put the effort in it. 

If you dont profit someone else will, you want the rich to get richer? I am not a rich guy man, this is my golden goose, dont talk sh1t, you dont know how much pain i went through to know the things I do. 

Man up

 

looool.

I dunno frankly what you're so irate about. 

You tell me then what cryptocurrency is about. 

If people want to make money, let them. Provided it's honest and not hurting people or done via fraud, who gives a fuck?

It's cryptobros with their egos making the entire thing about speculation and earning a big buck. they're distorting the purpose of it, which is as an alternative currency. Their incessant "look how I won $1m on USDT, so YOU CAN TOO!" ads online are cringe and distort the meaning of it. 

Assuming i envy them, or i hate people making money.. looooool. 

I pity them, in reality. 

[Dodo]

22 hours ago, bebotalk said:

looool.

I dunno frankly what you're so irate about. 

You tell me then what cryptocurrency is about. 

If people want to make money, let them. Provided it's honest and not hurting people or done via fraud, who gives a fuck?

It's cryptobros with their egos making the entire thing about speculation and earning a big buck. they're distorting the purpose of it, which is as an alternative currency. Their incessant "look how I won $1m on USDT, so YOU CAN TOO!" ads online are cringe and distort the meaning of it. 

Assuming i envy them, or i hate people making money.. looooool. 

I pity them, in reality. 

Lol, same guys can share with u losses as well, who cares about adverts those arent real people. No one real brags about winning 1 mil, they not crazy to invite hackers to try to steal from them! Not all cryptos are meant as alternative currency, the whole system solves a myriad of problems far exceeding just being an alternative currency. 

Btw if someone won 1 mil, that means the move is probably already over so why would you be able to also win? Thats a scam. You enter when no one believes! When everyone is rekt!! Yo are the cryptobro. 

[ted73104]

On 2023/12/9 at 9:49 PM, FourCrossedWands said:

The high volatility of crypto will prevent it from ever becoming a widely accepted medium of exchange.

Bitcoin is not intended to become a currency, it will replace gold. Crypto currency like solana or XRP may become a medium of exchange and their price will stablize when they're widely adopted.

[Dodo]

9 minutes ago, ted73104 said:

Bitcoin is not intended to become a currency, it will replace gold. Crypto currency like solana or XRP may become a medium of exchange and their price will stablize when they're widely adopted.

Doge is the crypto that most resembles the dollar as it is inflationary. Ofcourse im not touching doge cause top wallet has 23 percent of supply , probably Musk, but still id rather invest in a more evenly distributed coin, for example ada top wallet has like 8 percent of supply, big difference.

Xrp is a utility token doing work in the ripple ecosystem,  i doubt it wll be medium of exchange. 

Edited December 11, 2023 by Dodo

[bebotalk]

10 hours ago, Dodo said:

Lol, same guys can share with u losses as well, who cares about adverts those arent real people. No one real brags about winning 1 mil, they not crazy to invite hackers to try to steal from them! Not all cryptos are meant as alternative currency, the whole system solves a myriad of problems far exceeding just being an alternative currency. 

Btw if someone won 1 mil, that means the move is probably already over so why would you be able to also win? Thats a scam. You enter when no one believes! When everyone is rekt!! Yo are the cryptobro. 

You're arguing for arguing sake. I don't care about their winnings. I care that they turn something intriguing for them to make a quick buck. Keep on assuming "i'm offended" at them making a quick buck. Also, learn to write in coherent pieces. You also look small when random points offend you. 

[Dodo]

28 minutes ago, bebotalk said:

You're arguing for arguing sake. I don't care about their winnings. I care that they turn something intriguing for them to make a quick buck. Keep on assuming "i'm offended" at them making a quick buck. Also, learn to write in coherent pieces. You also look small when random points offend you. 

I don't care how I look, I am tiny. I am not arguing for arguing's sake you are definitely salty with everything you've written and you are for sure jealous someone made money through crypto or it wouldn't be a talking point at all. What difference does it make to you if someone wins or not? 

The price will move, whether you are profiting from it or not, it will move all the same. It's your job to learn to trade or don't talk about others who are doing it and spent time and resources to learn it. 

Edited December 11, 2023 by Dodo

[bebotalk]

16 minutes ago, Dodo said:

I don't care how I look, I am tiny. I am not arguing for arguing's sake you are definitely salty with everything you've written and you are for sure jealous someone made money through crypto or it wouldn't be a talking point at all. What difference does it make to you if someone wins or not? 

The price will move, whether you are profiting from it or not, it will move all the same. It's your job to learn to trade or don't talk about others who are doing it and spent time and resources to learn it. 

I'm not envious at all. I'm amused you think that and have this odd "scoping" of intent. I'm saying their efforts are cringe. since it detracts rom the main purpose of crypto. I don't care what they do, i merely dislike how they want to make it. you do't even get my point. I assume you have this communication/engagement style in real life too, this odd "scoping" and assuming you "know" what others are about. Maybe you learnt this off your church or somethjing as a little boy. 

I'm entitled to my opinion. I'm sorry you lack the integrity or intelligence to comprehend what that means, or just concoct realities in your head. Very "wise" of you, after all.  You're a fucking weirdo Leave me be and let me express myself, as you do others. But then your brain cannot tolerate it, merely since your spiritual nature cannot handle it.

Edited December 11, 2023 by bebotalk

[Dodo]

21 minutes ago, bebotalk said:

I'm not envious at all. I'm amused you think that and have this odd "scoping" of intent. I'm saying their efforts are cringe. since it detracts rom the main purpose of crypto. I don't care what they do, i merely dislike how they want to make it. you do't even get my point. I assume you have this communication/engagement style in real life too, this odd "scoping" and assuming you "know" what others are about. Maybe you learnt this off your church or somethjing as a little boy. 

I'm entitled to my opinion. I'm sorry you lack the integrity or intelligence to comprehend what that means, or just concoct realities in your head. Very "wise" of you, after all.  You're a fucking weirdo Leave me be and let me express myself, as you do others. But then your brain cannot tolerate it, merely since your spiritual nature cannot handle it.

You are doing nothing other than expressing yourself, and every time I answer I am expressing myself too. We are both expressing ourselves, but you have concocted the reality where I am somehow telling you not to express yourself.

Ok, maybe I have misunderstood you, but I read the posts at face value. Whatever you've written, I have understood in the way I understood it, because of what I read. If anyone else wrote it, I would understand it the same way, it is not a personal attack, I don't know you, and you don't know me. 

Defeating stick figures is surely not my goal. You better re-read what you wrote and pretend its someone else writing it and tell me how it comes off. Maybe you have some hidden thoughts in your mind that you did not express in your post, and you expect me to be able to read them? Not today brother. 

 

Let me summarise: You come in the thread and have some beef with some cryptobros that distort what crypto is about because of their big ego and wanting to make money quickly.

Thats the stick figure right there, there are no such entities. Those who win the big money are the most patient motherfakas you will ever find. 

How exactly do you imagine making big money quickly? We just had a year and a half of bear market, who made money quickly? Nofkingbody. Now we had a pump from the start of the year and all of a sudden you come in here talking about someone making money quickly who is distorting what crypto is about - Lord Almighty!  Like hell they are, if they bought after all the dumping they deserve to fking win, and its not quick at all. And not guaranteed either. The people you are against do not exist, they are in your mind, in reality to make it big in crypto you have to be a freaking god.

-rant over 

 

Edited December 11, 2023 by Dodo

[Dodo]

Let me dispel the ignorance with the truth, i dont care about full sentences and looking big, I care about the truth 

When did the cryptobros win big quickly? When did they buy and when did they sell? Sold at 20k? Was right for a long time. Buy at 20k? Was right after that, but originally was a bad idea. So did they sell at 20k? The cryptobros? Did they sell or did they lose all their profit holding? Did they buy when it dropped or did they give up? They bought? Did they sell at 69k or lose most of their "quick profit"? if they sold, where do they buy again? 30k? Dropped to 16k, if they bought at 30k, they would've lost big time for a long time. Now price is 40k, so if you bought at 30k you're in profit, but it wasnt always like that. Where did the cryptobros buy and where did they sell, are they buying now or are they selling now. Please tell me I want to know! 

When you look at this chart you should now understand that trading is an extremely difficult task, and crypto is not a get rich quick scheme. 

Edited December 11, 2023 by Dodo

[josemar]

14 hours ago, Dodo said:

Let me dispel the ignorance with the truth, i dont care about full sentences and looking big, I care about the truth 

When did the cryptobros win big quickly? When did they buy and when did they sell? Sold at 20k? Was right for a long time. Buy at 20k? Was right after that, but originally was a bad idea. So did they sell at 20k? The cryptobros? Did they sell or did they lose all their profit holding? Did they buy when it dropped or did they give up? They bought? Did they sell at 69k or lose most of their "quick profit"? if they sold, where do they buy again? 30k? Dropped to 16k, if they bought at 30k, they would've lost big time for a long time. Now price is 40k, so if you bought at 30k you're in profit, but it wasnt always like that. Where did the cryptobros buy and where did they sell, are they buying now or are they selling now. Please tell me I want to know! 

When you look at this chart you should now understand that trading is an extremely difficult task, and crypto is not a get rich quick scheme. 

Have you heard of shorting? 

Most I made in crypto in 1 trade was by shorting the July 31k top.

Of course you can make money when price goes down, not only up.

[Dodo]

9 hours ago, josemar said:

Have you heard of shorting? 

Most I made in crypto in 1 trade was by shorting the July 31k top.

Of course you can make money when price goes down, not only up.

Yes ofcourse, but now you mention two opposing direction in which you can make money. The supposed cryptobros are " distorting what crypto is about" so I assume he means maximalist buyers. 

 

Shorting is mathematically wrong, at least for the long term, as if we ignore leverage, you are capped at 100 percent profit. On a long there is no cap. From 1 million to 0 is only a 100 percent drop, so shorting is not something i will recommend as the risk is not worth the reward, unlike the other direction.

 

Example, from 32k to 16k short u win 50 percent and now you only get scrap percentages thenlower it goes unless you open a new short from new price, which is again new risk. 

if you longed 16k, to 32k is already 100 percent and if you hold you can compound on the way up, without needing to close position and reinvest frm new price. 

Winning in both directions is a pipe dream, there are too many fakeouts for you to make the right choice at every top and every bottom, you have to pick and be a bull or a bear. That's it, and during a bear market you're not a bear, you are a bull waiting for the bear target to enter. Same in reverse for a bear. If you try catch every move you will probably lose in every direction instead, because they will manipulate you into the wrong decision even if you are right, by some scamwick. That's the big bad marketmaker. And if you are already deep in profit on a long or a short, it will deter you from taking the risk to open the opposite trade, because your current trade is already winning, so you will lose the best entries for longs (at bottoms, when bears are winning) and best entries for shorts (at tops when the bulls are winning).

 

Edited December 12, 2023 by Dodo

[josemar]

6 hours ago, Dodo said:

if we ignore leverage, you are capped at 100 percent profit.

 Why would we ignore leverage? The trading group I'm a part of has such precise entries that I'm using 50x - 75x leverage. On the short from 31k my PnL was around 1300%.

Look up "Jayson Casper" on youtube, he always shows active profitable trades, and sometimes goes through his live trade history, and most are profitable. Recently he was scalping the 5s chart of BTC using an indicator called Market Cipher (there are free versions available)

6 hours ago, Dodo said:

Winning in both directions is a pipe dream

Before making such definitive statements, do yourself a favour and learn how to trade, we call it "shlonging" when you're both long and short at the same time.

Edit: screenshot from Jayson's most recent stream today, note the profits (on one exchange, he trades on many), and both longing and shorting at the same time:

 

Edited December 13, 2023 by josemar

[Dodo]

7 hours ago, josemar said:

 Why would we ignore leverage? The trading group I'm a part of has such precise entries that I'm using 50x - 75x leverage. On the short from 31k my PnL was around 1300%.

Look up "Jayson Casper" on youtube, he always shows active profitable trades, and sometimes goes through his live trade history, and most are profitable. Recently he was scalping the 5s chart of BTC using an indicator called Market Cipher (there are free versions available)

Before making such definitive statements, do yourself a favour and learn how to trade, we call it "shlonging" when you're both long and short at the same time.

Edit: screenshot from Jayson's most recent stream today, note the profits (on one exchange, he trades on many), and both longing and shorting at the same time:

 

Thats called hedging bro, shlonging lmao....

Hedging is a tool to reduce risk, but youre winning on one, losing on the other, if you are 50 50 shlong as you say (btw ive used that term before lmao), then you might as well not have any positions its the same - you win from one lose from the other. At some point you have to say ok im shlong but i want to make money not just save my portfolio from losses.  And ive had both longs and shorts in profit, but its a real headache. And huge leverage obviously.  

I say ignore leverage to show the math. This is the reason shorts are called shorts, by all means make profit shorting if you know how, but never hold it for long, because of the math. If your 100x short is already 5000 percent profit, you are getting small fractions , less and less on every new drop. 

100x short is capped at 10000 percent,  100x long if you are on 10000 percent profit ur laughing and ready to compound. 

I am not hearing you longed tho? After your short from 31k, where is your long? If you took a long from the bottom on such leverage you would have already dwarfed your short winnings and be laughing at any bear. 

 

Ps: ur not gonna catch me out, ive been degen trader, ive been everything from 1x to 100x and a veteran in the space. 

My final verdict after trying everything is that the best leverage that maximises gains and minimises risk is the smack bang middle 10x. 10 times less scared that 1x, 10 times less greedy than 100x. 

Lfg

 

Pps: please tell me you havent learnt everything from bybit streamers who only want to push you their referral links... there are far better people to learn from. These guys taught you their degen ways... not good.

Edited December 13, 2023 by Dodo

[Dodo]

8 hours ago, josemar said:

Before making such definitive statements, do yourself a favour and learn how to trade

I take offense to that, i am the guy who from his toilet predicted the bitcoin bottom a year and a half in advance and while you were winning fractions of what you could have won shorting this pattern, because of the slow nature of bear markets, i was stayng well away from the market and waiting for the target to get reached to start buying, and buying i did. Did you? Or did the bear profits ruin you for this bull run? You were asleep? Not ready to risk?? Exactly what i meant by, you cant win in every direction. Even having these charts it was not easy. In hindsight it looks easy.

 

Edited December 13, 2023 by Dodo

[josemar]

33 minutes ago, Dodo said:

if you are 50 50 shlong as you say (btw ive used that term before lmao), then you might as well not have any positions its the same - you win from one lose from the other. At some point you have to say ok im shlong but i want to make money not just save my portfolio from losses.  And ive had both longs and shorts in profit, but its a real headache. And huge leverage obviously. 

What are you talking about? you don't use 50% of your account on one trade. If you think price action is down, and you take a short, and try to maximize profits from that one direction trade, you're missing on all the money you can make on retracements. 

Using risk management, I only risk 1% of my account per trade. If I'm only short, yes I may make 1300% on my trade (i.e. 13% of my account), but I'm missing on the small 1-5% gains possible on retracements.

37 minutes ago, Dodo said:

you win from one lose from the other

How do you lose, if both trades are in profit ?? Only when compared to an ideal trade and entry where you predict the direction of the market over many days and weeks and months. Hint: this ideal trade doesn't exist. Are we leaving money on the table by only taking profits on 75% of the trade and leaving the rest of 25% ride? I guess... But all trades are in the green, means money coming in...

In the real world, shlonging is a real psychological help, where you're not attached to where the price goes, since you're making money both ways at the same time. 

41 minutes ago, Dodo said:

but its a real headache. And huge leverage obviously.  

It doesn't work for everybody, all trades start as scalp trades, take half the trade out very quickly in profit, let the rest ride...

huge leverage, yes... leverage does NOT matter, only position size. Where leverage helps is not by gambling your full account 100x, but:

- not keeping big sums on exchanges, i.e. if I have lets say 100k account, only have ±2k on an exchange, with high leverage I have the same position size.

- use the liquidation price as the stop loss, e.g. for a 50x trade, liquidation is about 1.5%, for 75x trade, liquidation is 1%.

With technical analysis, we can predict the direction of price for at least a quick scalp in 80%+ of cases. That means that for 80% of trades, we are profitable very quickly, take half or 75% of the trade out after a 0.5-1% move, set stop loss to entry , and let it ride... that means trade in the green, money coming in.

It is maybe a more stressful way to trade, you need to be on top of the price action, and not only predict that "Ah yes I think bitcoin will go up from 16k"

48 minutes ago, Dodo said:

ive been degen trader, ive been everything from 1x to 100x and a veteran in the space. 

 

Not sure what you mean, if degenning is 100x full account on an altcoin, I don't do that. only up to 75x on bitcoin, risking 1% of my account per trade.

 

[josemar]

12 minutes ago, Dodo said:

I take offense to that, i am the guy who from his toilet predicted the bitcoin bottom a year and a half in advance and while you were winning fractions of what you could have won shorting this pattern, because of the slow nature of bear markets, i was stayng well away from the market and waiting for the target to get reached to start buying, and buying i did. Did you? Or did the bear profits ruin you for this bull run? You were asleep? Not ready to risk?? Exactly what i meant by, you cant win in every direction. Even having these charts it was not easy. In hindsight it looks easy.

 

I only started trading around March this year, had no idea about it beforehand.

Since then, I quit my IT job of 23 years at end of September, and am "full time" trading. Full time, meaning I can make the same money as my old job trading 2 days a month.

Jayson Casper is not Satto the Korean, watch at least 1 of his streams before making up your mind about him.

It's his group, but there are 3 other excellent traders in the group, each with their own trading style, each making huge gains, you have lots to learn from each one and adjust their trading to your style:

WP uses NO indicators, only Market Structure concepts.

Bojan uses exocharts

Jayson uses Market Cipher

kpax (soon to return) uses Volume principles and Exocharts.

And these are only the moderators, there are plenty of very knowledgeable users in the group.

I get it, you found a trading strategy that works for you, and that's great, but your definitive statements about anything different are jarring.

 

Edit: I understand your reticence when most trading groups are shit and charge huge money, Jayson charges only 65 USD a month, I make that in half a second.

Edited December 13, 2023 by josemar

[Dodo]

29 minutes ago, josemar said:

I only started trading around March this year, had no idea about it beforehand.

Since then, I quit my IT job of 23 years at end of September, and am "full time" trading. Full time, meaning I can make the same money as my old job trading 2 days a month.

Jayson Casper is not Satto the Korean, watch at least 1 of his streams before making up your mind about him.

It's his group, but there are 3 other excellent traders in the group, each with their own trading style, each making huge gains, you have lots to learn from each one and adjust their trading to your style:

WP uses NO indicators, only Market Structure concepts.

Bojan uses exocharts

Jayson uses Market Cipher

kpax (soon to return) uses Volume principles and Exocharts.

And these are only the moderators, there are plenty of very knowledgeable users in the group.

I get it, you found a trading strategy that works for you, and that's great, but your definitive statements about anything different are jarring.

 

Edit: I understand your reticence when most trading groups are shit and charge huge money, Jayson charges only 65 USD a month, I make that in half a second.

Brother omfg you are paying these guys?? What the heck!!

You have entered gambling zone for sure, please dont advise anyone to leave their job for trading. You dont know when you will get burnt and need something to fall back on. I know ur not telling people tom do that, but you did it. And you yourself say you are new. And you argue with me?? I have seen it all.

I use patterns, ichimoku, bollinger bands, marketmaker manipulation psychological 123 dumps / pumps (that fool average human trader in the short term), macd, fibonacci retraces and ofcourse market structure... list goes on. I surely dont need any more indicators than the ones I have already confirmed myself are the boss. 

Also I use "magic" moving averages that non of your highly esteemed gurus even know about, because I discovered them myself. 377ma with 233 offset. Just plot it on your graph and see what happens. 

I am never going to learn from someone charging money for knowledge. These guys are set because of people like you who pay them. If their ta was that amazing, why do they need Your money?? Give it for free, like I am doing with every chart i post. 

You quit your job, but they are getting steady income because of people like you, Your gurus themself did not quit their job and you give them more ammo to do their high leverage gambling, even if that is profitable in certain market conditions, that can change. 

 

 

Edited December 13, 2023 by Dodo

[josemar]

I guess you can't teach an old dog new tricks 

Peace out 

[Dodo]

@josemar i guess you and your gurus are the cryptobros  @bebotalk was talking about. I now feel ashamed for disagreeing. Thanks for coming in and showcasing the cancer of the crypto space - internet gurus who sell their holy grail trading strategies for money. 

Sign up for my affiliate link and pay me 60 quid a month, because i make so much money wih my strategy that i dont need it, but heck, let me charge anyway, right?