1 state or 2 state solution and why?

[PurpleTree]

1 state including all the people that are living in the area and many would be allowed to come back. It would be less “jewish” than now.

2 states, one jewish one palestinian. Not clear where the lines would be drawn.

[jaylimix]

The two state is a "non" solution, calling it a solution is an oxymoron.

One state under Israeli rule.

Arab children must be educated under an Israeli schools to hopefully prevent the festering of deadly believes in their minds.

Good Palestinians (doctors) should be given Israeli citizenships if they want it.

Bad ones incarcerated, exiled, and be put under terror watchlist.

For the sake of Israel's survival, they must secure both Gaza and Westbank, failure to do so means self destruction.

Imagine leaving the Westbank altogether, what would happen?

Massive amounts of weaponry and Jihadis will cross over through the Jordan river, and we shall see a fate worse than Oct 7.

More settlements, and arm them heavily.

Does Israelis lives matter more than the Palestinians?

Yes.

Do I really care about dead Palestinian children?

No.

Let me explain my position.

Zoom out and see the bigger picture.

Jihadist Savages Civilization vs Productive Democratic Civilization

If you can only choose one to survive and thrive, which one would you choose?

Muslims vs Jews

If you can only choose one, who would you choose?

[ricachica]

20 minutes ago, jaylimix said:

The two state is a "non" solution, calling it a solution is an oxymoron.

One state under Israeli rule.

Arab children must be educated under an Israeli schools to hopefully prevent the festering of deadly believes in their minds.

Good Palestinians (doctors) should be given Israeli citizenships if they want it.

Bad ones incarcerated, exiled, and be put under terror watchlist.

For the sake of Israel's survival, they must secure both Gaza and Westbank, failure to do so means self destruction.

Imagine leaving the Westbank altogether, what would happen?

Massive amounts of weaponry and Jihadis will cross over through the Jordan river, and we shall see a fate worse than Oct 7.

More settlements, and arm them heavily.

Does Israelis lives matter more than the Palestinians?

Yes.

Do I really care about dead Palestinian children?

No.

Let me explain my position.

Zoom out and see the bigger picture.

Jihadist Savages Civilization vs Productive Democratic Civilization

If you can only choose one to survive and thrive, which one would you choose?

Muslims vs Jews

If you can only choose one, who would you choose?

oof. I was hoping some of the takes on this forum would have more quality than those on a Reddit thread😮‍💨 simply choosing one is a tad bit reductionist, no?

[jaylimix]

2 hours ago, ricachica said:

oof. I was hoping some of the takes on this forum would have more quality than those on a Reddit thread😮‍💨 simply choosing one is a tad bit reductionist, no?

As the human species we came out of caves into villages with farmlands and irrigation.

Then our villages grew into towns and subsequently kingdoms.

Today we have countries.

We have suffered famines, diseases, wars.

And we learnt, we grew, we invented stuffs, we put policies in place, we created laws.

The choice is simple for me.

Savagery

or

Civilization

Put your faith in the Israelis.

They are not perfect, but they are also not evil.

[lina]

Even though it's difficult due to the US and Israeli policies, I think one state solution is the ideal one. A secular non-zionist state that supports and embraces everyone regardless of their ethnicity or religion, I think it's the only way for true integration and the final end of this conflict. Whoever doesn't like sharing the same country is free to seek refuge somewhere else. Israel killed the 2 state solution already and after all that happened some Palestinians might be satisfied with it but for others the desire for revenge might not completely dissipate. 

@jaylimixThe way you stereotype an entire population is not just offensive but it reflects ignorance and brainwashing as well.

[jaylimix]

@lina

Palestinians cannot be trusted to run a country. 

After Israel pulled out everyone of their citizens in 2005, they soon began to have a civil war.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatah–Hamas_conflict

The government of Israel made a deadly mistake which was realized 17-18 years later, on Oct 7 2023.

The Palestinians got lots of foreign aid and money, but the funds were not properly used to develop the country.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_aid_to_Palestinians#:~:text=The international community has sent,%24600 million in 2020 alone.

Both Palestinians in Gaza and Westbank had over 100,000 work permits granted to them to work in Israel but they return the favor with terrorism or the lesser evil, supports terrorism.

https://apnews.com/article/middle-east-ap-top-news-israel-blockades-0bbd46d074739dbb8b4a7083f6cd63fb

 

[lina]

The emergence of extremist groups is of Israel and western powers' own making. It's time for Israel to grow up and start taking responsibility for their actions. 

[LastThursday]

It's instructive to look at the situation in Northern Ireland. There they have power sharing between the UK and the Republic of Ireland. The power sharing is fairly unstable and there's a lot of bickering, but it's way better than the alternative was (killings, violence, bombings, terrorism). I remember the regular bombings on the UK mainland clearly. In fact there were no litter bins in major train stations for years, and even now there are clear plastic litter bags at stations.

I suspect that a one-state solution for Israel/Palestine would also need this kind of power sharing for it to be viable. Otherwise the interests of the Palestinian people would still be suppressed in favour of Israeli ideals (as they are in fact now).

A two-state solution would at least give the Palestinian people autonomy. However, in that there would be a very persistent and long lasting tension between a Palestinian state and Israeli state, which could destabilise the whole region - although that's no different to now - just look at India and Pakistan for reference.  Or maybe the solution is to have a no-go zone like in Cyprus or the two Koreas. Also, I think that any Palestinian state would need to have contiguous land for it to work properly, at the moment Gaza and the West Bank are separated. Otherwise you would constantly have the presence of Israel interposed physically. But there are many countries with exclaves, Spain or the UK for example.

[Twentyfirst]

If theres one state it should be under Palestinian authority since it's originally their land before the British split it up. It's not about whose better or not its just common sense

Would you let someone be the boss of the business you founded?

Edited November 20, 2023 by Twentyfirst

[Twentyfirst]

 

[zazen]

@Twentyfirst He's good but I feel too optimistic on the one state solution. Israel wouldn't allow it to happen , especially after whats happened. Too much distrust and bad blood. If there is a one state it wouldn't be allowed to be democratic due to Palestinians outnumbering the Israeli's.

 

 A settlement leaders reaction to a two state solution :

 

Some of her words: ''I want to have for the Jewish nation the promised land from the Bible. From the Euphrates (river in Iraq) to the Nile (in Egypt), and I'm sure it will be. Even parts of Syria, Iraq even Iran. Many people believe in it.'' 

[PurpleTree]

1 hour ago, Twentyfirst said:

If theres one state it should be under Palestinian authority

That’s a funny joke hihi

hihihi

but the sad thing is you don’t even want a realistic solution. You want to palestinians to suffer on and on

so that you can be an edgy “internet keyboard warrior che guevara”

[Twentyfirst]

2 minutes ago, zazen said:

@Twentyfirst He's good but I feel too optimistic on the one state solution. Israel wouldn't allow it to happen , especially after whats happened. Too much distrust and bad blood. If there is a one state it wouldn't be allowed to be democratic due to Palestinians outnumbering the Israeli's.

 

 A settlement leaders reaction to a two state solution :

 

Some of her words: ''I want to have for the Jewish nation the promised land from the Bible. From the Euphrates (river in Iraq) to the Nile (in Egypt), and I'm sure it will be. Even parts of Syria, Iraq even Iran. Many people believe in it.'' 

Israel wouldn't allow it to happen? As if they have choice. Remember they were beggars coming to someone else's land. It's not their decision. They would be lucky to be allowed to stay there under Palestine 

Theres too much distrust on Israel side too. Palestinians would be fools to trust them after everything they did. 

I think the Jews should just leave altogether but that wasn't the question of this thread

You think Israel is democratic and diplomatic? Really? Whats so wrong about monarchy anyways? 

Yeah that woman is literally nuts. She thinks if they conquer all those lands and kill everyone there that god will be pleased with them. Who cares what she thinks? She needs to be in a mental hospital for her own good 

[Twentyfirst]

3 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

That’s a funny joke hihi

hihihi

but the sad thing is you don’t even want a realistic solution. You want to palestinians to suffer on and on

so that you can be an edgy “internet keyboard warrior che guevara”

Why would it be under Israeli supervision? 

Read my post history if you want to know what I think

[PurpleTree]

1 minute ago, Twentyfirst said:

Why would it be under Israeli supervision? 

Read my post history if you want to know what I think

No it couldn’t it would have to be democratic with israelis and palestinians in the knesset

israelis have proven to be able to create a successful economy, country but recently it was messy because of netanyahu and his rascals

a one state solution would be interesting but also very messy because of extremists and bigots on both sides

[Twentyfirst]

2 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

No it couldn’t it would have to be democratic with israelis and palestinians in the knesset

israelis have proven to be able to create a successful economy, country but recently it was messy because of netanyahu and his rascals

a one state solution would be interesting but also very messy because of extremists and bigots on both sides

Democracy is such a joke. Especially in America

Palestinians never had a chance to create an economy 

Maybe Israel had a good economy because they had the backing of the biggest empires in the world handing them billions of dollars every year out of entitlement and corruption 

[PurpleTree]

28 minutes ago, Twentyfirst said:

Democracy is such a joke. Especially in America

Palestinians never had a chance to create an economy 

Maybe Israel had a good economy because they had the backing of the biggest empires in the world handing them billions of dollars every year out of entitlement and corruption 

Yea maybe but at some point there has to be realism and not utopianism

the jews won’t leave and they won’t let palestinians have control over them so just let that go

if there was one state then israelis and palestinians would both profit from the economy and “donations”

But yea it would be so hard to keep the country together with a democracy probably 

many democracies are struggling anyways

Edited November 20, 2023 by PurpleTree

[Twentyfirst]

3 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

Yea maybe but at some point there has to be realism and not utopianism

the jews won’t leave and they won’t let palestinians have control over them so just let that go

if there was one state then israelis and palestinians would both profit from the economy and “donations”

But yea it would be so hard to keep the country together with a democracy probably 

many democracies are struggling anyways

Seems like the Jews are a problem then. They aren't willing to compromise

[PurpleTree]

21 minutes ago, Twentyfirst said:

Seems like the Jews are a problem then. They aren't willing to compromise

Well this is the thread for solutions not bigotry though

🌞

[Twentyfirst]

2 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

Well this is the thread for solutions not bigotry though

🌞

I was replying to you

You said "the jews won’t leave and they won’t let palestinians have control over them so just let that go"

Thats a problem since they are on Palestinian land. They should not have the final say and whatever they say we all have to just swallow