Everyone, Leo i need your help, middle eastern men, jealousy , control of your partne

[omfar001]

7 hours ago, mr_engineer said:

@omfar001 Here's a cold hard reality. 

As a man, to get the respect from men in most cultures (including the West, by the way), your serious romantic partner must be a so-called 'good girl', who is fully platonic in public. Forget about cheating, forget about flirting with another guy, forget even about posting pictures. If she even wears anything sexy in public, other men will judge you. Some of them will try to steal her from you, cuz they think they can. The West/most urban areas of the world are more accepting towards women who are sexy in public, they don't judge women for not being married past a certain point anymore, it's friendlier towards women. But, the moment you decide to get into a serious relationship and start a family, all of the religious expectations come back. 

There are good and bad reasons for this perception. The good reason is that if your woman is sexual (not sexy, sexual) in public, this means that her sexual personality isn't being expressed in the relationship with you. So, this is a real chance for them to steal her from you. They may do it, she may cheat on you and you may lose her, because you weren't paying attention/your game wasn't good enough. The bad reason, of course, is that they are sexually repressed, they have religious conditioning that taboos sex and sexiness in people's personalities and all of this amounts to them seeing sexy women as a 'distraction'. They believe that sexiness in women is a net negative for society, because it's 'distracting for men', so they will judge you for not controlling her enough. And they will also tend to idolize and pedestalize the 'good girls'. These are the slut-shamers. 

I won't tell you what to do about this. I will tell you my boundaries with women and why I have them: 

• If she thinks that another guy is hot - that's totally natural and normal. It shows me what she likes/doesn't like and if I can find a way to give that to her in the relationship, we're set. And, if this makes me insecure, this is fully my problem and if I go to therapy for this, it will be on my own/I won't take her with me. 
• If she flirts with another guy - that's bad behavior. If it goes against my boundaries in some way, I will regulate that behavior in her and I will ask her why she's doing that, I will hold her accountable for it. I will help her resolve whatever it is so that it doesn't happen again. It's not a threat to the relationship, it's just problematic behavior and it should be regulated. And, if she gives me shit like 'you're so insecure, you can't take a joke here or there', that won't fly. Cuz I won't find it funny. 
• If she expresses to me that she's more attracted to another guy than she is to me/she wants him more - this is a serious issue. This will seriously break my trust in her and it will make me question the foundation of our relationship/why we got into it to begin with. This is where we go to couples-therapy and we re-evaluate the relationship-status. It's still possible to salvage the relationship, but there are no guarantees. We would be back to the dating-stage, we'd probably be 'taking a break' from each other. My mind would still be open to getting back with her, because she was honest and she didn't cheat. 
• If she cheats (in any way, shape or form, whether it was just a kiss or a full-blown side-relationship) - the relationship is done. This shows me that cheating/adultery/dishonesty is acceptable to her morality, therefore we don't morally align. This is a proof of incompatibility. (I'm gonna say 'incompatibility' cuz you may have some polyamorous fantasy in which these things are acceptable, and I don't want to shame you for that.) She needs to figure out her morality in relationships. I will wish the best for her, I will wish that she figures it out and finds someone suitable in the future. But, I will not want to trust her, it would not be rational to expect me to trust her or have any respect for her. Cuz it shows weakness of character on her part. 

Communication is key. And before that, you have to figure out where you stand on this issue. HTH. 

Hi @mr_engineer, thank you for your answer and sharing your boundries and your personal view on this i appreciate it. 

 

Regarding the answer i am not sure if i was trying control my girlfriend by telling her what to post and what to not to post because i am in competition with other men and how my society will view me if my woman was promiscuous, it can be the reason i need to contemplate that, because in my arabic culture your honor and how the society sees you is related how your woman acts, and if she is promiscuous or hanging around with other men then you don't look very good in my culture, i need to dive deeper into this and think about, thank you for bringing it to my mind. Of course even if this is the reason i do it unconsciously because on a conscious level i believe you should not care how others see you.

 

Regarding the second part of the answer that talks about cheating/being worried she likes other men and so on, i am not sure if i can relate to that because actually the girl i was with was a good person and educated and i trusted her from that side. 

 

 

 

[petar8p]

On 12. 11. 2023. at 8:55 PM, omfar001 said:

Hello everyone, leo,

 

I have been in a relationship for 2.5 years and recently we broke up, because of the unending argument about what she can wear and what she can post on Instagram and about having too close male friends. 

 

 

This problem have been bugging me my whole life. For context i am middle eastern from Egypt raised and born in Saudi arabia for about 10 years spread out between my childhood and teenage years. From 16 to 24 in Egypt and from 24 till now 28 in Germany. This context is important because i really believe a big reason of why i can't accept being with a girl that have very close male friends or wearing very revealing clothes and posting them on Instagram is because of my background that was  instilled in me. Of course i have changed alot since my early twenties and teenage years and became more tolerant with those things but still i am faaaar away from the European girl standard or the open minded and modern girl standard that she can post any pic she wants without me being upset about it or having any type of close activities with a male friend without being bothered about it. 

 

Another important context is i am not a red pill guy and i see it is bullshit,  "oh don't allow her to post revealing pics on social media or go to the club she belongs to the street and she will cheat on you" i think it's low consciousness activities and i think it's not right, another context is that i am not religious so the reason behind me being bothered by these things is not religion either.

 

 

I am aware that the way i am acting like this is related to how i brought up and how i had some insecurities of course but i believe that it's more related to culture more than the insecurity part and i also think it's not related to trust issues because mostly i very much respect and trust the girl i am with and that's why i make her my girlfriend to begin with. Maybe it can be related to control but that's back again to my culture because in my culture we were brought up to take care of the woman but also have boundaries on some of their behaviors.

 

 

I really don't know what to do about this because it caused endless problems in this relationship that just ended also i don't know if i should deal with it and try to end it or just accept the fact that i was brought up that way and look for a more compatible girl from my culture that will understand me when i tell her don't post this on Instagram.

 

 

My purpose here is the truth so if i realized that i need to get rid of that then i don't mind and to what limit do i need to get rid of it ? Should i get rid of it to the degree that i am ok with my wife or girlfriend opens an onlyfans and post her nudes online? If that's the truth and what need to be done then i am ready to accept it and get rid of it but i don't know if it is the right thing or not and that's why i am asking. 

 

 

Also for your information this is widely spread between middle eastern men and between men from other cultures that were brought up by conservative or religious families and they really suffer in today's relationships and today's world where girls like very much to dress up in different fashion styles and to post it on Instagram like the rest of her friends. And i know for a guy who was brought up in the west or in an open minded family that's not a problem at all for him.

 

 

Hope i provided enough background and information about this issue and i hope the responses can be helpful for me and other men too. Thank you.

This topic is very chaotic in replies. I will start simply. 

How was this girl behaving when you first met and decided to get into a relationship? 

Was she having close male friends and revealing pictures on Instagram? 

If yes, why did you choose is good to pursue such relationship?

[omfar001]

@petar8p i guess i didn't knew enough about myself at that time, also with time the relationship starts to get more and more serious and breaking up becomes hard. Also a part of me saw her as a good person so i didn't break up because of such a thing. So i always tried to avoid talking about this topic and i made some compromises and she made some compromises but the topic kept opening up over and over again because non of us was able to compromise too much

5 hours ago, petar8p said:

This topic is very chaotic in replies. I will start simply. 

How was this girl behaving when you first met and decided to get into a relationship? 

Was she having close male friends and revealing pictures on Instagram? 

If yes, why did you choose is good to pursue such relationship?

ch.

Edited November 14, 2023 by omfar001

[petar8p]

12 hours ago, omfar001 said:

i guess i didn't knew enough about myself at that time, also with time the relationship starts to get more and more serious and breaking up becomes hard. Also a part of me saw her as a good person so i didn't break up because of such a thing. So i always tried to avoid talking about this topic and i made some compromises and she made some compromises but the topic kept opening up over and over again because non of us was able to compromise too much

This is a learning experience. You now know what filters to make not to have this happening again. That's called "knowing about yourself." 

Congrats! Apply this to other areas by not trying to convince yourself you're ok with something you know you're not.

[omfar001]

On 11/15/2023 at 9:41 AM, petar8p said:

This is a learning experience. You now know what filters to make not to have this happening again. That's called "knowing about yourself." 

Congrats! Apply this to other areas by not trying to convince yourself you're ok with something you know you're not.

Makes sense, but yeah i am still in dilemma if i should keep that part i discovered about myself or not. If i should just look for a girl that suits my standards and criteria or i should work on changing my standards and criteria.

[Miguel1]

On 11/12/2023 at 9:55 PM, omfar001 said:

I have been in a relationship for 2.5 years and recently we broke up, because of the unending argument about what she can wear and what she can post on Instagram and about having too close male friends. 

If you had the ability to quite effortlessly and easily get a similar girlfriend or even better, how strict would your rules be?

[petar8p]

20 minutes ago, omfar001 said:

Makes sense, but yeah i am still in dilemma if i should keep that part i discovered about myself or not. If i should just look for a girl that suits my standards and criteria or i should work on changing my standards and criteria.

We cannot answer your standards and criteria. 

[omfar001]

@Migue Lonas

 

Hmmmmmm you are saying the reason that i might be controlling and protective in that way is because i find it hard to get a girlfriend and not super easy so i try to be protective and controlling to prevent the possibility of her leaving me ? ......... of course i am talking here about my subconscious mund because i don't think that way consciously.

 

 

Well it's a nice idea to consider if that what you mean thank you.

Edited November 18, 2023 by omfar001

[Princess Arabia]

7 minutes ago, omfar001 said:

@Migue Lonas

 

Hmmmmmm you are saying the reason that i might be controlling and protective in that way is because i find it hard to get a girlfriend and not super easy so i try to be protective and controlling to prevent the possibility of her leaving me ? ......... of course i am talking here about my subconscious mund because i don't think that way consciously.

 

 

Well it's a nice idea to consider if that what you mean thank you.

7 minutes ago, omfar001 said:

@Migue Lonas

 

Hmmmmmm you are saying the reason that i might be controlling and protective in that way is because i find it hard to get a girlfriend and not super easy so i try to be protective and controlling to prevent the possibility of her leaving me ? ......... of course i am talking here about my subconscious mund because i don't think that way consciously.

 

 

Well it's a nice idea to consider if that what you mean thank you.

I would even go deeper than that. That's too surface level. Ask why is that, then why is that some more till you get closer to the root.

[omfar001]

@Nabd

On 11/17/2023 at 4:46 PM, Nabd said:

I also think the same way as you do.

Well i read what you said and your point of view is what i have been growing up around since i was young, this is the conservative men point of view and i grew up in a conservative/religious society with conservative friends and family so i comprehend your opinion. 

 

 

Thank you for sharing your opinion on this, and i am still interested to hear other points of view from other wise people from other backgrounds too. My goal here is to reach the truth about this situation and end my dilemma.

Edited November 18, 2023 by omfar001

[omfar001]

@Princess Arabia

23 minutes ago, Princess Arabia said:

I would even go deeper than that. That's too surface level. Ask why is that, then why is that some more till you get closer to the root.

 well sure you are right i need to get to the root of this.

 

But i am still not sure if insecurity and scarcity of girlfriends is the reason of me being upset of her when she posts revealing pics on Instagram. I am still open to that idea and possibility, maybe i am indexed insecure and that's why i gwt upset over these things and get upset if she had a very close male friend. 

 

So i need to get sure first that this is the reason before go even deeper.

 

 

Edited November 18, 2023 by omfar001

[Princess Arabia]

9 minutes ago, omfar001 said:

@Princess Arabia

 well sure you are right i need to get to the root of this.

 

But i am still not sure if insecurity and scarcity of girlfriends is the reason of me being upset of her when she posts revealing pics on Instagram. I am still open to that idea and possibility, maybe i am indexed insecure and that's why i gwt upset over these things and get upset if she had a very close male friend. 

 

So i need to get sure first that this is the reason before go even deeper.

 

 

Yes, but no need to go deeper after surety because, then that would be the reason. Digging deeper to any cause or symptoms can lead you to the real reason which could be insecurities. Then you have to go deeper as to why you're insecure. 

So to wait to be sure that's the reason is defeating the purpose of going deeper because any reason can be revealed during the inquiry. 

The only thing I would suggest if you decide to take on this challenge of going deeper is to stick to you and not make it about the other person. E.g don't say it's because.of so and so why I'm so and so. And always remember you can always change how you would like to be besides how you were raised and your cultural practices. Seems like you're aware so that's half the battle done. 

Edited November 18, 2023 by Princess Arabia

[Twentyfirst]

It's CRAZY how much happier middle eastern women are than western. Of course everyone will get mad at this and deny it hahahahaha