Observing vs thought

[Tistepiste]

Dear,

Recently I was attending a Vipassana retreat. It brought me deeper in my spirituality than I ever was before. I witnessed very deep and profound insights and states of being.

However, on the last day of the retreat, we were allowed to talk, and one of these guys started talking to me, and he made me very confused. And since then it has been bugging me during my meditation. So I want to ask a question about it to help clear my mind.e

He was asking me about my meditation technique. I told him I was observing my bodily sensations. He then asked, what do you mean "observe"

I said "just.. observe.."

He looked at me with an empty stare as if he was unable to grasp what I was saying.

He then said "but you can't just observe, you're thinking"

I got very confused..

He went on to say "you're thinking: "I observe" which is a thought. I think you misunderstood the meditation. It's impossible not to think. It is about not judging what your thoughts are, but you're always thinking"

It became like a very strange conversation of yes / no and I didn't want to go on with him because I felt like it was going nowhere and I certainly wasn't into having a discussion with him.

He ended the conversation with "the greatest meditation teachers are even saying that you can't stop thinking"

This really annoyed me, because the whole way I understood Anna panna meditation, is about increasing your focus and awareness. Sit in stillness and keep your mind as focussed and sharp as possible, whenever you go into thought, you realize this, and you again regain your focus.

By doing this, your mind becomes sharper and clearer, less thought and more clarity.

Going on to Vipassana you maintain that practice during the body scan, and observe the sensations as free of thought as possible. Whenever a thought arises, you let it be.

Now everytime I meditate this guy comes up in my mind and is telling me how no thought is not possible and I get into this paradoxical circle of whenever I reach clarity of mind it is obstructed by this voice in my head that is trying to tell me the opposite of what I am doing.

 

So I'm here to ask: it is not "strange" to to be observing (or at least try to) without thought, right?

[Osaid]

It is possible to observe without thought, yes, absolutely.

But, the statement "I observed a thought" is a thought/communication, and it is not the experience that occured. So that is just the limitation of language and communication itself, which should not be confused for the actual experience itself.

The confusion on his part seems to be that he is looking at the statement and seeing it as something that is a completely true representation of what happened. He himself identifies with that thought, so his conclusion is that thought is inescapable, which is not the case.

But also, a lack of thoughts does not really bring clarity. It's how you perceive the thoughts, and yourself as a whole.

Edited October 15, 2023 by Osaid