Palestine/Israel war - What can we do to stop this genocide?

[lina]

https://news.yahoo.com/israeli-president-says-no-innocent-154330724.html

Israeli President Suggests That Civilians In Gaza Are Legitimate Targets

Where is the international community to stop this madness?

Edited October 14, 2023 by lina

[lina]

4 hours ago, zazen said:

Interesting take on a possible solution

But does the rhetoric match the reasoning. 

it is interesting thank you for sharing this. 

Edited October 14, 2023 by lina

[zazen]

@ExplorerMystic @Breakingthewall As explorermystic mentions there is a spiritual aspect of Islam called Sufism just like Judaism has Kabbalism and Christianity has Gnosticism.

 

All religions have a spiritual core essence that gets corrupted by the establishment created around it.

 

It’s the simple minded that aren’t able to interpret the finer details and depths of religious texts, that renders them dangerous in certain hands and minds.

 

Rationality and scientism killed the romantic age and the spirituality that came with it the same way Islamic Wahhabism killed the Sufism aspect of Islam. The below two videos shed light on them.

 

[Hardkill]

9 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You can't really give "freedom" and democracy to a pre enlightenment-era culture because freedom and democracy do not exist at that level of development.

It's the same problem as giving freedom and democracy in Iraq. Or giving feminism in Afghanistan. Liberals make the deadly mistake of assuming everyone is equal when they aren't.

Freedom and democracy can only exist once the citizens are evolved enough not to elect folks like Hamas. As soon as they elect something like Hamas, all the freedom goes down the toilet. True freedom requires tolerance and respect for alternative perspectives and lifestyles to your own. Which these Islamists are incapable of. Freedom requires racial and religious tolerance, which only arises at stage Orange and above.

Even if freedom and democracy can't work in a primitive country like Iran, Iraq, or Afghanistan isn't there some way to keep the power of a leader of such a country in check by other parts of the government? All leaders should be held accountable, regardless of what country they are in charge of, right?

[Karmadhi]

16 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

It's not so surprising. The Japanese had to do an unconditional surrender in WW2. So did the Germans. The Palestinians are entering an unconditonal surrender situation.

Imagine what the US would have done if Japanese kept up doing terror attacks. We would have nuked more cities

The difference is that first of all that was 80 years ago. Back then carpet bombing civilians with Napalm was acceptable. Today is considered a war crime.

Secondly Japan had bullied and terrorized Asia for 15 years and killed millions and also had attacked the USA even though USA did not take any of Japan's land nor kill its civilians. Hamas is a byproduct of Israel actions towards Palestine, it is Israel that is responsible for creating them. 

The fundamental issue with Israel is that it is a Zionist state with a toxic ideology that says that Jews are superior and chosen by God. This makes them extremly entitled and ruthless in their actions. The current Israel government is Zionist which are the modern day equivalent of Nazis with their superior race bullshit. I know people that went there and told me the amount of brainwashing Israelis go through from childhood is insane. They are just as radicalized and brainwashed as most regimes that commit attrocities through history.

USA supports them because Jews have influence in the West and they want to weaken the Arabs and control their oil, not because Israel is more "developed". They also support Saudi Arabia that behead people in mass execution's. Dont act like USA gives a single shit about "development" of a society.... It is pure interest.

Edited October 14, 2023 by Karmadhi

[Danioover9000]

   Based take:

 

[PurpleTree]

5 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

The current Israel government is Zionist which are the modern day equivalent of Nazis with their superior race bullshit. 

 

You could also say islamists are the modern day equivalent of nazis with their suppression if women, lgbt, other faiths etc.

why even bring the nazi comparison?

[Danioover9000]

@nuwu

45 minutes ago, nuwu said:

@Danioover9000 Social structures have no need for races, countries, identities, or cultural categories, but perspective networks depend on inherent distinctions to sustain themselves. It's unclear what would be the best state, even game B would merely push selections to deeper layers. 

More countries are getting involved and prospect of peace may dim. I don't like this situation. 

@Karmadhi Please don't equate collective narcissism with nazism, even if latter is notable in this regard. Most, if not all cultures have their own self-reinforcing value systems and strategies securing the scarce resource on this flimsy planet.

   So what argument are you making for?

[Karmadhi]

4 hours ago, PurpleTree said:

ou could also say islamists are the modern day equivalent of nazis with their suppression if women, lgbt, other faiths etc

The difference is that Islam is not wiping out women like Israel is wiping out Palestinians. Islam is quite respectful to women in many ways, they just have strict gender roles. Women in Islam for example do not need to provide for the family. You just see the cartoon version of Islam where they portray Islam as a woman abuser. I know because I used to think the same until I did some actual research about it.

Regarding LGBT firstly they are too little proportion of population to even be relevant and secondly Islam allows them to be clear as long as they change their ways and try to act normal. I dont think most people are naturally gay, a lot is influenced by LGBT propaganda. Israel meanwhile does not give Palestinians the chance to get humane treatment, you cannot become a Zionist.

Also if you actually see most Islam societies they do function quite ok and they are growing. I do not see genocide nor ethnic cleansing of other religions the same way that Israel does Palestininas. Nor stealing land.

 

Edited October 14, 2023 by Karmadhi

[Karmadhi]

2 hours ago, nuwu said:

Assuming this is true, please don't equate collective narcissism with nazism, even if latter is notable in this regard.

I compare a religion called Zionism which states "we are people chosen by God" and nazi ideology which states "our race is superior to all other races".

I do not see much differences here in the ideology itself.

 

[PurpleTree]

8 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

The difference is that Islam is not wiping out women like Israel is wiping out Palestinians. Islam is quite respectful to women in many ways, they just have strict gender roles. Women in Islam for example do not need to provide for the family. You just see the cartoon version of Islam where they portray Islam as a woman abuser. I know because I used to think the same until I did some actual research about it.

Regarding LGBT firstly they are too little proportion of population to even be relevant and secondly Islam allows them to be clear as long as they change their ways and try to act normal. I dont think most people are naturally gay, a lot is influenced by LGBT propaganda. Israel meanwhile does not give Palestinians the chance to get humane treatment, you cannot become a Zionist.

Also if you actually see most Islam societies they do function quite ok and they are growing. I do not see genocide nor ethnic cleansing of other religions the same way that Israel does Palestininas. Nor stealing land.

 

Notice how i wrote islamists and not islam. also about the women thing, have you followed the recent events in iran of women not wanting to wear headscarf etc? 

[Karmadhi]

23 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

Notice how i wrote islamists and not islam. also about the women thing, have you followed the recent events in iran of women not wanting to wear headscarf etc? 

That is 1 country which already has issues. Look around in Arab countries not just Iran.

[Danioover9000]

@Karmadhi

5 hours ago, Karmadhi said:

The difference is that first of all that was 80 years ago. Back then carpet bombing civilians with Napalm was acceptable. Today is considered a war crime.

Secondly Japan had bullied and terrorized Asia for 15 years and killed millions and also had attacked the USA even though USA did not take any of Japan's land nor kill its civilians. Hamas is a byproduct of Israel actions towards Palestine, it is Israel that is responsible for creating them. 

The fundamental issue with Israel is that it is a Zionist state with a toxic ideology that says that Jews are superior and chosen by God. This makes them extremly entitled and ruthless in their actions. The current Israel government is Zionist which are the modern day equivalent of Nazis with their superior race bullshit. I know people that went there and told me the amount of brainwashing Israelis go through from childhood is insane. They are just as radicalized and brainwashed as most regimes that commit attrocities through history.

USA supports them because Jews have influence in the West and they want to weaken the Arabs and control their oil, not because Israel is more "developed". They also support Saudi Arabia that behead people in mass execution's. Dont act like USA gives a single shit about "development" of a society.... It is pure interest.

   Important clarification on Japan and Pearl Harbour attack: the USA was imposing an economic sanction on Japan because of it's alliance with Nazi Germany, and America and other European countries refuse to acknowledge Japan's hegemony. America was witb it's Neoliberalism interests had put Japan into a situation where it had to do or die, the economic sanction was Japan's existential threat. Similarly to the Russian and Ukriane war, Ukraine is the west's fault.

 

[PurpleTree]

42 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

That is 1 country which already has issues. Look around in Arab countries not just Iran.

Saudi Arabia and also Islamists in pakistan, afghanistan, syria, palestine, iraq etc

islamist attacks in europe on civilians, party people etc

[Karmadhi]

22 minutes ago, Danioover9000 said:

Important clarification on Japan and Pearl Harbour attack: the USA was imposing an economic sanction on Japan because of it's alliance with Nazi Germany, and America and other European countries refuse to acknowledge Japan's hegemony. America was witb it's Neoliberalism interests had put Japan into a situation where it had to do or die, the economic sanction was Japan's existential threat.

That is because Japan was invading Asia and killing millions under a racist supremacist ideology. It was well deserved. I did not see Palestine kill millions, it was peacefully existing minding its own business. Japan was not and hence was sanctioned. It was creating an empire. 

[Karmadhi]

18 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

Saudi Arabia and also Islamists in pakistan, afghanistan, syria, palestine, iraq etc

islamist attacks in europe on civilians, party people et

That is a very small percentage of crazy radicals, not everyone. Most Islamists oppose terrorist attacks and abuse of women. Go talk to some.

[PurpleTree]

2 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

That is a very small percentage of crazy radicals, not everyone. Most Islamists oppose terrorist attacks and abuse of women. Go talk to some.

Death threats for caricaturists in erurope etc. etc etc 

you brought up the nazi comparison, i‘m just saying islamists could also be called horrible/nazis/fascists/islamofascists etc

i think hardliner zionists are also horrible

 

[Danioover9000]

@Karmadhi

10 hours ago, Karmadhi said:

That is because Japan was invading Asia and killing millions under a racist supremacist ideology. It was well deserved. I did not see Palestine kill millions, it was peacefully existing minding its own business. Japan was not and hence was sanctioned. It was creating an empire. 

   No, not under a 'racist supremacist ideology', but under imperialism and nationalism, and not well deserved. In fact, Japan's expansionism was fueled by demand as Japan was mining iron and importing/exporting iron within it's geographical region, until it had to outsource and seek other iron resources outside it's region, however, again due to WW2 and Japan's alliance with Germany, America blocked imports of iron from Japan which accelerated Japan's need to expand beyond it's country, to invade and occupy other Asian countries and gain more natural resources. So really, if any country is well deserved because Japan was invading and killing millions, which is a moral argument, you have to be prepared to also condemn America and it's allies in the West, as well as other countries in the East with a higher kill count than Japan right? Because again, if you're being honest with yourself, what made Japan expand was partly the West's allies fault of not acknowledging Japan as a competitive hegemon and including it into it's own growing western economy.  

   Not only was it due to other developmental factors like stages of development, cognitive and moral development, personality types/traits, ego development, Integral Theory and other lines of development, ideological beliefs indoctrinated by culture, family upbringing, social gatherings, news sources, propaganda, ideological warfare, and other factors via manufactured consent that influences one's self biases and preferences, but the other metrics of geography, biosphere, hydrosphere and atmosphere is what also determines the potential and actual growth of a country. If you are willing to look at Japan in terms of geography and other natural resources it has, and the political and global situations, the world history at the time of WW2, you'll understand why Japan had to expand, and you'll probably be less condemning of Japan from that understanding and empathy. In fact it's really complicated and how Japan's culture is is what and why it unfolded in history as it should be.

[An young being]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.indiatoday.in/amp/world/story/israel-palestine-conflict-how-chhitmahal-can-inspire-a-west-bank-solution-2448226-2023-10-13

[Sabth]

https://www.instagram.com/p/CyWZOuzLMCd/?igshid=MWlnaXdxcTY1aHg4eQ==

How does it feel like to be in a rubble.