Posted October 16, 2023 @lina This is a very complex situation. Israel must put pressure on hamas to return the captives. Yes, there is a cost to that in humen lives in gaza but look how hard the situation is. Also think about how hamas is brutal to gaza's civilians in day to day life and the poverty they live in anyway because of hamas. In order to the long term to be better even for gaza's civilians, they are costs to pay in the short run. 🌻 Thinking independently about the spiral stages themselves is important for going through them in an organic, efficient way. If you stick to an external idea about how a stage should be you lose touch with its real self customized process trying to happen inside you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 @Leo Gura 16 hours ago, Leo Gura said: But there is the question of how to go about reaching those goals. Going on a wild rampage is going to be counter-productive to Israel and the US. It has to be done carefully, with moderation. Hamas has to be destroyed but with minimal damage to innocents and I want to believe Israel do its best. 🌻 Thinking independently about the spiral stages themselves is important for going through them in an organic, efficient way. If you stick to an external idea about how a stage should be you lose touch with its real self customized process trying to happen inside you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 Is it possible to destroy hamas? They probably have the best means to flee from all the palestinians. And they can just recruit new people. After this war i‘m sure many are willing to sign up and fight israel. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 (edited) @Nivsch no justifications for war crimes. please watch the video that I shared https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNqilIwiqAM&ab_channel=DoubleDownNe Edited October 16, 2023 by lina Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, lina said: @Nivsch no justifications for war crimes. please watch the video that I shared https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNqilIwiqAM&ab_channel=DoubleDownNe I saw it now. There is problems with the settlements in the west bank and I have a lot of criticism on the right-wing actions. Still, the person in this video is highly biased. I lost him after he said "This even more severe than what hamas did" and "Israel is deliberately target civilans" which is a 100% biased low quality unnuanced crap. Edited October 16, 2023 by Nivsch 🌻 Thinking independently about the spiral stages themselves is important for going through them in an organic, efficient way. If you stick to an external idea about how a stage should be you lose touch with its real self customized process trying to happen inside you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 39 minutes ago, Nivsch said: Hamas installed traps all over gaza to wait for israeli soldiers. without destroying buildings, hundreds of Israeli soldiers will die for nothing. Remind you that there are NO civilians in those buildings after IDF asked them to live. Please take this perspective also into accout and don't be so biased. I’m not being biased. it was horrific what hamas did in Israel. So sad and revolting. But collective punishment is a war crime. Israel is doing that by cutting electricity, water, food, and blocking aid from entering the Gaza Strip. Giving 1 million people 24 hours to vacate the north or face potential annihilation is a joke. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 15 hours ago, Alex M said: I've been hearing a lot of talk about the history of this conflict and the Israelis' land grabbing from the Palestinians. It was interesting to listen to the history side of things from an Israeli perspective. That's really an amazing video, thanks for sharing Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 4 minutes ago, Nivsch said: I lost him after he said "This even more severe than what hamas did" and "Israel is deliberately target civilans" which is a 100% biased low quality unnuanced crap. That's not unbiased that is factually true. The deaths caused by the IDF is so much more than any deaths caused by Hamas. The Israeli president himself suggested that civilians are legitimate targets. Even if such quotes are exaggerated , the prevention of aid, mass deaths of civilians and the shooting of peaceful protestors on multiple occasions both in Gaza and the west bank has no other interpretation than that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 8 minutes ago, lina said: That's not unbiased that is factually true. The deaths caused by the IDF is so much more than any deaths caused by Hamas. The Israeli president himself suggested that civilians are legitimate targets. Even if such quotes are exaggerated , the prevention of aid, mass deaths of civilians and the shooting of peaceful protestors on multiple occasions both in Gaza and the west bank has no other interpretation than that. Are you muslim or palestinian btw? You don‘t have to answer if you don’t want. But i like to guess. It’s also not very important Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 Being a Sunni Muslim, I find that videos like these reminds me that there are individuals worldwide who seek the truth. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 "Never be afraid to sit a while and think.” ― Lorraine Hansberry Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 @lina send me a link to where bibi says he target civilians and than we can talk. 🌻 Thinking independently about the spiral stages themselves is important for going through them in an organic, efficient way. If you stick to an external idea about how a stage should be you lose touch with its real self customized process trying to happen inside you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 7 minutes ago, Lila9 said: So israel is never to blame for anything? That‘s also not realistic sorry. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 Palestinians have to get rid of hamas and islamists israelis have to get rid of right wing nuts and hardliner zionists and we can have peace Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 48 minutes ago, PurpleTree said: So israel is never to blame for anything? That‘s also not realistic sorry. You are invited to do your own research, I've done mine and according to my research, this information is accurate. There is a reason that Israeli army is called Israel Defense Forces, IDF, and history shows that Israel is the one who gets attacked and very rarely attacks first. Hamas is an Islamic Resistance movement, who is sworn to Israel's destruction and wants to replace it with an Islamic state, and history shows that they believe in initiating attacks on Israel in order to make their ideology come true, even at the expense of Palestinians lives. "Never be afraid to sit a while and think.” ― Lorraine Hansberry Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 16 minutes ago, Lila9 said: You are invited to do your own research, I've done mine and according to my research, this information is accurate. There is a reason that Israeli army is called Israel Defense Forces, IDF, and history shows that Israel is the one who gets attacked and very rarely attacks first. Hamas is an Islamic Resistance movement, who is sworn to Israel's destruction and wants to replace it with an Islamic state, and history shows that they believe in initiating attacks on Israel in order to make their ideology come true, even at the expense of Palestinians lives. And what about the settlers, they aren‘t a problem? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 https://decolonizepalestine.com/myths/ أشهد أن لا إله إلا الله وأشهد أن ليو رسول الله Translation: I bear witness that there is no God but Allah, and Leo [Gura] is the messenger of Allah. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 (edited) 42 minutes ago, Lila9 said: There is a reason that Israeli army is called Israel Defense Forces, IDF, and history shows that Israel is the one who gets attacked and very rarely attacks first. Yes, but the Palestinians could say that they have to attack to prevent Israel's expansion. Israel does not attack, it expands, and that for the Palestinians is an attack. The solution begins by dismantling the colonies in the West Bank. If they did that, they would have the morality in their side, but as long as they continue to spread in the West Bank and vote for governments that have expansion in their program, Palestinian terrorism is morally justified as their only defense for all the Muslims and many of westerns. Edited October 16, 2023 by Breakingthewall Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted October 16, 2023 3 hours ago, PurpleTree said: Is it possible to destroy hamas? They probably have the best means to flee from all the palestinians. And they can just recruit new people. After this war i‘m sure many are willing to sign up and fight israel. I guess the same could be said for many of the now defunct islamic militant organisations. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
