Posted February 6 (edited) 34 minutes ago, Danioover9000 said: @Vrubel Technically the PLO/Palestine was formed by the KGB from Russia Do you mean the PLO? This can explain many things, and not for good (if this is true). Can you add a link that shows that? Edited February 6 by Nivsch 🌻 Thinking independently about the spiral stages themselves is important for going through them in an organic, efficient way. If you stick to an external idea about how a stage should be you lose touch with its real self customized process trying to happen inside you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 7 (edited) 7 hours ago, Vrubel said: In that same war, many Palestinians fled and were not allowed to return, so for them it's the Nakba. 20.000 of them were killed in massacres and hundreds of villages burned down. They were kicked out and killed. Watch some interviews with actual soldiers at the time before spinning out propaganda. Saying they simply "fled" ignores Israeli ruthless war crimes and ethnic cleansing. Ironically Hamas attacked the same villages (land wise) that Israel burned down during the Nakba and then later established their own kibutzes. These things do not happen randomly. I find it weird that you are against Russia taking Ukranian land that does not belong to Russia but find it ok when Israel takes Palestinian land that does not belong to them by doing ethnic cleansing. Double standards much. And I am not talking about politics and "soverign country" stuff. I am talking about kicking out people that lived in X place since forever. I read some of your posts and you seem to have a somewhat racist attitude toward Palestinians. You do not seem them as equal to Israelis fundamentally. Dont you think most Palestinians are decent normal people like most people in the world are? Personally I do not see much difference between most Palestinians and Israelis on a fundamental level. Edited February 7 by Karmadhi Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 7 https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2024/02/shocking-spike-in-use-of-unlawful-lethal-force-by-israeli-forces-against-palestinians-in-the-occupied-west-bank/ No Hamas there either. When will you guys realize Israel brutality is not due to "Hamas". Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 7 (edited) 2 hours ago, Karmadhi said: https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2024/02/shocking-spike-in-use-of-unlawful-lethal-force-by-israeli-forces-against-palestinians-in-the-occupied-west-bank/ No Hamas there either. When will you guys realize Israel brutality is not due to "Hamas". Every hamas terrorist is also a "killed palestinian" and 18 yo terrorists are a "palestinians children". I am done particiapting in the world naiveness towards the palestinians reports which cannot be relied. Thousands of hamas terrorists were arrested in West Bank since oct 7th this is already well known. Probably many of them eliminated during the operations I can guess. This is not to say there aren't at all killed civilians in the west bank and one of a time there is indeed such an isolated incident and I am not denying that. But if there are since oct 7th, they are for sure much much less than mentioned in this article. Edited February 7 by Nivsch 🌻 Thinking independently about the spiral stages themselves is important for going through them in an organic, efficient way. If you stick to an external idea about how a stage should be you lose touch with its real self customized process trying to happen inside you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 7 (edited) @Karmadhi The West Bank is full of hamas terrorists with which Israel manages a low-intensity war since 2002, and co operates with PLO forces against them. Edited February 7 by Nivsch 🌻 Thinking independently about the spiral stages themselves is important for going through them in an organic, efficient way. If you stick to an external idea about how a stage should be you lose touch with its real self customized process trying to happen inside you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 7 Book of Genesis outlines the roots of this conflict whereas the Book of Revelation describes how it ends. So, you can either read them beforehand and watch prophesy play out in real-time on television, or you can read them afterwards and see how predictable it all was. Either way, you'll be astonished. ...enjoy the Great Deception! 👽=😈 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 7 Before we start this interview....Do you condemn OSHO? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 7 (edited) 23 hours ago, Karmadhi said: I read some of your posts and you seem to have a somewhat racist attitude toward Palestinians. You do not seem them as equal to Israelis fundamentally. Dont you think most Palestinians are decent normal people like most people in the world are? Personally I do not see much difference between most Palestinians and Israelis on a fundamental level. I criticized their culture, their atrocities, cheering and total disregard for any honorable principle let alone moral principles. I mean how bankrupt is your culture if you celebrate people who consciously kill innocent civilians as heroes? I am not being racist ...and sure it's important not to dehumanize and to still see nuance but what I said is undeniably true. You can also criticize Israeli/Jewish culture without being anti-Semitic. However in my eyes, Israeli culture is way more respectable as they put value on cutting-edge science, technology, democracy, liberalism and genuine patriotism where people look out for each other and their country. Why don't the Uighurs or Rohingya behave like the Palestinians? Simple, because if they did they would get genocided and the world wouldn't bat an eye. If there was a real threat of genocide for Palestinians, they would never have attacked and started this war. 23 hours ago, Karmadhi said: I find it weird that you are against Russia taking Ukranian land that does not belong to Russia but find it ok when Israel takes Palestinian land that does not belong to them by doing ethnic cleansing. Well, strictly speaking, it's not about land for me. When Russia took over Crimea without spilling blood, I wasn't really that passionate about it. And it kinda kept my innocence intact that bloody wars in Europe is a thing of the past. I just HATE that Russia started this war and brings so much suffering to both Ukrainians (first and foremost) but also Russians. Both peoples I respect but It's not to be underestimated how extremely vicious and ugly Putin's system of governance is. Just look at how Russian propaganda is built on such blatant and unashamed lies. They are not fighting for a legitimate "understandable" cause, if they did they wouldn't depend on blatant lies so much. What will they achieve? A strip of Ukrainian land and an otherwise chill and friendly brotherly nation that now despises them. I know Israel also does propaganda but at least they do it with facts and reasonable points. Also, much of Israeli propaganda is dispelling all kinds of demonizing myths about them. A hallmark of Russian propaganda is demonizing Ukrainians as Neo-Nazis. I actually used to think that Ukraine was to some degree a kind of extreme nazi sympathizing country. Though when I went there I discovered I was being lied to. I felt ashamed. Ukrainians were some of the most chill, fairly liberal, Europe-oriented and least anti-Semitic people on the planet. In many ways Israelis are being demonized in the same way as Ukrainians are by the Russians. But Ironicly I sympathize with both Ukrainians and Russians for different reasons. Well.. with Ukrainians for obvious reasons because they now must heroically defend their land and civilization against a regressive invader. But I also sympathize with Russians because they also get now a lot of hate and are being forced to be more closed off. And there really is something genuinely pure and soulful about Russian culture that Westerners will never understand. Edited February 8 by Vrubel Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 8 Many people like to distinguish between the Palestinians and Hamas but in fact Hamas was elected by almost 50% of the Palestinians. Obviously they made the wrong choice. The easiest thing in life is to play the victim and blame someone else. Guess what? It’s a trap. When you complain about someone else and don’t take responsibility you can never make a change. Each one of us can learn a lot about wars. Hamas members beat civilians, steal humanitarian aid. Source: https://m.economictimes.com/news/international/world-news/hamas-members-beat-civilians-steal-humanitarian-aid-received-from-intl-organisations-israel-defence-forces/amp_articleshow/105870965.cms Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 8 (edited) 1 hour ago, Vrubel said: criticized their culture, their atrocities, cheering and total disregard for any honorable principle let alone moral principles. I mean how bankrupt is your culture if you celebrate people who consciously kill innocent civilians as heroes? Like Israelis don't do that. They also celebrate Gaza butchers. One of their elected ministers had a portrait in his house of a mass murderer and was a convicted terrorist. So Israelis are not above this either. How will you justify this? Where is your criticism of Israel here? They lost 800 civilians and now cheer kids dying in Gaza. Meanwhile Palestinians have suffered far far far more than Israelis have and they are supposed to be chill about it? Be realistic. I even seen Ukranians cheer when Ukraine bombed Russian civilians 1 month ago. Many Ukranians i see in comment want to see Russia cities turned to ash. When you suffer unjustly you loose humanity. It is not a matter of culture. I think you underestimate the amount of suffering Palestinians have collectively suffered from Israelis that is why you speak like this. Educate yourself about it. Hamas attack is a drop in the ocean in comparison. It is not that Palestine as a culture is as under developed as you make it. Israeli atrocities are far worse in scale and length. This has been going on for decades. Ignoring this makes you not see the full picture. 1 hour ago, Vrubel said: It's not to be underestimated how extremely vicious and ugly Putin's system of governance is. Just look at how Russian propaganda is built on such blatant and unashamed lies. They are not fighting for a legitimate "understandable" cause, if they did they wouldn't depend on blatant lies so much. What will they achieve? A strip of Ukrainian land and an otherwise chill and friendly brotherly nation that now despises them. Fair. Why are they doing it? I like to believe they geniounly see NATO as a threat and want to protect their country's interest. However, I am just speculating. Your opinion on it would be welcomed. 1 hour ago, Vrubel said: I know Israel also does propaganda but at least they do it with facts and reasonable points It is more subtle and clever. More manipulative. Not pure horseshit. But still pure devilry. 1 hour ago, Vrubel said: A hallmark of Russian propaganda is demonizing Ukrainians as Neo-Nazis. I actually used to think that Ukraine was to some degree a kind of extreme nazi sympathizing country I think that is bs propaganda from Russia, Ukranians are clearly not "Nazis"; but from what I saw their current government is quite anti Russian. I think Putin wanted to change that government with a pro Russian one, not annex the country like people claim. Basically he wanted to make Ukraine another Georgia or Belarus. Basically if you are next to Russia you have to be Russia's lap dog when it comes to foreign policy. But you can keep your internal sovereignty. Issue is that America does the same, so it is hard for me to criticize much Russia about it. I mean they did a long embargo on Cuba and even tried invading it when Cuba was anti US country. If Mexico would become pro Russia, like Ukraine became pro Western, I think USA would also invade them or cause a coup and put a new pro US regime there. What do you think? Edited February 8 by Karmadhi Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 8 16 minutes ago, Heaven said: Obviously they made the wrong choice. The easiest thing in life is to play the victim and blame someone else. Guess what? It’s a trap. When you complain about someone else and don’t take responsibility you can never make a change. Each one of us can learn a lot about wars. Israel also is playing the victim when the land it illegally stole gets invaded. The victimhood of Israelis is out of this world. I will say it again. Unless Israel admits its horrible decade long policies led to Palestinians hating them that much, they will forever be criticized and ridiculed by most of the world. First step towards fixing a problem is realizing there is one. Israeli policies are the core problem here. Blaming Hamas is just a scapegoat. Those same policies will create another Hamas down the line and peace will never happen. Why is it this hard to understand this? Honestly Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 8 (edited) 32 minutes ago, Karmadhi said: Israel also is playing the victim when the land it illegally stole gets invaded. The victimhood of Israelis is out of this world. I will say it again. Unless Israel admits its horrible decade long policies led to Palestinians hating them that much, they will forever be criticized and ridiculed by most of the world. First step towards fixing a problem is realizing there is one. Israeli policies are the core problem here. Blaming Hamas is just a scapegoat. Those same policies will create another Hamas down the line and peace will never happen. Why is it this hard to understand this? Honestly Again you’re blaming someone else. For policies and regulations. I can also say that I am poor because of taxes etc.. The system isn’t the problem. You are. Ta da. Before the story of “Wrong policies” everyone was talking about the land. Like there is scarcity of land in the Arab world. Lol. Excuses excuses but never taking responsibility. Palestinians chose their government. Their government made a mistake. They pay for it. Simple. It’s the harsh truth but it is what it is. Edited February 8 by Heaven Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 8 2 hours ago, Vrubel said: I criticized their culture, their atrocities, cheering and total disregard for any honorable principle let alone moral principles. I mean how bankrupt is your culture if you celebrate people who consciously kill innocent civilians as heroes? Israel or USA have nationwide celebrations when they kill innocent civilians. They just do it in uniforms, with shiny medals, and on TV Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 8 (edited) 38 minutes ago, Heaven said: Before the story of “Wrong policies” everyone was talking about the land. Their illegal land theft is part of the policies... 38 minutes ago, Heaven said: Like there is scarcity of land in the Arab world It does not matter. When you murder and kick people out of their house they will hate you. It does not matter that there is a big arab dessert next to it. 38 minutes ago, Heaven said: Palestinians chose their government. Their government made a mistake. They pay for it. Simple. It’s the harsh truth but it is what it is. It baffles me how inhumane you Israelis are... Edited February 8 by Karmadhi Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 8 2 minutes ago, Karmadhi said: Their illegal land theft is part of the policies... It does not matter. When you murder and kick people out of their house they will hate you. It does not matter that there is a big arab dessert next to it. It baffles me how inhumane you Israelis are... Israel is in peace with Germany even after the holocaust. Stop with excuses. Palestinians need to grow up and focus on themselves. Lol your mind was able to justify Hamas actions and you say that Israelis are inhumane. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 8 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Twentyfirst said: Israel or USA have nationwide celebrations when they kill innocent civilians. They just do it in uniforms, with shiny medals, and on TV Maybe the misinformation in your statements is celebrating.. Btw your hate comes from it as well. Edited February 8 by Heaven Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 8 Great conversation from Chat gbt3: https://chat.openai.com/c/527a8b15-1672-48a5-b5e6-4081884b97fc Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 8 @Twentyfirst 13 hours ago, Twentyfirst said: Before we start this interview....Do you condemn OSHO? Coolest Guru IMO. The only one with 100 something Rolls Royce, and a libary of about 150,000 books, just amazing! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted February 8 7 hours ago, Heaven said: Israel is in peace with Germany even after the holocaust. Stop with excuses. Palestinians need to grow up and focus on themselves. Well Germany apologized about it many times and did their best to change their ways. Israel not only does not apologize but they elect right wing zionist fascists and double down on their atrocities. No peace will be possible until Israel recognizes decades of oppression. First step toward peace is apology. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
