Posted January 8 @Leo Gura, @Carl-Richard, @Space and other mods, and also users here, your opinions on this video? IMO, I thought about this, but I consider it probably a better USA strategy, since they're allies with Israel, why don't they get directly involved in this conflict? Why don't Biden send some USA military units and establish a base near Gaza/West Bank, to both signal officially a coalition between them and Israel, but in secret a military presence in Gaza/West Bank would force IDF to limit their bombing attacks on buildings? I think the 'prime directive' here from USA should have been put aside and they should have been more involved militarily, at least to both check and control IDF aggression, but also to help preserve social infrastructure for Palestine? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 (edited) Let’s be realistic with the current situation USA will not stop supporting Israel for many geopolitical strategic reasons USA probably does not have nearly the amount of sway or ability to call a ceasefire. They are knee deep and entangled with Israel and don’t have the sway to likely get one. Their only method of forcing a ceasefire puts USA strategic interests in jeopardy so as much as they would like one it’s not possible. Israel is like a rabid uncaged dog that the owner is only in the position to continue to support but has marginal control over what it does usa has lost a lot of influence recently Edited January 8 by Lyubov Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 @Lyubov 3 minutes ago, Lyubov said: Let’s be realistic with the current situation USA will not stop supporting Israel for many geopolitical strategic reasons USA probably does not have nearly the amount of sway or ability to call a ceasefire. They are knee deep and entangled with Israel and don’t have the sway to likely get one. Their only method of forcing a ceasefire puts USA strategic interests in jeopardy so as much as they would like one it’s not possible. Israel is like a rabid uncaged dog that the owner is only in the position to continue to support but has marginal control over what it does usa has lost a lot of influence recently Which is why I think it maybe necessary for them to send in some US military in that area. They will still show support for Israel, but US presence in Gaza/West Bank would maybe make IDF think twice over carpet bombing buildings too much? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 28 minutes ago, Danioover9000 said: @Lyubov Which is why I think it maybe necessary for them to send in some US military in that area. They will still show support for Israel, but US presence in Gaza/West Bank would maybe make IDF think twice over carpet bombing buildings too much? It’s hard to say. USA is also struggling with their decision making on this and all the conflict of interests back home and abroad. USA “checking” their own ally sends messages to Iran that there are cracks in this coalition that can be exploited. They may just try and escalate in some form through their proxies if they sense a lack of coordination. But also simultaneously I think the one guarantee Israel has is the USA will step in if Iran escalates. It’s also an election year in the USA, Biden administration does not have the same backing as previous presidents on Middle East policy. Isolationist influences. General grid lock and even funding for Israel war effort put under scrutiny like Ukraine. To say the least this is not a unified USA with a cohesive and decisive foreign policy. Israel is very much unchecked here. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 7 hours ago, Nivsch said: But, all of you fail enormously to enter Israel's shoes and you are totally clueless about the reason Israel lost its patient and explode on Gaza after 30 years of torture and fear (and many-many polite and surgical operations...) Israel citizens are going through and are exhuasted from. You live in a bubble consciousness. You are programmed and brainwashed. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Merkabah Star said: You live in a bubble consciousness. You are programmed and brainwashed. I prefer the direct experience + Israeli media programming above the hamas-aljazeera-bbc one 😇 Edited January 8 by Nivsch 🌻 Thinking independently about the spiral stages themselves is important for going through them in an organic, efficient way. If you stick to an external idea about how a stage should be you lose touch with its real self customized process trying to happen inside you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 2 hours ago, Danioover9000 said: @Lyubov Which is why I think it maybe necessary for them to send in some US military in that area. They will still show support for Israel, but US presence in Gaza/West Bank would maybe make IDF think twice over carpet bombing buildings too much? Israel doesn’t really care what the USA thinks or the world.. it’s an ego on overdrive. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 Just now, Nivsch said: I prefer the direct experience + Israeli media programing above the hamas, aljazeera and bbc one 😇 Yes, the Israel media is programming, good point. BBC, aljazera and major news channels in everyone’s country aren’t just making it up, we see the destructions and death, you don’t. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 (edited) 14 minutes ago, Merkabah Star said: Yes, the Israel media is programming, good point. BBC, aljazera and major news channels in everyone’s country aren’t just making it up, we see the destructions and death, you don’t. Everything which is not direct experience is programming by definition it gives you a second hand mediated reality. I am not denying nor the destruction, nor the death toll, nor the fact that IDF could behave better and cleaner at least to some extent for sure there are many acts that are not necessary and do not come from a clean place and they are problematic. But they are a significant minority. When you zoom out in context and in time, the bigger picture tries to tell you some insights you refuse to hear and filters out. Just to sit in a room and moralize all day long when you don't have to risk your life there for 90 days straight in combats against terrorists is super easy and pleasant. Edited January 8 by Nivsch 🌻 Thinking independently about the spiral stages themselves is important for going through them in an organic, efficient way. If you stick to an external idea about how a stage should be you lose touch with its real self customized process trying to happen inside you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 Just now, Nivsch said: Everything which is not direct experience is programming by definition it gives you a second hand mediated reality. I am not denying nor the destruction, nor the death toll, nor the fact that IDF could behave better and cleaner at least to some extent for sure there are many acts are not necessary and not come from a clean place. But they are a significant minority. When you zoom out in context and in time, the bigger picture tries to tell yoi some insights you refuse to hear to filter out. But to sit in a room and moralize all the long when you are not risking your life is super easy and pleasant. You can’t have direct experience unless you are in Gaza being bombed. Flooding your mind with Israel programs on tv is not really having a direct experience. It’s like trying to explain to a Scientologist that Nicole Kidman is not a SP, suppressive person. No one is disputing Hamas needs to be taken out. The methods and civilian casualties show it’s not just about Hamas. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 (edited) Not just, fair enough, but mainly hamas. Direct experience of living in a society that being treatened and traumatized by terror for 30 years and then the Grand Final celebrated all around Gaza streets in singing and toffy candies. Edited January 8 by Nivsch 🌻 Thinking independently about the spiral stages themselves is important for going through them in an organic, efficient way. If you stick to an external idea about how a stage should be you lose touch with its real self customized process trying to happen inside you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 5 minutes ago, Nivsch said: Not just, fair enough, but mainly hamas. Direct experience of living in a society that being treatened and traumatized by terror for 30 years and then the Grand Final celebrated all around Gaza streets in singing and toffy candies. Both sides have been appalling.. you aren’t seeing the full picture either. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 @Nivsch Israel can make a case that they need to destroy buildings to block the tunnels underneath to trap Hamas or cut fuel which can be used for various needs of Hamas - obviously these have secondary effects which threaten civilian life but they can be passed off as accidents of war. Still, with some logic we can understand what these lead to on the civilians. But I just can’t see any excuse for cutting food, water and hindering aid which are primary effects at threatening life of civilians there. What military objective does it achieve? What’s the excuse? That Hamas will use banana peels to slip up IDF like Mario kart or start a food fight or use water cannons. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 @Merkabah Star 49 minutes ago, Merkabah Star said: Israel doesn’t really care what the USA thinks or the world.. it’s an ego on overdrive. Of course, because of A.I.P.A.C Israel lobby in the USA, plus the anti-Semite card they can pull out whenever they want to smear a critic. Bunch of dogmatic nut cases. I promise you, history will not be kind to them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 @Merkabah Star 13 minutes ago, Merkabah Star said: Both sides have been appalling.. you aren’t seeing the full picture either. Arguably one side is more appalling than the other. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 @zazen 4 minutes ago, zazen said: @Nivsch Israel can make a case that they need to destroy buildings to block the tunnels underneath to trap Hamas or cut fuel which can be used for various needs of Hamas - obviously these have secondary effects which threaten civilian life but they can be passed off as accidents of war. Still, with some logic we can understand what these lead to on the civilians. But I just can’t see any excuse for cutting food, water and hindering aid which are primary effects at threatening life of civilians there. What military objective does it achieve? What’s the excuse? That Hamas will use banana peels to slip up IDF like Mario kart or start a food fight or use water cannons. I can't imagine history will overlook this conflict, and how ridiculous the justification are from them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 Reminds me of this rap beef and diss tracks between Royce da 5'9 and Lupe Fiasco and Mickey Factz. Royce is like Israel with USA Eminem: and everyone else, pro Palestinians and international countries against them are like the two other rappers here: and The situations parallel with each other here. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 3 hours ago, Danioover9000 said: @Leo Gura, @Carl-Richard, @Space and other mods, and also users here, your opinions on this video? IMO, I thought about this, but I consider it probably a better USA strategy, since they're allies with Israel, why don't they get directly involved in this conflict? Why don't Biden send some USA military units and establish a base near Gaza/West Bank, to both signal officially a coalition between them and Israel, but in secret a military presence in Gaza/West Bank would force IDF to limit their bombing attacks on buildings? I think the 'prime directive' here from USA should have been put aside and they should have been more involved militarily, at least to both check and control IDF aggression, but also to help preserve social infrastructure for Palestine? They really hate aljazeera because they make them look bad. 😶 USA already have military bases in Israel, this one is 20 miles from Gaza but they saw nothing during hamas attack. Cough. https://theintercept.com/2023/10/27/secret-military-base-israel-gaza-site-512/ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Merkabah Star said: Both sides have been appalling.. you aren’t seeing the full picture either. This isn't symmetric in any sense. The violence and irresponsibility of the palestinians are many magnitudes higher. Edited January 8 by Nivsch 🌻 Thinking independently about the spiral stages themselves is important for going through them in an organic, efficient way. If you stick to an external idea about how a stage should be you lose touch with its real self customized process trying to happen inside you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted January 8 @Nivsch 2 minutes ago, Nivsch said: This isn't symmetric in any sense. The violence and irresponsibility of the palestinians are many magnitudes higher. If you say so... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
