New War In Israel / Gaza

[Nivsch]

10 hours ago, Lila9 said:

The super Zionist asked, "What will happen when he enters the Israeli prison and realizes there are no 100 virgins there?"

The super mega ultra Zionist responded, "It doesn't matter, he will receive free education and realize that there is no heaven and no 72 virgins, and would be grateful that I saved him from losing his life to this stupid belief."

And then they lived happily ever after. The end.

Wow thats great and so true (the whole message I just cutted the punchline) Like it.

You wrote in from your own? Its genius.

Zionism here got a new function as a mental frame people use here as often as they breath, to keep them in distance from Israelis and above them, and not confront the fact they are humane exactly like them.

Edited December 5, 2023 by Nivsch

[zazen]

8 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Giga-Zionist

Hunts Palestinian babies with dynamite.

God gave Aladdin a flying carpet but blessed giga-Zionist by carpet bombing onto him a hairy chest, back and long side curls to whip goyim. Chosen one.

Giga-Islamists got blessed with black burqas to liberate their women from the male gaze so they can eat all the baklava they want.

Edited December 5, 2023 by zazen

[Nivsch]

10 hours ago, Vrubel said:

This is not the path of resistance, it's the path of being as dumb as a brick wall.  

The path of peace is the only path (especially for Palestinians if they want to be viewed as normal humans, first and foremost by their own government.)
 

They "resist" themselves too all the time.

Groups within the palestinians do resistance and freedom fighting to each other all the time and with the same cruelty.

And within a family structure too. Tyranni all the way down.

Edited December 5, 2023 by Nivsch

[Twentyfirst]

I still think we should put all the Jews in a new state on USA land. Still haven't heard a better solution that doesn't involve violence

[zazen]

@Vrubel @Nivsch 

Agreed theirs plenty wrong within Arab societies and they need to do their own work. The external environment amplifies this. But it’s difficult to know whether a certain group is truly developed or  ‘civilised’ or that certain groups are just wealthy enough to pretend to be. If Americans were put in Gazans situation would it be any different. Even Ehud Barack said “If I was [a Palestinian] at the right age, at some stage I would have entered one of the terror organizations and have fought from there.”

Even if they are less developed and it’s not entirely Israel’s fault for how they are - it doesn’t justify or make Israel’s actions right.

Stages of development doesn’t make one group or person a different species that are inherently evil. It just means one group has developed more but those elements of other stages are still there lying dormant. Culture evolves faster than biology, and whilst we are in biological form we are chained or grounded by biology. Stage yellow and turquoise sages are still susceptible to biological reality as Osho was to his ill health despite being awakened or ‘developed.’

Developed groups still have the ancient instincts we finger  point less developed groups for acting upon, and the more developed groups can just pull at those instincts in different ways. You can be a stage green eco terrorist for example - growth can also be a cancer.
 

Is a broken orange/green society still better than a healthy red/blue society? Possibly, but a more developed society has more powerful tools with more leverage and potential for destruction which could make them more of a threat. A stage red primitive tribe might be sick and dangerous but their destruction will only be localised to their village surroundings whilst a stage orange techno-capitalist superpower though having more inclusive and broader values including democracy and science can inflict a negative global impact if this stage becomes sick, pathological or unhealthily manifest.

 

A highly developed society generally has more powerful instruments / tools, but if the individuals of that society become unhealthy their potential for chaos is greater. The individual and wielder of the tool needs to be just as developed - a parrallel match because the stakes are higher. A sick red society may only cause ripples on the world stage due to their limited tools of power but a developed orange society with more powerful tools will cause a tsunami of damage.

 

We can use spiral dynamics to make sense of the world or make our sense of self more righteous in relationship to others lower on the spiral.

 

In the past it was whoever can defend the land keeps it - rights to land are based on the might of those fighting for it. With a national consciousness spreading and bordering up of the world including the Arab regions this would have eventually trickled to the Palestinians, they just didn’t get there in time for the nationalising party which kicked off in the mid to late 1940’s.
 

Obviously nationalising can be taken to an extreme where every group, tribe or sect want their own nation - I’m not sure where that starts and stops and what a healthy amount is to be honest. For example now even Barcelona want to separate from Spain.

If this Israel Palestine scenario was happening in the past people wouldn’t make such a deal of it as the unspoken word then was whoever had the might had the right but today we live in a post expansionist world - at least when it comes to geography. Powers now expand through commerce and capital. The board game of geography is replaced with the board rooms of corporations - but that’s another conversation.

Edited December 5, 2023 by zazen

[Twentyfirst]

@zazen It's hard to credit Israel for their own 'high development'. They pretty much parasite off the American taxpayer. Its easier to hide barbarism behind billions of dollars 

Edited December 5, 2023 by Twentyfirst

[Karmadhi]

I love how the Pro Israelis here are quick to point out Hamas rapes and torture of civilians but when countless sources are sent here that say that the IDF has done similar stuff throughout the years, they are silent and conveniently  ignore them.

Biases 101  

Edited December 5, 2023 by Karmadhi

[Twentyfirst]

Just now, Karmadhi said:

I love how the Pro Israelis here are quick to point out Hamas rapes and torture of civilians but when countless sources are sent here that say that the IDF has done similar stuff throughout the years, they are silent and conveniently  ignore them.

Biases 101  

Theres literally dozens of documentaries for decades now proving this but mainstream people be sleeping 

[Karmadhi]

@Twentyfirst

2 minutes ago, Twentyfirst said:

Theres literally dozens of documentaries for decades now proving this but mainstream people be sleeping 

No no the IDF is professional moral army while Hamas are barbarians. If there is any proof that shows that IDF is also barbarians then by default you anti semitie  

[Twentyfirst]

3 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

@Twentyfirst

No no the IDF is professional moral army while Hamas are barbarians. If there is any proof that shows that IDF is also barbarians then by default you anti semitie  

They are angels sent from heaven to show all of us the true way haha

At this point I am just gonna say I am anti semite if thats the automatic accusation anyways. That phrase has too much power

[zazen]

@Twentyfirst @Karmadhi 

 

[Vrubel]

9 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Giga-Zionist

Hunts Palestinian babies with dynamite.

Exactly, "Giga ultra super Zionist". But what even is Zionism? what's its origin and history? Frivolous things like knowledge, insight, and context don't matter. It's Evil! 

[Twentyfirst]

 

[Karmadhi]

@zazen Nothing surprises me about IDF anymore at this point...

[Nivsch]

2 hours ago, Karmadhi said:

I love how the Pro Israelis here are quick to point out Hamas rapes and torture of civilians but when countless sources are sent here that say that the IDF has done similar stuff throughout the years, they are silent and conveniently  ignore them.

Biases 101  

This is what you want to think, but within IDF this is relatively rare. 

If you want to be taken seriously don't create fake symmetry out of nowhere.

Edited December 5, 2023 by Nivsch

[Nivsch]

1 hour ago, zazen said:

But it’s difficult to know whether a certain group is truly developed or  ‘civilised’ or that certain groups are just wealthy enough to pretend to be.

You are right. Come visit here and judge for yourself.

1 hour ago, zazen said:

Even Ehud Barack said “If I was [a Palestinian] at the right age, at some stage I would have entered one of the terror organizations and have fought from there.”

This is an honest thing to say. We all might be that way if we were palestinians. I want to believe I would be different because even here I hate any herd thinking especially in health and mental health issues, but yes I could be one of them I can't know.

1 hour ago, zazen said:

Stages of development doesn’t make one group or person a different species that are inherently evil

I want to believe stage red can look healthier than the palestinians culture. They are not only red (mainly red) but also there is something more there, you can see the cruelty and the roughness in every thing they do also to themselves. There must be here something more like a kind of mental disorder in a collective scale.

1 hour ago, zazen said:

Is a broken orange/green society still better than a healthy red/blue society? Possibly,

I think healthy blue is better than broken orange. Thats for sure.

Also I think the right frame is "Transcend, include and forget".

When orange becomes green he remembers again some blue and purple qualities. But now they get mixed with orange to create a new color but this is not that new except the color.

Development I think is realizing things you are in your subconsious ( and the deepest self) to begin with but you just have not seen them clearly before,

1 hour ago, zazen said:

A stage red primitive tribe might be sick and dangerous but their destruction will only be localised to their village surroundings

But also to itself if its unhealthy like you see in the palestinians.

1 hour ago, zazen said:

a stage orange techno-capitalist superpower though having more inclusive and broader values including democracy and science can inflict a negative global impact if this stage becomes sick, pathological or unhealthily manifest.

Agree. Also in the health and mental health of people being toxicated with victim mentality "because this is how your brain is" "This is genetic so you can only live with it" "Those thoughts are just a meaningless disorder and bring nothing more with them" "Just tame your brain with techniques becuse it is a stupid machine" etc.

1 hour ago, zazen said:

The individual and wielder of the tool needs to be just as developed - a parrallel match because the stakes are higher

Agree.

Edited December 5, 2023 by Nivsch

[Danioover9000]

@Karmadhi

1 hour ago, Karmadhi said:

I love how the Pro Israelis here are quick to point out Hamas rapes and torture of civilians but when countless sources are sent here that say that the IDF has done similar stuff throughout the years, they are silent and conveniently  ignore them.

Biases 101  

   Yes, bias 101, but actually it's hypocrisy 101.

[Twentyfirst]

Israelis wondering why those damn Arabs are always attacking them not realizing it's because they took their land in 48  

Maybe they really don't know why Palestinians do what they do? 

[Twentyfirst]

 

[lina]

On 11/30/2023 at 5:36 PM, Nivsch said:

I am absolutely agree, I just think that a 8 year old child can be neutralized in other ways, and if a soldier feels he must shoot because his life is in threat, he can still shoot on the leg or foot. I cannot understand shooting in a child head because this is firstly just wrong in any sense becuase this is a life of a 8 yo child who again can be neutralized quite easily in other ways, and secondly the world doesn't interested in the complex explanations, the damage has already done.

I understand you represent a reasonable Israeli perspective, but I still cannot find any justification even for shooting their leg. Making people crippled for life or amputees is not something to be taken lightly. Especially because this was in the occupied territories of west bank, from a legal and moral point of view Palestinians have every right to resist.