New War In Israel / Gaza

[Lila9]

3 hours ago, MuadDib said:

Yassir Arafat was the person they voted into power before Hamas, he was an advocate for peace and negotiations, but they believe the Israeli administration at the time took advantage of him and betrayed him, so they then voted for Hamas when they felt they had no other options.

He was also a terrorist. Palestinians never had a moderate leadership, all the leaders, whether it's openly or not openly, believed in terror and violence against Jews to claim the land. 

Hamas is just the most extreme but it doesn't mean that others leaders didn't encourage terrorism.

3 hours ago, MuadDib said:

They know the saying "from the river to the sea" can be interpreted in 2 different ways. That's one of the reasons they're so upset that Rashida Tlaib was kicked from parliament in the USA.

She supports Hamas and this is the reason she was kiked out. Were they upset that a woman who supports a group of terrorists kiked out from the USA Parliament? Weird. It only confirms their ignorance in regards of Hamas.

[Twentyfirst]

It's so terrible that America has so many school shooters now. Innocent kids being slaughtered in broad daylight. 

The terrorists that do these shootings need to be eliminated. To protect the kids

Lets blow up the schools  

[Twentyfirst]

25 minutes ago, Lila9 said:

He was also a terrorist. Palestinians never had a moderate leadership, all the leaders, whether it's openly or not openly, believed in terror and violence against Jews to claim the land. 

Hamas is just the most extreme but it doesn't mean that others leaders didn't encourage terrorism.

She supports Hamas and this is the reason she was kiked out. Were they upset that a woman who supports a group of terrorists kiked out from the USA Parliament? Weird. It only confirms their ignorance in regards of Hamas.

Im sending prayers for Hamas safety and security  

I love Hamas hahaha

Only 1,400 people died. Who cares?

[Twentyfirst]

What a time to be alive

I get to roast literal modern day Nazis 

Cant wait to tell my grandchildren these stories 

[zazen]

21 minutes ago, Lila9 said:

He was also a terrorist. Palestinians never had a moderate leadership, all the leaders, whether it's openly or not openly, believed in terror and violence against Jews to claim the land. 

Hamas is just the most extreme but it doesn't mean that others leaders didn't encourage terrorism.

She supports Hamas and this is the reason she was kiked out. Were they upset that a woman who supports a group of terrorists kiked out from the USA Parliament? Weird. It only confirms their ignorance in regards of Hamas.

Resistance can become terrorism but it isn't always terrorism. Supporting Palestinians does't make you a terrorist or Hamas supporter either.

You can't say things that go against the interest of the war machine - such as calling for ceasefire. Disapprove of the Iraq invasion, and you're called a Saddam supporter. Speak against US proxy warfare in Ukraine, and you're branded a Putin fan. It's a verbal magician's trick – criticize the war machine, and you're instantly accused of siding with the opposing team of 'bad guys'. This playbook persists with every high-profile US intervention, drowning out dissenting voices with negatively charged labels.

This isn't occasional, it's the consistent script for every US intervention. The message? Criticizing the powerful war machine is treated as treason. Those using terms like "Hamas lover" or ''terrorist sympathizer'' are essentially saying, "Never question the juggernaut that is the military-industrial complex. Silence yourself and obey the narrative.

[PurpleTree]

1 minute ago, Twentyfirst said:

What a time to be alive

I get to roast literal modern day Nazis 

Cant wait to tell my grandchildren these stories 

Yea you’re doing great kid

[Twentyfirst]

4 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

Yea you’re doing great kid

So whats your solution to all this? How to get peace while also massaging the ego of Israelis. Thats the hardest part btw

[PurpleTree]

10 minutes ago, Twentyfirst said:

So whats your solution to all this? How to get peace while also massaging the ego of Israelis. Thats the hardest part btw

Well we won’t find a solution 

[Twentyfirst]

Just now, PurpleTree said:

Well we won’t find a solution 

Why not 

[PurpleTree]

14 minutes ago, Twentyfirst said:

Why not 

Many reasons

the involved parties don’t want a solution 

even if you found a solution nobody will listen to you

it’s the ego always looking for solutions

you know hitler called the holocaust “Die Endlösung” “the final solution” or “the end solution”

[Karmadhi]

Hamas wanting to destroy Israel as an INSTITUTION is understandable. I do not blame them for that at all.

However, destroying an institution and killing innocent civilians are different things.

You can destroy an institution by destroying governmental and military buildings and killing soldiers. 

Killing innocent civilians randomly in massacres is totally wrong and not justifiable.

That is the error Hamas makes.

Also when you say "we will eradicate Jews" that is not acceptable.

If they said "we will destroy the concept of the Israeli state but not harm civilians in mass while doing so" then that is ok considering how Israel treated them in decades.

You guys need to make the distinction between destroying the artificial social construction that is a "state" and taking human lives. You can do the first without burning kids alive. No reason to do that. It is totally unnecessary. Also people should be free to practice whatever religion they want at peace. If Israel is gone, Hamas should let the Jews practice their religion at peace.

There is no reason for Jews to have an ethnic state. I do not see an Islamic state or Christian state anywhere.

A state should be for everyone to live in and live in equally. Sure, you can have majorities but the idea of a "Jewish state" is in itself racist and discriminatory.

Imagine if a state said "You either convert to our religion or need to leave, we will only have people following X religion here". The world would loose its shit.

Judaism is ok, Zionism is a disaster.

 

Edited November 15, 2023 by Karmadhi

[Lila9]

1 hour ago, zazen said:

Resistance can become terrorism but it isn't always terrorism. Supporting Palestinians does't make you a terrorist or Hamas supporter either.

If people supporting Palestinians without criticizing or condomning Hamas, not only because of the massacre in Israel but also for their treatment of the Palestinians, the usage as human shields, the brutal way they execute Palestinians for arbitrary reasons, this silence seen as agreement and support of Hamas. 

It seems that people who support Palestine, hate Israel more than they love the Palestinian people, because if they would loved them, they would be happy to get rid of Hamas and replace it with more advanced and moderate leadership, more democratic one who is pro human rights.

1 hour ago, zazen said:

You can't say things that go against the interest of the war machine - such as calling for ceasefire. 

You can, people say it all the time. It's seen as the most humanitarian thing to say and people who think otherwise seem like cold-blooded fashists.

"Just make a ceasefire and all this will be solved" comes from lack of understanding of the conflict.

If the solution was that simple as just making a ceasefire, it has been already ended.

 

1 hour ago, zazen said:

Disapprove of the Iraq invasion, and you're called a Saddam supporter. Speak against US proxy warfare in Ukraine, and you're branded a Putin fan. It's a verbal magician's trick – criticize the war machine, and you're instantly accused of siding with the opposing team of 'bad guys'. This playbook persists with every high-profile US intervention, drowning out dissenting voices with negatively charged labels

People can say whatever they want, people always have opinions about everything. You have the freedom to criticize someone and think about him whatever you think, and this someone has the freedom to criticize you and think about you whatever he thinks.

1 hour ago, zazen said:

This isn't occasional, it's the consistent script for every US intervention. The message? Criticizing the powerful war machine is treated as treason. Those using terms like "Hamas lover" or ''terrorist sympathizer'' are essentially saying, "Never question the juggernaut that is the military-industrial complex. Silence yourself and obey the narrative.

The western society can be secure, democratic and liberal as long as it condemns terror and brutal violence. Once it stops doing that and starts to justify solving problems with terror, it ceased to be liberal secure and democratic.

Even in the most democratic country there must to be principals like banning incitement to terrorism to grantee that the country will keep being secure, democratic and liberal. As country with liberal values, like human rights, thrives in secure and democratic condition and not in violent and non secure dictatorship.

The western country has no clue if the intentions of a civilian living in its territory, who says that Hamas is a valid resistance movement, says that because he actuality supports terror and is going to commit the next terror attack on the Jews community near his house, or aspires others to do that, or he is naively saying that out of ignorance. This usually ignored if this is someone anonymous but if it's someone known like someone who works in the US parliament, it's problematic to allow them claiming that Hamas are not terrorists as they will affect others to believe that brutally killing innocent Israeli people is legitimate way to achieve goals. 

 

Edited November 15, 2023 by Lila9

[PurpleTree]

4 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

Killing innocent civilians randomly in massacres is totally wrong and not justifiable.

Also when you say "we will eradicate Jews" that is not acceptable.

 

Wow now that’s a hot take

 

 

 

 

 

jk

[Karmadhi]

10 minutes ago, Lila9 said:

If the solution was that simple as just making a ceasefire, it has been already ended

There are many interests at play here.

Gaza has access to sea, resources, and it is land Israel can claim if they continue doing it.

They are not just doing this to kill Hamas, they got other objectives on top of that.

Resources and land.

Would not be suprised if Hamas is the excuse used for these other goals, same way "WMD" were used to invade Iraq.

Edited November 15, 2023 by Karmadhi

[MuadDib]

1 hour ago, Lila9 said:

He was also a terrorist. Palestinians never had a moderate leadership, all the leaders, whether it's openly or not openly, believed in terror and violence against Jews to claim the land. 

Hamas is just the most extreme but it doesn't mean that others leaders didn't encourage terrorism.

She supports Hamas and this is the reason she was kiked out. Were they upset that a woman who supports a group of terrorists kiked out from the USA Parliament? Weird. It only confirms their ignorance in regards of Hamas.

He won a Nobel peace prize.

She publically condemned hamas multiple times.

[hundreth]

46 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

There is no reason for Jews to have an ethnic state. I do not see an Islamic state or Christian state anywhere.

What? You don't see any Islamic states?

[Karmadhi]

@hundreth ISIS wanted to do that, an Islamic state. It caused global outrage and they were destroyed.

The rest like UAE, Egypt etc have majority Muslims but they also have religious minorities living there and they are not created for the purpose of being an Islamic state. The difference is the purpose why the country exists.

ISIS s purpose was to be that, an Islamic state and it got destroyed because of it.

I understand the world feels like they "owe" Jews considering how they were treated but Arabs do not owe Jews anything. If there is something like a Zionist state, it should be on the land of countries that actually treated Jews horribly. Like Germany.

However Europeans did not want them so they dumped them in Palestine.

Also Israel where it is, was used as a tool to control the region by the West. As Biden said "If there was no Israel, the US would have to invent an Israel there". Shows that there is much more here than just "Jews should have a homeland there". Lots of interests, both political and economical. Mostly because Arab area has lots of oil.

Before Israel Jews and Muslims lived together in Palestine and all was good.

Edited November 15, 2023 by Karmadhi

[Lila9]

1 hour ago, Karmadhi said:

There are many interests at play here.

Gaza has access to sea, resources, and it is land Israel can claim if they continue doing it.

They are not just doing this to kill Hamas, they got other objectives on top of that.

Resources and land.

Would not be suprised if Hamas is the excuse used for these other goals, same way "WMD" were used to invade Iraq.

Access to the sea and having the land may be one of the outcome of their presence in Gaza but it's not their main goal or something that they would bother to sacrifice soliders for.

If they really wanted that they would have already done that. Historically they had no problem in giving land if it's ensures peace, like when they gave Sinai to Egypt and Gaza to Palestinians.

1 hour ago, MuadDib said:

He won a Nobel peace prize.

He won Nobel peace price because of the Oslo agreement with Rabin but it doesn't remove the fact that he was a founder of Fatah which committed terror crimes mainly in form of suicidal bombers against Israeli civilians since 1965.

1 hour ago, MuadDib said:

She publically condemned hamas multiple times.

I don't know about that, I know that it was found that she was active in a secret group of Hamas supporters. 

[Twentyfirst]

https://www.instagram.com/p/Cyv37wTOnZL/

[Lila9]

39 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

ISIS wanted to do that, an Islamic state. It caused global outrage and they were destroyed.

The rest like UAE, Egypt etc have majority Muslims but they also have religious minorities living there and they are not created for the purpose of being an Islamic state. The difference is the purpose why the country exists.

ISIS s purpose was to be that, an Islamic state and it got destroyed because of it.

They are Muslim countries, based on Islam, not Christianity not Judaism or other religion. Many of them may not be religious by the book but it doesn't remove the fact that their official religion is Islam.

ISIS wanted Islamic stated under the Sharia law, religious Islamic state under their dictatorship.

39 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

I understand the world feels like they "owe" Jews considering how they were treated but Arabs do not owe Jews anything. If there is something like a Zionist state, it should be on the land of countries that actually treated Jews horribly. Like Germany.

However Europeans did not want them so they dumped them in Palestine.

Jews are historically connected to Israel, this is cannot be denied.

Israel is more Jewish than Arabic, historically and archeologically.

This is why it's important for Jews to be in Israel and not in other land, so people won't claim they don't belong to there.

Europe proved Jews they don't belong there. You say that Israel belong to the Muslim Arabs like the entire middle East, and not to the Jews.

If Jews have been settled in Africa, someone would have said they don't belong to Africa. If Jews have been settled in America, someone would have said they don't belong to America. 

It never ends... You see the problem? The problem is not Jews but the hatred of them and lack of acceptance of them. Even as the legit citizens in a land that it's proven to be historically related to them.

39 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

Also Israel where it is, was used as a tool to control the region by the West. As Biden said "If there was no Israel, the US would have to invent an Israel there". Shows that there is much more here than just "Jews should have a homeland there". Lots of interests, both political and economical. Mostly because Arab area has lots of oil.

The fact that the existence of Israel aligns with US interests doesn't mean that it's bad and Israel has stop to exist.

39 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

Before Israel Jews and Muslims lived together in Palestine and all was good.

This is not completely true. Jews paid high taxes and lived under Islamic leadership which always saw them as inferior to Muslims and betrayed them a lot.

 

Edited November 15, 2023 by Lila9