Who else here doesn't disagree with Leo ?

[Yimpa]

Just now, vibv said:

Oh well, I'm not hard to bait. But I'm working on it

As am I.

I felt like we had a similar conversation like this before. Déjà vu? 

[vibv]

1 minute ago, Yimpa said:

As am I.

I felt like we had a similar conversation like this before. Déjà vu? 

Last time it was about obsessions  

[Yimpa]

Just now, vibv said:

Last time it was about obsessions  

Well, let’s not get too obsessed with each other. Let’s keep it professional.

[vibv]

25 minutes ago, Dez said:

To be fair though it’s whatever you want to believe so you’re correct but at the same time you’re incorrect. All our beliefs are unauthentic, it’s just been passed down to us through generations. I only know of 2 people who I confirmed have achieved at very least their “first Samahdi”. Leo from Actualized and Jahseh Onfroy. And then you have prophets who master specific aspects of enlightenment like Jesus Christ and Buddha. It’s whatever you want to dwell into ???

I think you're onto something  But that are also a lot of beliefs. I don't say you're wrong, but there's a lot more to it still.

[Merkabah Star]

1 hour ago, Dez said:

To be fair though it’s whatever you want to believe so you’re correct but at the same time you’re incorrect. All our beliefs are unauthentic, it’s just been passed down to us through generations. I only know of 2 people who I confirmed have achieved at very least their “first Samahdi”. Leo from Actualized and Jahseh Onfroy. And then you have prophets who master specific aspects of enlightenment like Jesus Christ and Buddha. It’s whatever you want to dwell into ???

I meant other people will find the forum with no prior knowledge of Leo, as that is the vibration this place is putting out there. 

[UnbornTao]

5 hours ago, vibv said:

What do you mean? Everything I say is based on direct experience. Sometimes referring to past experiences of course.

It basically means stop lying to yourself about what you "know", if that's the case.

Come on, it's not hard to see, specially with this "absolute" business.

Edited October 2, 2023 by UnbornTao

[vibv]

Just now, UnbornTao said:

It basically means stop lying to yourself about what you "know", if that's the case.

Come on, it's not hard to see, specially with this "absolute" business.

Or don't.

I know nothing. I explain to you my current understanding of life. That's all.

[UnbornTao]

15 minutes ago, vibv said:

I know nothing. I explain to you my current understanding of life. That's all.

Fair enough, thank you.

Keep up the good work.

Edited October 2, 2023 by UnbornTao

[Carl-Richard]

8 hours ago, Loveeee said:

Or are you taking it on somebody else's word that it's not such an incredibly deep experience that is somehow different from the sober non-dual experience

No. I just admitted I don't know. You're the one who claims he does know while you actually don't.

 

8 hours ago, Loveeee said:

I'm taking the steps, are you ?

I'm not, but I'm not interested in it. If you're interested in 5-MeO-style awakenings, you should take 5-MeO.

 

8 hours ago, Loveeee said:

5-MeO works the same way as LSD in that it raises your level of consciousness except it's purer in that it doesn't tend to modify the content of experience, it's all about structure 

In that sense it's a more powerful tool for awakening, also because it's simply more potent

LSD is not 5-MeO. If that was the case, I would say I know what Leo has experienced, but I don't. That's cargo cult thinking.

 

8 hours ago, Loveeee said:

But it's not about the 5-MeO, I'm just conscious enough to realize he's more conscious than me

You're using intuition to create a working hypothesis that he is more conscious than you. But that has nothing to do with whether you actually know what he has experienced. And that is his main prescription if you haven't gotten it yet: if you want to awaken to his levels, take 5-MeO. Until then, you're in religious fantasy land.

Edited October 2, 2023 by Carl-Richard

[vibv]

38 minutes ago, UnbornTao said:

Fair enough, thank you.

Keep up the good work.

But I have moments when I know  

[Nemra]

10 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

why I'm more forgiving of religious institutions, because I don't pretend that spirituality is anything different.)

You are doing the same thing as the ones you're criticizing. Go be religious (which I don't recommend) and then criticize the people who are at least trying to understand their limits. I agree with you that trying to do it sober can get you nowhere over time, and we should use the tools that the teaching requires. But the thing is that religious people are generally in a much worse situation when it comes to spirituality.

And the people who aren't using it are just trying to find out how far they can get (which can get delusional if you're not careful) without using it until they finally get psychedelics safely.

[Davino]

My only solid critique of Leo is his little care about raising his base line consciousness.

Frank Yang and Peter Ralston might have not reached as high as Leo, not even close. However, Leo's baseline consciousness is a bit embarassing in comparison with other masters.

Time is limited and one could understand different investments but a few have attained it all, both baseline and peaks, like Sri Anandamayi Ma. So it can be done. 

[Francis777]

1 hour ago, Carl-Richard said:

You're using intuition to create a working hypothesis that he is more conscious than you. But that has nothing to do with whether you actually know what he has experienced. And that is his main prescription if you haven't gotten it yet: if you want to awaken to his levels, take 5-MeO. Until then, you're in religious fantasy land

I think he means that based on what he already does know and understand, he can see that Leo understands it to a deeper degree through how he explains that same knowledge that @Loveeee knows to be fundamentally true based on his own experience.

And that Leo doesn't contradict that with his deeper explanations, he just makes it more cohesive. Such as highlighting the congruency of the inner workings better or expanding on the implications of such thing.

[UnbornTao]

1 hour ago, vibv said:

But I have moments when I know  

Know what? When?

Tell me what you are.

[vibv]

15 minutes ago, UnbornTao said:

Know what? When?

Tell me what you are.

I am what is.

[Carl-Richard]

2 hours ago, Understander said:

You are doing the same thing as the ones you're criticizing. Go be religious (which I don't recommend) and then criticize the people who are at least trying to understand their limits.

No idea what that means.

 

2 hours ago, Understander said:

I agree with you that trying to do it sober can get you nowhere over time, and we should use the tools that the teaching requires. But the thing is that religious people are generally in a much worse situation when it comes to spirituality.

There are pros and cons to New Age religion vs. traditional religion, that is true. But it's all very much religion: there is a sacred impulse within, and you identify the idealized version of that in some external idol or method, and you give some trust in that authority through faith. Even the most Neo of the Neo-Advaitans fall under this definition, but the idolization of especially one person (in this case Leo) makes it very clear. And the shame here (and why I call it a cargo cult) is that the idolization seems to actually not align with the methods expounded by the idol. There is no shame in being religious, but at least do what your religion actually says ?

 

1 hour ago, Francis777 said:

I think he means that based on what he already does know and understand, he can see that Leo understands it to a deeper degree through how he explains that same knowledge that @Loveeee knows to be fundamentally true based on his own experience.

And that Leo doesn't contradict that with his deeper explanations, he just makes it more cohesive. Such as highlighting the congruency of the inner workings better or expanding on the implications of such thing.

That is pretty much what I said.

Edited October 2, 2023 by Carl-Richard

[Yimpa]

There are valuable lessons everywhere. Start by noticing the greater wisdom at play here on this forum as objectively as possible. See this forum as if you’re seeing it for the very first time.

Let’s expand our mind beyond our comfort zone, and especially be radically open to dropping all notions about what is true and what is false.
 

—

Now let’s talk about Mr. Gura for a second.

Leo appears to have more valuable lessons than everyone else here. But consider that that’s exactly the internal and collective bias at work!

Who says Leo is more authoritative than your own mind? Because Leo says so?  Because he has hundreds of videos on spiritual, metaphysical, and practical topics? Because he’s taken more psychedelics than you? Because he has more life experience than you? Because he actively engages on this forum almost daily and says a bunch of beautiful shit?

Can you not see that this is a major trap - to be putting all your trust onto Leeooooo? Yet, it’s not just Leo. You do this with other favorite teachers, friends, colleagues, professors, family….. the list goes on.

Let’s start trusting ourselves more instead of always relying on some higher authority(s) outside of ourselves to “figure out” reality for us.

Also, stop the game of claiming that your version of reality is better than another’s version of reality. Because more likely than not, you’re full of yourself!

[UnbornTao]

4 hours ago, vibv said:

I am what is.

OK.

Edited October 2, 2023 by UnbornTao

[Francis777]

1 hour ago, Carl-Richard said:

That is pretty much what I said.

yeah but you were being extremely nit picky for no apparent reason, you clearly knew what he meant and then just proceeded to state the obvious, obviously he's not going to know about an experience he hasn't had?

[Francis777]

3 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

Until then, you're in religious fantasy land

Just because you haven't had the experience does not mean you cant make sensible presumptions based off of countless reports of other people that claimed to have actually had the experience. Just don't take those presumptions as truth, you can still use them as guidelines till you know for sure yourself. 

That does not mean your automatically in fantastical cookoo land if you do.

Edited October 2, 2023 by Francis777