Why don't girls bother with basic human respect?

[Vrubel]

This does not apply to all women as many do have a sense of propriety. But lately, I have been dating this Latina girl, we went on two dates. Both went well, she definitely enjoyed them and felt really feminine. I paid for the first because that is what I do and enjoy. I also paid for the second because she had to go to the bathroom and just to make it smooth I paid. I don't really care that much about paying. But what really bothered me is that after the date she doesn't bother with sending a 'thank you' text, and I am always the first to engage her and in a sense to pursue her to get her on the next date. She did show some interest and agreed to meet but was stretching time. Because she was indeed a very busy engineer. 
But then I message her with the intent to plan our next date, and out of nowhere she says: "I haven't seen Johan in a long time so we are planning on doing something first". WTF who is Johan? (never heard of the guy) Why would you mention it like this to me? I never felt so humiliated.

Obviously, she can see whoever she wants and decide to stop seeing me but why would she communicate it in such a way with zero regard for me as a person?
She could have said a million other things including the same thing but in a respectful way. 

I replied: "I don't think you're appreciating me, I am not interested then". she replied: "ok".

The fact that I paid for both dates made me feel like such a sucker. I still would not have minded paying for both dates if she had opted out but expressed some basic appreciation and respect. 

 

Edited October 1, 2023 by Vrubel

[NoSelfSelf]

You are manipulating with paying for dates thats why you felt bad,disrespect can come from many different places and why do you care how she responds, you are in your feminine could be that...

[Vrubel]

@NoSelfSelf I decided to pay because she was in the bathroom and I was just waiting, I didn't think much of it. I have no problem with both askin the girl to pay or paying myself. I did both in the past and never had a nasty experience like here. I have had a relatively expensive dinner date with a Ukrainian refugee woman. It was not super expensive but it was way beyond a normal date. We never really followed up but I still could have seen I gave her a good time and the support she needed and in return, she did appreciate and respect me. So it was all good.  

She all of a sudden dropped a random guys name and basically said I had to wait in line before she saw him again. How would you respond?
For me, it felt totally unacceptable that she communicated it like this. It was not a shit test because for me there was no way I could have won. If I went along like a submissive little puppy I would have compromised severely on my integrity and that would have been very manipulative of me.

[Spiritual Warrior]

All of her actions are showing you that she wasn't feel the connection between the two of you. I've found that some girls like to send these subliminal messages through their actions (or lack of action) because they don't want to outright reject you. It sucks, but just lick your wounds and move on. You don't deserve a girl thats going to treat you this way, you deserve a queen that loves and respects you. 

[NoSelfSelf]

@Vrubel But you are  paying because you want to pay doesnt matter what she says or does next, thats the Game you making moves but her responses to your moves dont make you feel any kind of way ,because you are not attaching emotion and yourself to what she does,if you do then you making moves to get something out of her, if she acts disrespectful you feel bad about doing your previous moves its because it didnt go how you wanted...

I would respond depending of what i want with her, if i want casual thing then i would communicate that on first date and even push her to the other guy because im telling her she can have free will with me(also how game works in this)...but if i want something more serious with her then i would do what you did ,tell her im not interested if i didnt want something serious i would say something like:: hey i want you and Johan to really have a nice time together i want you to find the one for you because i love seeing that smile on you that you showed me across the table (or something) you lets hop on videocall before the meet  so i pick dress for you i know what guys like

You think you cant win and guys are a threat, but someone with game doesnt care and will show her how different he is from other guys ,that he will even push her to other guys so she sees the difference but okay thats advance stuff...

If you buy dinner to have sex you manipulating btw...

 

Edited October 1, 2023 by NoSelfSelf

[Vrubel]

 

14 minutes ago, NoSelfSelf said:

If you buy dinner to have sex you manipulating btw...

I don't mind paying and not meeting each other again! As I said before.  

 

14 minutes ago, NoSelfSelf said:

 But you are  paying because you want to pay doesnt matter what she says or does next, thats the Game you making moves but her responses to your moves dont make you feel any kind of way ,because you are not attaching emotion and yourself to what she does,if you do then you making moves to get something out of her if she acts disrespectful you feel bad about doing your previous moves because it didnt go how you wanted...

I always demand basic decency and respect from all humans I interact with. I am not compromising on that.

 

14 minutes ago, NoSelfSelf said:

I would respond depending of what i want with her if i want casual thing then i would communicate that on first date and even push her to the other guy because im telling her she can have free will with me(also how game works in this)...but if i want something more serious with her then i would do what you did tell her im not interested if i didnt want serious i would say something like:: hey i want you and Johan to really have a nice time together i want you to find the one for you because i love seeing that smile on you that you showed me across the table (or something) you lets hop on videocall before the meet  so i pick dress for you i know what guys like

I would not want to play such elaborate games with a girl. To me thats very manipulating and undignified. 
 

14 minutes ago, NoSelfSelf said:

You think you cant win and guys are a threat, but someone with game doesnt care and will show her how different he is from other guys ,that he will even push her to other guys so she sees the difference but okay thats advance stuff...

Again, she has every right to see other people and not see me. This is not the issue. I've got a really nasty aftertaste because of her total disrespect and disregard.
 

28 minutes ago, Spiritual Warrior said:

All of her actions are showing you that she wasn't feel the connection between the two of you. I've found that some girls like to send these subliminal messages through their actions (or lack of action) because they don't want to outright reject you. It sucks, but just lick your wounds and move on. You don't deserve a girl thats going to treat you this way, you deserve a queen that loves and respects you. 

I think this is the case indeed, man... I feel like such a fool. I seriously accept a lot of shit from women (flaking/indirectness/long response times) as long as they leave me within my dignity. 

 

Edited October 1, 2023 by Vrubel

[NoSelfSelf]

@Vrubel Its a must to demand respect but if its not returned you just walk away you dont sit around feeling bad about it.

What i get from you is that you say one thing and do the other without realizing probably you are senting those signals to her too..

Because you said those are elaborate games and then you want to be controling with her :to respond fast, for her to be direct ,while your only job is to be impactful and give her free will to be what she wants to be...

You are again manipulating her because when you make moves then you only asses if shes the one, if not you just let her go, you are not taking any "shit" its also not seeing you are the problem, if she had an amazing time she would call you but since you are like every other guy then she goes for someone else, thinking this one will be different ?

Edited October 1, 2023 by NoSelfSelf

[Merkabah Star]

She seems rude, I wouldn’t have even attempted a third date. She must be hot. 

[Leo Gura]

You need to learn that girls have no investment in you until after sex. She is not going to care about you until after sex.

The issue is, you are invested in her and she is not invested in you. Girls are not thinking about you, they are lost in their busy little lives, like rats, until after they sleep with you. Then everything flips.

Your only problem is over-investment. Stop expecting respect from women until after sex.

Edited October 1, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Vrubel]

12 minutes ago, NoSelfSelf said:

Because you said those are elaborate games and then you want to be controling with her :to respond fast, for her to be direct ,while your only job is to be impactful and give her free will to be what she wants to be...

Well, I was indeed trying to get her on a date again, do you count that as manipulation? I was mostly very plain about it, no elaborate manipulative tricks or texts. I get your point. Obviously, there was some attachment otherwise I wouldn't had such a strong emotional reaction. 
 

4 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

You need to learn that girls have no investment in you until after sex. She is not going to care about you until after sex.

The issue is, you are invested in her and she is not invested in you.

I always get attached to a degree in proportion to how much we met, clicked, and connected, but yeah I cared for her. I feel like such a fool. This is one of the nastiest dating stings I ever had. Again I would have felt better if it was slightly more respectful or even an old-fashioned flake. But hey, there are the worst things in life. 

Last week was my first time wearing a suit and I myself actually got approached by a very stylish Eastern European girl and she even asked for my number, but even she is flakey as fuck haha. Not sure if I can get her on a date. 
 

[NoSelfSelf]

@Vrubel No i would call that a desperation

[StarStruck]

She is on the magic school bus if she is 16-24 of age. If you got all the free stuff and genitals thrown at you your personality would change too. You act like a dog and be treated like a dog. Act like a boss and be treated as a boss. Girls will treat you as you treat yourself. They are very harsh but it is basic survival. Only after you reached the "we" phase, she will see it different.

1 hour ago, Vrubel said:

 

I always demand basic decency and respect from all humans I interact with. I am not compromising on that.


 

Respect yourself and move on. Stop paying for dates. Let her invest too. She will respect you for not acting like a provider simp.

Quote

 

I think this is the case indeed, man... I feel like such a fool. I seriously accept a lot of shit from women (flaking/indirectness/long response times) as long as they leave me within my dignity. 

 

Dignify yourself. They disrespect you because you disrespect yourself. In the same way if you don't think you are hot they won't find you hot.. but if you think you are hot yourself they will think you hot too. Girls are weird and they don't even understand themselves, so don't look for answers from them.

Developing a strong frame of reality is something I'm working on too. It is not easy.

Edited October 1, 2023 by StarStruck

[Leo Gura]

27 minutes ago, Vrubel said:

I always get attached to a degree in proportion to how much we met, clicked, and connected, but yeah I cared for her. I feel like such a fool. This is one of the nastiest dating stings I ever had. Again I would have felt better if it was slightly more respectful or even an old-fashioned flake. But hey, there are the worst things in life. 

This was your fault.

You got too invested and took her too seriously. Instead you should have treated her like you didn't care. And then she would have gone on another date with you, slept with you, and then everything would have flipped around and she would have started to fall in love with you. But because you were over-invested you spooked her off with your neediness and you even made yourself feel disrespected.

The mistake was that you got so invested in her that you wanted respect from her.

This is a very sneaky and subtle problem in your game which you can fix if you take responsibility for it.

I used to have this problem a lot. Until I realized what was really happening, how I was creating it.

Edited October 1, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Vrubel]

8 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

The mistake was that you got so invested in her that you wanted respect from her.

I see, noted.

In my mind, I was just being respectful towards her because I feel pretty secure in my masculinity, because of that I don't feel the need to play games or "act" disinterested. Maybe it's a cultural thing because I mostly go for Eastern European women where old-fashioned gentleman behavior is more the norm. At the end of each date, she glowed so I cannot say she was creeped off. 

[Leo Gura]

@Vrubel It's not about acting disinterested, it's about being disinterested.

If you had 3 other girlfriends, you would not have felt disrespected by that girl. Because you would have been too busy to even notice what nonsense she texted you. You would have replied to her "K" a few days late. And she would have felt like you are a valuable guy. Instead you communicated to her that you are a desperate and lonely guy who needs her more than she needs you.

This stuff is extremely counter-intuitive. It will drive you crazy until you finally figure it out.

Detachment is a core principle of game. The lesson goes very deep.

Edited October 1, 2023 by Leo Gura

[NoSelfSelf]

13 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@Vrubel It's not about acting disinterested, it's about being disinterested.

If you had 3 other girlfriends, you would not have felt disrespected by that girl. Because you would have been too busy to even notice what nonsense she texted you. You would have replied to her "K" a few days late. And she would have felt like you are a valuable guy. Instead you communicated to her that you are a desperate and lonely guy who needs her more than she needs you.

This stuff is extremely counter-intuitive. It will drive you crazy until you finally figure it out.

Detachment is a core principle of game. The lesson goes very deep.

This is music to my ears ??

[Leo Gura]

Another, simpler way to deal with this whole situation is with the principle of playfulness. Never respond to girls seriously, but playfully. If she sends you some stupid text, you respond with something absurd and playful, not serious. This demonstrates your detachment.

Ex: "Johan told me that he doesn't love you any more."

Ex: "Johan told me he stepped on a particularly large skunk."

Edited October 1, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Nemra]

@Leo Gura

Are all types of girls the way you describe them fundamentally?

[Leo Gura]

5 minutes ago, Understander said:

@Leo Gura

Are all types of girls the way you describe them fundamentally?

There will be some outliers. We are talking general principles of game.

As you master the principles you can then tailor your game to girls more individually.

For example, sometimes you'll notice a girl gets very invested in you early on. This can happen, but you should consider this an exception, not the norm. And you should still never forget that girls are very flakey until after sex.

Edited October 1, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Psychic]

23 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Never respond to girls seriously, but playfully.

This is only before a relationship is confirmed, right?

 

What’s your opinion on being and doing the principles/fundamentals of game in a relationship? I feel like they should still be done but to a lesser extend. I find them crucial to retain a girl.

Edited October 1, 2023 by Psychic