Adyashanti Retires

[gettoefl]

13 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

Suffering has a function, it is the most powerful engine for evolution. Without suffering there is stagnation. Life wants to evolve, increase in complexity, in consciousness, and for this it invents suffering, a perfect tool. Every living being suffers, and suffering pushes it to seek a solution, then evolve.

The collective human mind is a living being in evolution, and suffers a lot in many fields, and therefore evolves at great speed. It seems that it is in a phase of extreme evolution and therefore his suffering is enormous. Seems certain that the suffering of the Paleolithic collective mind would be several orders of magnitude less. Probably when this evolution reaches a plateau phase, the suffering will decrease, and being spiritually awake will be normal for humans.

this is insightful ... however the collective and the outside matters not a jot; when you wake up i wake up all wake up haven't you noticed that?

and every eon feels their suffering is the most cataclysmic and the world cannot get any more crazy and messed up, this again is mind's nature

you have conceded that suffering is good and that's right but you then you say it will get to a point where it decreases, yes true on the average, but the fruit as we know is the end of suffering not its reduction since that is just more of the same loop so each needs to do their work and forget the others

[Breakingthewall]

22 hours ago, undeather said:

Enlightened Neo-advaitans & theravada-buddhists when the barbarians have invaded and burnt down their village and captured their wife and enslaved their children:

??? Great

3 hours ago, gettoefl said:

you have conceded that suffering is good and that's right but you then you say it will get to a point where it decreases, yes true on the average, but the fruit as we know is the end of suffering not its reduction

Suffering is part of life, the end of suffering is a utopia perhaps achievable by avatars who have completely transcended their humanity and are sitting drooling without caring about eating or starving. Would you like to get to that? For me, a normal amount of suffering is acceptable, even desirable. What's wrong with suffering sometimes? What is bad is suffering absolutely all the time, like many humans today, with anxiety always active in the background. No other living being lives like this, they suffer in specific moments, when they are hungry or in pain, not 24/7 even dreaming of suffering trapped in the nightmare of the ego.

[Breakingthewall]

21 hours ago, Water by the River said:

In fact, because you are no longer afraid of your feelings,you can engage them with much greater intensity. The movie of life becomes more vivid and vibrant, precisely because you are no longer grasping or avoiding it, and thus no longer trying to dull or dilute it. You no longer turn the volume down. You might even cry harder, laugh louder, jump higher. Choiceless awareness doesn’t mean you cease to feel; it means you feel fully, feel deeply, feel to infinity itself, and laugh and cry and love until it hurts. Life jumps right off the screen, and you are one with all of it, because you don’t recoil.

So what do you do when barbarians invade your village and enslave your children in a brothel according willber? Get free your emotions, do an oath,  dedicate your life to revenge, you torture them one by one and all that? In the end there is no difference, you cannot escape your humanity, you can park it at certain times if circumstances allow it. 

The thing is, you cannot avoid suffering in certain circumstances since that is your nature. The Buddhist idea is: renounce your humanity, your nature, and there will be the end of suffering. This is probably true, but I can't help but see avoidance, fear, in it. 

Edited September 27, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[CoolDreamThanks]

Good, one less false teacher. A master does not experience pain, that's why Jesus did not suffer on the cross. Anyone who has reached the highest levels of consciousness knows that pain only exists at the lower ranks. Of course, it was obvious from his books that he is nowhere near enlightenment. He was within the trap of thinking that separated beingness is truth. Maybe in the next lifetime, Adya..  Putting on a teacher's hat and getting approval from others is such a sticky trap,  you crystalize at that level for the rest of your life.

[Guest Bazooka Jesus]

On 26.9.2023 at 4:02 PM, Water by the River said:

This days most mature post award is clearly taken.

In real life, it works more like this:

Ken Wilber, One Taste:

"Monday, March 24. With the awakening of constant consciousness, you becomesomething of a divine schizophrenic, in the popular sense of “split-minded,” because you have access to both the Witnessand the ego. You are actually “whole-minded,” but it sounds like it’s split, because you are aware of the constant Witness or Spirit in you, and you are also perfectly aware of themovie of life, the ego and all its ups and downs. So you still feel pain and suffering and sorrow, but they can no longer convince you of their importance—you are no longer the victim of life, but its Witness.

In fact, because you are no longer afraid of your feelings,you can engage them with much greater intensity. The movie of life becomes more vivid and vibrant, precisely because you are no longer grasping or avoiding it, and thus no longer trying to dull or dilute it. You no longer turn the volume down. You might even cry harder, laugh louder, jump higher. Choiceless awareness doesn’t mean you cease to feel; it means you feel fully, feel deeply, feel to infinity itself, and laugh and cry and love until it hurts. Life jumps right off the screen, and you are one with all of it, because you don’t recoil.

If you are having a dream, and you think it’s real, it can get very scary. Say you are dreaming that you are tightropewalking across Niagara Falls. If you fall off, you plunge to your death. So you are walking very slowly, very carefully.Then suppose you start lucid dreaming, and you realize that it’s just a dream. What do you do? Become more cautious and careful? No, you start jumping up and down on the tightrope, you do flips, you bounce around, you have a ball—precisely because you know it isn’t real. When you realize it’s a dream, you can afford to play.

The same thing happens when you realize that ordinary life is just a dream, just a movie, just a play. You don’t become more cautious, more timid, more reserved. You start jumping up and down and doing flips, precisely because it’sall a dream, it’s all pure Emptiness. You don’t feel less, you feel more—because you can afford to. You are no longer afraid of dying, and therefore you are not afraid of living.You become radical and wild, intense and vivid, shocking and silly. You let it all come pouring through, because it’s all your dream.

Life then assumes its true intensity, its vivid luminosity, itsradical effervescence. Pain is more painful and happiness is happier; joy is more joyous and sorrow is even sadder. It all comes radiantly alive to the mirror-mind, the mind that doesn’t grasp or avoid, but simply witnesses the play, and therefore can afford to play, even as it watches.

What would motivate you if you saw everything as the dream of your own highest Self? What would actually move you in this playful dream world? Everything in the dream is basically fun, at some deep level, except for this: when you see your friends suffering because they think the dream is real, you want to relieve their suffering, you want them to wake up, too. Watching them suffer is not fun. And so a deep and powerful compassion arises in the heart of the awakened ones, and they seek, above all else, to awaken others—and thus relieve them from the sorrow and the pity,the torment and the pain, the terror and the anguish that comes from taking with dreadful seriousness the passing dream of life.

So you are a divine schizophrenic, you are “split-minded” in the sense that you are simultaneously in touch with both the pure Witness and the world of the ego-film. But that really means you are actually “whole-minded,” because these two worlds are really not-two. The ego is just the dream of the Witness, the film that the Witness creates out of its own infinite plenitude, simply so it will have something to watch at the movies.

At that point the entire play arises within your own constant consciousness. There is no inside and no outside, no in here versus out there. The nondual universe of One Taste arises as a spontaneous gesture of your own true nature. You can taste the sun and swallow the moon, and centuries fit in the palm of your hand. The pure I-I, the greatI AMness, breathes to infinity and creates a Kosmos as the Song of its very Self, and oceans of compassion fall as tears from your very own Original Face.

 

Beautiful. And True.

[gettoefl]

3 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

 

20 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

Suffering has a function, it is the most powerful engine for evolution. Without suffering there is stagnation. Life wants to evolve, increase in complexity, in consciousness, and for this it invents suffering, a perfect tool. Every living being suffers, and suffering pushes it to seek a solution, then evolve.

The collective human mind is a living being in evolution, and suffers a lot in many fields, and therefore evolves at great speed. It seems that it is in a phase of extreme evolution and therefore his suffering is enormous. Seems certain that the suffering of the Paleolithic collective mind would be several orders of magnitude less. Probably when this evolution reaches a plateau phase, the suffering will decrease, and being spiritually awake will be normal for humans.

we must have different notions of suffering

for me suffering is

taking impermanent things as permanent. taking a finite self as a true self, taking an illusion as reality. taking happiness as bliss etc.

all these things are eminently fixable by doing the work

[vibv]

29 minutes ago, gettoefl said:

we must have different notions of suffering

for me suffering is

taking impermanent things as permanent. taking a finite self as a true self, taking an illusion as reality. taking happiness as bliss etc.

Both points of view are valid.

Suffering = Death = Finiteness = Limitedness = Ignorance = Stagnation but it is also an expression of Love = Truth = Reality = Life = Evolution = God = Omniscience.

Suffering powers Evolution. Standing still would mean you go against the flow of Life. The only reason for that is if you think there's nothing more to achieve, you think you're already there. Which at the same time is ignorance...

It's like yin and yang. There needs to be this drop of suffering in the sea of Infinite Love to make it perfectly balanced.

There needs to be that which you are not to experience that which you are. God sacrifices itself out of love for itself.

Edited September 27, 2023 by vibv

[Breakingthewall]

1 hour ago, gettoefl said:

we must have different notions of suffering

for me suffering is

taking impermanent things as permanent. taking a finite self as a true self, taking an illusion as reality. taking happiness as bliss etc.

all these things are eminently fixable by doing the work

I call suffering what I would experience, for example, if I was locked in a 2x1 m room at 35 degrees in the dark for 5 years.  

Life has enormous push.  This thrust has two motors, one positive and one negative. The positive is the will of being.  the negative is to escape from suffering. Suffering is real and very powerful.

Edited September 27, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[vibv]

@Breakingthewall Suffering is what creates BEAUTY

[gettoefl]

9 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

I call suffering what I would experience, for example, if I was locked in a 2x1 m room at 35 degrees in the dark for 5 years.  

Life has enormous thrust. This thrust has two motors, one positive and one negative. The positive is the will of being.  the negative is to escape from suffering. Suffering is real and very powerful.

you can attain ever more endurance, grit and indefatigability, just don't run a marathon on the first day

suffering is just being identified with an ego and attached to a dream

you can overcome all that today by living in the truth

slowly the body you carry will bother you less and less

 

here are some declarations in such a state of consciousness courtesy of chat-gpt:

"This body and mind are merely passing clouds in this vast sky of awareness that I inhabit."

"I am no longer limited by the boundaries of a physical form; I exist and abide as boundless awareness."

"In the ocean of consciousness, I am the ever-flowing totality of experience."

"I see the forms self and other, and I abide in the stillness of the unchanging."

"This world dances around me like a dream, and I am dreaming it all."

"I am not the thoughts that arise; I am the truth of the unimpeded ground"

"It is in the the silence of the mind that I find the music of existence."

"Attachment is no more, and I rest in the freedom of non-fixation."

"There was never separation; I am intimately part of everything here."

"In the boundless expanse of awareness, suffering has ceased forever."

 

 

[vibv]

@gettoefl You can't overcome suffering. But you can see that it is LOVE, then you stop suffering from the suffering.

The real suffering is trying to get rid of it.

[CoolDreamThanks]

4 minutes ago, vibv said:

@Breakingthewall Suffering is what creates BEAUTY

This is absurd. How is cutting your finger beautiful? Did you get confused on your own or did someone else tell you that everything is perfect or some similar nonsense?

[gettoefl]

2 minutes ago, vibv said:

@gettoefl You can't overcome suffering. But you can see that it is LOVE, then you stop suffering from the suffering.

The real suffering is trying to get rid of it.

suffering is, i don't wanna be here now

such an attitude is one of finite minds

[vibv]

Just now, CoolDreamThanks said:

This is absurd. How is cutting your finger beautiful? Did you get confused on your own or did someone else tell you that everything is perfect or some similar nonsense?

 God told me

You don't cut your finger on purpose. The pain is LOVE that expresses itself as survival of the body

[CoolDreamThanks]

7 minutes ago, vibv said:

 God told me

You don't cut your finger on purpose. The pain is LOVE that expresses itself as survival of the body

Leo told you, and you believed in him, to be precise. 

Of course you don't cut your finger on purpose, but it happens, and it hurts. If the dream is perfect, why are there such incidents? Why can you make extremely painful mistakes? Why is there heartbreak, disease, psychological suffering, effort to survive, etc.? Where is perfection in that? The answer is simple if you stop defending this belief that you have. Or you can twist anything to strengthen your belief, as you are doing.

[Javfly33]

On 26/09/2023 at 0:40 AM, Leo Gura said:

PTSD from what?

But this is a good lesson. It's important for you guys to understand that the end of suffering is nonsense. More Buddhist bullshit.

Is not nonsense, it just shows that he didn't achieved much. 

Why you guys keep setting the bar for spirituality as having realisations or understanding.

If you guys would set the bar at mastering mind-body-energy, etc, then we would see how little people are getting to somewhere actually real.

I wouldn't be surprised if 99% of 'spiritual masters' are masters of memories and conceptual models, but not actual States of Consciousness.

@Leo Gura You yourself made a video of 'Everything is a state of Consciousness' Leo. Why not make the goal spirituality that. That the state of consciousness is what matters. And nothing more. 

Edited September 27, 2023 by Javfly33

[vibv]

@CoolDreamThanks Who is in the defensive here? 

[Javfly33]

And overall I´m not surprised at all. The teaching of adyashanti was very conceptual like and meditation does not modify much the state of consciousness outside the 20-30 minute you are meditating.
 

When you get up the cushion much of the entanglements and karmic bonds, over stimulation of mind, etc... is again the master. Maybe that activation of gray matter makes the mind a bit more slower, but is clearly not potent at all to make a significant mistake in pleasure life experience.

As humans we should get to a place of being honest with ourselves. What matters is state! The experience within! We must focus our energy and attention in achieving mastery of that. If within one is not feeling completely right and free of suffering, who cares what happens on the outside ? Who cares what realisations you have? Who cares what understanding of the 'Self' you have? 

[Breakingthewall]

1 hour ago, gettoefl said:

you can attain ever more endurance, grit and indefatigability, just don't run a marathon on the first day

Agree with that. It is possible to let suffering slide over you, it is like a game, suffering locks you in and you must find a way to get out. It only leaves you one option: freedom  

Possible, but not easy

1 hour ago, Javfly33 said:

The teaching of adyashanti was very conceptual like and meditation does not modify much the state of consciousness outside the 20-30 minute you are meditating.

I found adyshanti very shallow, and when reading, I noticed a certain smell of scam, kinda trying to create a sensation of mystery, creating an enlightened archetype, and his speech is lacking in life, flat. But you never know.

Edited September 27, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[Breakingthewall]

1 hour ago, vibv said:

 God told me

You don't cut your finger on purpose. The pain is LOVE that expresses itself as survival of the body

This logical doesn't work. What about the children with cancer?