East vs West cultures awakening, prejudice, and assumptions

[Soul Flight]

Hello all,

Europe and the West seems almost sabotaged and retarded by Christianity due to its concretization of heaven and hell and a patriarchal god and waiting for physical death and heaven and eternity with god. The Christian dogma actually prevents Buddhahood or awakening. I would assume Eastern nations and cultures would have a head start on awakening and bliss and higher levels of consciousness. Is this true? Are Eastern cultures more advanced spiritually or maybe their humanity is deeper? Are there more awakened people in the East? Is Western dominance over the globe only material in nature while the East is dominating spiritually and passively? Why the disparity between East and West? Why does the West seem more "successful?" The East has had time on their side and a longer incubation period.

Or did I simply imagine World History so I could revolt against the majority Christian establishment and embrace an esoteric path chosen by a small minority of people?

A somewhat related question is why educated, intelligent, wealthy people do not pursue enlightenment in greater numbers? Why aren't they sadhus, mendicants, and aesthetics? And why weren't the Gnostics and hermetics more successful?

Thanks

[Breakingthewall]

good points. I would say that people from the West are unhappier in the sense of being further away from themselves, more alienated, childish, capricious, crazy. but at the same time they are more empathetic. Christian culture says: love your neighbor. help him. This creates a stronger, more united and more alive society. but the Western paradigm is completely contrary to awakening, the concept is king, without concept there is nothing. The Christian religion is totally conceptual, Eastern religions give rise to the dissolution of the ego. So would be nice if both integrate the best of each one.

[Schizophonia]

@Soul Flight Westerners are the most prosperous for historical and political-cultural reasons.
Incidentally, white people appear to have higher IQ on average than near Eastern, sub-Saharan, and some Asian and South American populations.

 

@Breakingthewall  
Europe is the continent with the least mercantile population, and the most conscious of ecological and social issues.

[SeaMonster]

Reification (what you call concretization) is a problem in all religions and cultures at all levels of spiritual development.

Getting rid of reification is the last step in the journey of spiritual awakening, even most awakened people are unconsciously reifying some concepts.

 

 

[itsadistraction]

23 hours ago, Soul Flight said:

Europe and the West seems almost sabotaged and retarded by Christianity due to its concretization of heaven and hell and a patriarchal god and waiting for physical death and heaven and eternity with god. The Christian dogma actually prevents Buddhahood or awakening. I would assume Eastern nations and cultures would have a head start on awakening and bliss and higher levels of consciousness. Is this true? Are Eastern cultures more advanced spiritually or maybe their humanity is deeper? Are there more awakened people in the East? Is Western dominance over the globe only material in nature while the East is dominating spiritually and passively? Why the disparity between East and West? Why does the West seem more "successful?" The East has had time on their side and a longer incubation period.

You could be correct but these questions are very hard to answer. You would have to interview every person on their beliefs. Since the retarded religions, Islam and Christianity, are the biggest and the numbers areonly expected to grow it is hard to argue that "the east is dominating spiritually"

23 hours ago, Soul Flight said:

Or did I simply imagine World History so I could revolt against the majority Christian establishment and embrace an esoteric path chosen by a small minority of people?

Yes this whole thing is just nonsense and not real. This forum, this discussion, world politics is just an illusion. We are just chirping like birds about nothing to fill the air. We are addicted to thought. But all thought is illusory. There's a grand plan and maybe that involves Islam taking over the world and then a Buddhist revolt 1000 years later. Who the fuck knows or cares. Societies are full of idiots and probably will continue to be for 1000s of more years. 

 

23 hours ago, Soul Flight said:

A somewhat related question is why educated, intelligent, wealthy people do not pursue enlightenment in greater numbers? Why aren't they sadhus, mendicants, and aesthetics? And why weren't the Gnostics and hermetics more successful

Education is brainwashing so there's no wonder they don't care about enlightenment. And wealth is antithetical to enlightenment. Who needs enlightenment when you have great food, nice furniture, nice views, fancy cars, people respecting you, endless vacations and adventures.....

[Soul Flight]

1 hour ago, itsadistraction said:

Education is brainwashing so there's no wonder they don't care about enlightenment. And wealth is antithetical to enlightenment. Who needs enlightenment when you have great food, nice furniture, nice views, fancy cars, people respecting you, endless vacations and adventures.....

All true. I am curious why the wealthiest most intelligent people don't find material success ultimately unsatisfying? I would expect more of them would be more vocal about awakening and internal pursuits.

Many celebrities and many of us think if we get fame, power, money, etc. we will find happiness. Some successful people do realize material success does not fix their internal life when they reach the pinnacle of their industry. Some turn to drugs or suicide.

I was wrong about membership of religious denominations. Here is a link to world memberships.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_religious_populations

Thank you all for all your responses.

[Yimpa]

All just a bunch of nonsensical human games

 

[itsadistraction]

24 minutes ago, Soul Flight said:

All true. I am curious why the wealthiest most intelligent people don't find material success ultimately unsatisfying? I would expect more of them would be more vocal about awakening and internal pursuits.

Many celebrities and many of us think if we get fame, power, money, etc. we will find happiness. Some successful people do realize material success does not fix their internal life when they reach the pinnacle of their industry. Some turn to drugs or suicide.

I was wrong about membership of religious denominations. Here is a link to world memberships.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_religious_populations

Some wealthy people do but when you commit your whole life to achieving material success it is hard to admit you were ultimately wrong ( same with religious people). Plus living a life a luxury is not that intolerable. Most people will tolerate their lives without being rich and not care about achieving enlightenment. 

Religion is expected to rise https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2015/04/02/religious-projections-2010-2050/

Edited September 17, 2023 by itsadistraction

[Breakingthewall]

1 hour ago, Soul Flight said:

All true. I am curious why the wealthiest most intelligent people don't find material success ultimately unsatisfying? I would expect more of them would be more vocal about awakening and internal pursuits.

On 16/9/2023 at 8:51 PM, Schizophonia said:

 

I think it is more normal to live in a state of anesthesia if you are rich, you can go wherever you want, luxuries, etc., than if you have a hard, poorly paid job for years, living poorly, in unsatisfactory relationships. The life of the basic worker seems extremely hard to me, a curse really. I don't understand why being a monk or to live in communes is not a massive option. Maybe if the use psychedelic, they would consider the option

Edited September 17, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[itsadistraction]

5 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

I think it is more normal to live in a state of anesthesia if you are rich, you can go wherever you want, luxuries, etc., than if you have a hard, poorly paid job for years, living poorly, in unsatisfactory relationships. The life of the basic worker seems extremely hard to me, a curse really. I don't understand why being a monk or to live in communes is not a massive option. Maybe if the use psychedelic, they would consider the option

Yes it could be due to brainwashing by the rich and powerful. Pursuing material success benefits the people providing the materials.

Edited September 18, 2023 by itsadistraction