I found a great site discussing Solipsism/Non - Duality/God - Realization

[Guest Bazooka Jesus]

3 hours ago, Arthogaan said:

How so?

Well, Solipsism basically says that your reality is the only reality that exists and that everyone and everything else is your own imagination... in short: Only YOU exist. Where is the contradiction? Very simple: If there is just one thing in existence, then that one thing cannot be you by definition. A "you" can only exist when there is something else in existence which is "not you", i.e. something to contrast it with. You see?

I mean no offense to anyone, but this contradiction should be so goddamn obvious that it frankly boggles my mind how anyone can fall for this baloney.

[Razard86]

2 minutes ago, Bazooka Jesus said:

Well, Solipsism basically says that your reality is the only reality that exists and that everyone and everything else is your own imagination... in short: Only YOU exist. Where is the contradiction? Very simple: If there is just one thing in existence, then that one thing cannot be you by definition. A "you" can only exist when there is something else in existence which is "not you", i.e. something to contrast it with. You see?

I mean no offense to anyone, but this contradiction should be so goddamn obvious that it frankly boggles my mind how anyone can fall for this baloney.

Bazooka, your bias is limiting your understanding. Close your eyes right now. Imagine a world where a guy is walking down the street in a city. That entire scenario is YOU!!! 

That's it. This isn't complicated. It's not baloney. You have never experienced anything but YOU. But your understanding what YOU is false. You isn't a body. YOU is everything you experience and ever will. You literally cannot die because you are TOTALITY. But until you embrace this possibility you will only realize it when your body drops. It's up to you. You claim it's false all you want but...it is ABSOLUTELY TRUE.

When you go to sleep, you don't take anyone in your waking reality with you. And when you drop your body at physical death you won't take anyone with you. So what makes you think there are others...when you cannot interact with them in sleep or death? Exactly!!! Your mind is NOT in your brain. Your MIND is reality itself.

I could give you a substance that could wipe your memory and put you in a dream world that is as real as what you call this world. What is the difference? Even worse Science has already proven that distance doesn't exist. Non-Locality. So if Non-Locality is true, then there are no OTHERS. OTHER is distinction, distance, time, space etc.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-universe-is-not-locally-real-and-the-physics-nobel-prize-winners-proved-it/

The evidence is there...you just don't want to embrace it.

[Razard86]

Here is why Solipsism is Absolute. 

1. You cannot confirm the existence of something without existing in front of you.

2. You can say well what is someone records something and shows it to me. The video is within your existence. 

3. Well what if someone tells me. The person telling me is within my existence.

You cannot confirm anything outside of your existence because there is nothing that is.

This argument cannot be defeated. It holds true under all conditions. This argument is ABSOLUTE.

All knowledge you have ever gained has been from personal experience. Even someone telling you about their experience was in your personal experience. So even though you didn't experience their experience you experience their story about their experience. 

You cannot confirm your parents, your sister, your dog, your house exists outside of your experience. 

Now close your eyes. Dream a world. Dream yourself walking in that world. Make yourself walk home. Notice in your dream world that until you get home that home does not exist. You have to dream it up.

This holds true for movies, and it holds true for books, songs, and video games. Until the game renders the scene it doesn't exist. You will argue but it exists in the code. Well reality exists as an infinite possibility that gets rendered when conditions are ripe, not different than your video game program rendering the correct scene when conditions are right within the program. You could replace the word right with appropriate here, or logically consistent.

In a book when the author writes the story, until he imagines all the parameters of said story it doesn't exist. In a song until you write the whole song it doesn't exist.

I could go on and on and on. Your entire reality consistently has shown you that you have never experienced anything outside of you and you create belief systems within you to lie and deceive you that events happen outside of you. But science, technology can never prove this and they never will. In fact all science keeps getting stuck on is paradox, why? Because infinity is paradoxical. Why? Because to make ONE BEING relate to an other ....paradox must be used. Without paradox there is no duality, and literally no reality and no life.

Paradox proves that life is a got damn miracle. Learn to accept it.

[Arthogaan]

1 hour ago, Bazooka Jesus said:

If there is just one thing in existence, then that one thing cannot be you by definition. A "you" can only exist when there is something else in existence which is "not you", i.e. something to contrast it with. You see?

Hmm. I totally do not see why you would say that. I can exist, even if there is only I (just like God, Truth, Reality - all identical to each other), which is precisely the case. Just like in a dream at night, the only thing that exists is You/Mind that is generating the dream and characters inside and also body and ego. But "I" is the mind which is all there is. 

It seems like you are playing a semantic game that the word "I" only makes sense when it is in reference to something that is not "I". And okay then I understand your point. But it is just that awareness is this feeling of "I AM". It is the best word for it imho even if it kind of loses formal meaning because of lack of reference. But such is a nature of language and using it to describe anything Ultimate/Absolute.

I would argue it is as stupid as saying "Reality/Truth cannot exists because in order for reality to exist there must by definition be something other than Reality/Truth".

Which obviously is not the case. Reality and Truth by definition must exist, and just in the same way "I AM" must exist because it is always obviously here. Awareness.

Edited September 16, 2023 by Arthogaan

[Hojo]

I was off meat for 2 years and then went back on and I do feel like it influences your meditation states in a negative way. It makes it harder and makes you more 'heavy' spiritually

Edited September 16, 2023 by Hojo

[Arthogaan]

3 minutes ago, Hojo said:

I was off meat for 2 years and then went back on and I do feel like it influences your meditation states in a negative way. It makes it harder and makes you more 'heavy' spiritually

Same here. Vegan for 2 years then back to meat. I would say the same about meditation but I am not sure and it may be placebo. But on the other hand I felt it easier to exercise. It is like meat is this archetype of barbarian warrior hunter, that makes my body stronger in the raw sense, but weaker in the light/spiritual sense. But that may not be true it is just my intuition.

[Hojo]

@Arthogaan yea I bulked up super fast. I went from 178 to 195 in like a month. 

When I was eating vegetable and carbs I almost could make reality turn black in 10 minutes of meditation now I have to sit longer.

Edited September 16, 2023 by Hojo

[OBEler]

@Razard86 so with the help of paradox there is reality, other sentient beings, my house as a being (even if I dont look at it)? 

[Razard86]

1 hour ago, OBEler said:

@Razard86 so with the help of paradox there is reality, other sentient beings, my house as a being (even if I dont look at it)? 

Only if you convince yourself its true. If you convince yourself it's true...then it's true for you. The point of Spirituality is to show you that you are the Creator. If you convince yourself sufficiently that you are a fish, then in your reality you are fish.

Have you noticed there are people running around believing themselves to be animals. They aren't making it up. They have sufficiently deluded themselves into believing that they are animals. You are the truth, if you lie to much, eventually the lie becomes true for you. Social Conditioning are lies we were indoctrinated to believe and as a result it became true.

Many gurus have used the words hypnotized. Have you noticed when people are hypnotized they hallucinate? If you meditate long enough you can enter a trance, which is what happens when you are hypnotized and you can hallucinate. Hours and hours of being exposed to same material reinforcing the same concepts hypnotizes you into believing them to be true and you hallucinate a reality that conforms to this. 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/biocentrism/202309/what-does-quantum-mechanics-say-about-mind-powers

This information is all old information. Look at the date of these experiments. 

So yes if you convince yourself Duality is true, it becomes true. But since you are the creator, you can awaken to it being a pure fabrication in your mind. You can hypnotize yourself in the other direction basically. LOL

[Breakingthewall]

4 hours ago, Bazooka Jesus said:

Well, Solipsism basically says that your reality is the only reality that exists and that everyone and everything else is your own imagination... in short: Only YOU exist. Where is the contradiction? Very simple: If there is just one thing in existence, then that one thing cannot be you by definition. A "you" can only exist when there is something else in existence which is "not you", i.e. something to contrast it with. You see?

I mean no offense to anyone, but this contradiction should be so goddamn obvious that it frankly boggles my mind how anyone can fall for this baloney.

Exactly. That whole thing about only you existing is completely absurd. That is to say something from the conceptual mind, because the concept "your only exists" in the conceptual mind, outside the conceptual mind there is only pure existence, there is no you, no others, no god, no nothing, there is the infinite now existing, You can't label it because if you do, you are creating the mental barrier that you precisely want to dissolve. All the concepts exist in opposition of another concept. Reality is absolute, so has not opposite, so all the concepts are false  .It is obvious, without understanding this, there are only slaves of the mind. Freedom is out of the mind. 

Edited September 16, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[Yimpa]

Pure comedy gold 

[OBEler]

The guy who wrote this article wrote in the comment section below the article, that he proofed that solipsism is wrong:

"Here is my philosophical proof that solipsism is false. I have already placed it within the body of the text. But rather than make you look for it, I will also add it here. The proof is actually quite brief. As always criticisms are welcome. This is deduction, not physical evidence.

Section: Always Make The Choice That Gives Everyone Free Will

The minimum number of awarenesses needed for a shared existence to have BOTH absolute morality and free will is 3. I suspect this is also the basis for moral law, not man-made exploitative law. It also seems that law cannot exist unless there are at least 3 conscious beings. 3 is also the basis for the family unit; father, mother, and child. I therefore conclude that any type of conscious being, animals too, can potentially evolve to godhood. The crime of existence is to prevent this potential from developing. If only you exist, morality is not needed. If only two awarenesses exist, with you being one of them, then you will have to be either good or evil. Psychologically speaking, this could be the framework for brainwashing or manipulating someone. If three awarenesses exist, with you being one of them, then you can finally make a choice. I believe this would also disprove solipsism. You are capable of choice correct? Therefore solipsism is false and the current existence that we all share has at least 3 awarenesses."

"You're real, I'm real, all 8 billion people on this planet are real. No one has to die, no one has to suffer. We can all become immortal, all of us. We can all live forever."

"I am not a religious man. My observation is that religion has caused more harm than good. I consider myself an atheist. And even though I am an atheist, I do consider myself a moral being."   How can he then write such an article? He must copy pasted everything from leo gura and other sources, veganism, conspiracy theorys, mixed them all together to fit his confused worldview. This guy is total lost!

Edited September 16, 2023 by OBEler

[Yimpa]

15 minutes ago, OBEler said:

How can he then write such an article? He must copy pasted everything from leo gura and other sources, veganism, conspiracy theorys, mixed them all together to fit his confused worldview. This guy is total lost!

Maybe God is a complete genius ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ 

[Guest Bazooka Jesus]

6 hours ago, Arthogaan said:

Hmm. I totally do not see why you would say that. I can exist, even if there is only I (just like God, Truth, Reality - all identical to each other), which is precisely the case. Just like in a dream at night, the only thing that exists is You/Mind that is generating the dream and characters inside and also body and ego. But "I" is the mind which is all there is. 

It seems like you are playing a semantic game that the word "I" only makes sense when it is in reference to something that is not "I". And okay then I understand your point. But it is just that awareness is this feeling of "I AM". It is the best word for it imho even if it kind of loses formal meaning because of lack of reference. But such is a nature of language and using it to describe anything Ultimate/Absolute.

Imagine a stone. How can you say that this stone exists? You can say it exists because it contrasts with its surrounding, i.e. everything that is "not stone". Otherwise, you could not see/experience the stone. Right?

Now take away the surrounding. Imagine that the stone is literally ALL that exists. Does the stone still exist as a stone? No, of course not! "Stone" is a concept that only makes sense in conjunction / in contrast with its opposite... just as there is no white without black. If everything that existed was the color white, the concept of "white" would loose all meaning. Make sense?

Well, it is exactly the same with the concept of "you".

Ta-daaaaa!

6 hours ago, Arthogaan said:

I would argue it is as stupid as saying "Reality/Truth cannot exists because in order for reality to exist there must by definition be something other than Reality/Truth".

Which obviously is not the case.

Yes, it is the case. This is the whole point of all nondual teachings!

What do you think nondual teachers are talking about when they say "everything is nothing"? Exactly THIS! Existence is a singularity without opposite and therefore is literally NOTHING!

Again... ta-daaaaaaaaaaaaa!!

Don't try to understand this intellectually. Absolute truth is not made to be understood by the rational mind... it is inherently irrational.

 

Edited September 16, 2023 by Bazooka Jesus

[Guest Bazooka Jesus]

2 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

Exactly. That whole thing about only you existing is completely absurd. That is to say something from the conceptual mind, because the concept "your only exists" in the conceptual mind, outside the conceptual mind there is only pure existence, there is no you, no others, no god, no nothing, there is the infinite now existing, You can't label it because if you do, you are creating the mental barrier that you precisely want to dissolve. All the concepts exist in opposition of another concept. Reality is absolute, so has not opposite, so all the concepts are false  .It is obvious, without understanding this, there are only slaves of the mind. Freedom is out of the mind. 

Well said, my friend. I have nothing more to add to this.

Bazooka out.

?

[Arthogaan]

@Breakingthewall @Bazooka Jesus This is good discussion. Before responding I want to start by stating that all what I am writing is backed by direct experience from my 5-meo and LSD trips and it is not all intelectual altough I am still not sure of it. I did not reach a state of which Leo speaks about that "maybe it is possible to Absolutely know that other minds can't exist". I still have my doubts which is why those discussions are so interesting to me.

 

2 hours ago, Bazooka Jesus said:

Imagine a stone. How can you say that this stone exists? You can say it exists because it contrasts with its surrounding, i.e. everything that is "not stone". Otherwise, you could not see/experience the stone. Right?

Now take away the surrounding. Imagine that the stone is literally ALL that exists. Does the stone still exist as a stone? No, of course not! "Stone" is a concept that only makes sense in conjunction / in contrast with its opposite... just as there is no white without black. If everything that existed was the color white, the concept of "white" would loose all meaning. Make sense?

Yes that makes sense to every possible concept that is NOT ABSOLUTE. But if we want to describe the SUBSTRATUM then it does not. Because Reality is made out of Something/Nothing (depending on how you look at it) and the substance of this Something/Nothing is precisely Awareness/I AM-ness. Yes, using any word does not do it justice beacuse if it is Absolute then language loses it's meaning, but that is only language's weakness. But the fact remains that this DREAM is somehow constructed. And the substance of it is Emptyness/Light/I AM-ness. 

I geniuinely believe that we are trying to point to the same thing but you look at the emptyness/formless aspect of this thing and you try to point to it by using ->> "          ". But I try to point it by using the concept "I AM-ness" which is also a bad word but it gets you the feeling of the nature of this SUBSTRATUM. The is no "me" in this egoless "I AM-ness" but still I AM/Awareness is what reality is. 

 

[Arthogaan]

5 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

Exactly. That whole thing about only you existing is completely absurd. That is to say something from the conceptual mind, because the concept "your only exists" in the conceptual mind, outside the conceptual mind there is only pure existence, there is no you, no others, no god, no nothing, there is the infinite now existing, You can't label it because if you do, you are creating the mental barrier that you precisely want to dissolve. All the concepts exist in opposition of another concept. Reality is absolute, so has not opposite, so all the concepts are false  .It is obvious, without understanding this, there are only slaves of the mind. Freedom is out of the mind. 

This is good stuff, thank you @Breakingthewall. 

I somewhat agree, but then still... it's like in this radically consciouss state where as you write: "outside the conceptual mind there is only pure existence, there is no you, no others, no god, no nothing, there is the infinite now existing". I agree, but there is still this PURE EXISTENCE, which is made out of PURE EGOLESS I AM. Pure Awareness, Pure Imagination/ Pure Mind. And in that state there is only one PURE EXISTENCE, not two, not 8billion. THERE IS ONLY ONE I AM. 

Again using analogy of the dream. In reality there is no my dream character and no other dream characters. But the dream is still Solipsistic as there is only ONE MIND dreaming it. Absolute Solipsism does not claim there is only one character inside the dream. It claims that there is ONLY ONE MIND dreaming the dream and that you are THE MIND and not the character inside. @Leo Gura


@Bazooka Jesus @Breakingthewall:
Saying that "YOU ARE THE ONLY THING EXISTING" has it's risk that someone will think that their dream character is the only thing existing which would not be true. Because from the point of view of the dream character there are other minds. (Like @Razard86 described, when you imagine that it is true)

And another approach is saying that there is no "YOU" in this PURE EXISTENCE state. But it has the risk of not dissolving the idea of objective reality and other EXISTENCEs/MINDS outside of THIS PURE EXISTENCE.

So using words to describe this bring certain conceptual misconception risks. And I genuinely believe that we all try to describe the same PURE EXISTENCE. But the language is just so poor. 

Edited September 16, 2023 by Arthogaan

[De Sade]

10 hours ago, OBEler said:

@De Sade dont be offened by me  showing you your delusions, I was just honest with you. You could directly ask me instead and I could give you a direct simple answer: 

Do 5 meo dmt or 5 meo malt many times. They are the most effective tools right now on this planet. There you get your experiences. 

 

 

I wasn't offended,i was just kidding,if there was offense here then this place wouldn't have been a community but toxic hellhole.

[De Sade]

4 hours ago, OBEler said:

The guy who wrote this article wrote in the comment section below the article, that he proofed that solipsism is wrong:

"Here is my philosophical proof that solipsism is false. I have already placed it within the body of the text. But rather than make you look for it, I will also add it here. The proof is actually quite brief. As always criticisms are welcome. This is deduction, not physical evidence.

Section: Always Make The Choice That Gives Everyone Free Will

The minimum number of awarenesses needed for a shared existence to have BOTH absolute morality and free will is 3. I suspect this is also the basis for moral law, not man-made exploitative law. It also seems that law cannot exist unless there are at least 3 conscious beings. 3 is also the basis for the family unit; father, mother, and child. I therefore conclude that any type of conscious being, animals too, can potentially evolve to godhood. The crime of existence is to prevent this potential from developing. If only you exist, morality is not needed. If only two awarenesses exist, with you being one of them, then you will have to be either good or evil. Psychologically speaking, this could be the framework for brainwashing or manipulating someone. If three awarenesses exist, with you being one of them, then you can finally make a choice. I believe this would also disprove solipsism. You are capable of choice correct? Therefore solipsism is false and the current existence that we all share has at least 3 awarenesses."

"You're real, I'm real, all 8 billion people on this planet are real. No one has to die, no one has to suffer. We can all become immortal, all of us. We can all live forever."

"I am not a religious man. My observation is that religion has caused more harm than good. I consider myself an atheist. And even though I am an atheist, I do consider myself a moral being."   How can he then write such an article? He must copy pasted everything from leo gura and other sources, veganism, conspiracy theorys, mixed them all together to fit his confused worldview. This guy is total lost!

Then maybe i should just take some of what he says that actually makes sense for granted and not care for the rest ?

[Yimpa]

2 hours ago, Arthogaan said:

So using words to describe this bring certain conceptual misconception risks. And I genuinely believe that we all try to describe the same PURE EXISTENCE. But the language is just so poor. 

The language is not the problem.

You can understand all of Reality completely dumbfounded, and maybe with only a few words uttered out of your/God’s mouth.