Zen Devils

[De Sade]

Describe here what would be considered to be "Zen Devil" people/beahviour.

[tuku747]

Hmmmm...

 

[De Sade]

3 hours ago, tuku747 said:

Hmmmm...

 

Are those...supposed to be 666 ? 

[De Sade]

3 hours ago, tuku747 said:

Hmmmm...

 

Are those...supposed to be 666 ? 

[Razard86]

3 hours ago, De Sade said:

Are those...supposed to be 666 ? 

I never knew what people were talking about with the 666 thing and now I finally get it!! Thanks for illuminating that for me. I was like...where is this 666 and I see it clearly in this picture. 

Also we all got a little Zen Devil in all of us. But some behaviors would be

1. Dismissing the feelings/emotions of others. I do understand that the truth hurts and sometimes you have to tell people things that will hurt their feelings...but a skillful truth teller wields a thin sword, an unskillful truth teller clumsily wields a broad sword. 

2. Claiming to have knowledge you do not know for sure. Assumption is the mother of all you know what. 

3. Scamming people of their money and promising spiritual gifts/powers/prestige/status etc.. in return

4. Taking advantage sexually of those who are very impressionable/vulnerable to your charms.

5. Spreading misinformation about the teachings of other teachers and demonizing them

6. Starting a cult ^^^Most of these are behaviors of those who start them lol

7. Showing favoritism to certain students of yours within your fold if you are running a class and ignoring complaints about said student and giving them a free pass to not be called out

8. Breaking the law in a way that most in the Spiritual Community would not condone and using Spiritual Teachings to excuse it.

9. This last one is a joke....but most governments would take it serious....encouraging behavior that threatens national security

[De Sade]

4 hours ago, Razard86 said:

I never knew what people were talking about with the 666 thing and now I finally get it!! Thanks for illuminating that for me. I was like...where is this 666 and I see it clearly in this picture. 

Also we all got a little Zen Devil in all of us. But some behaviors would be

1. Dismissing the feelings/emotions of others. I do understand that the truth hurts and sometimes you have to tell people things that will hurt their feelings...but a skillful truth teller wields a thin sword, an unskillful truth teller clumsily wields a broad sword. 

2. Claiming to have knowledge you do not know for sure. Assumption is the mother of all you know what. 

3. Scamming people of their money and promising spiritual gifts/powers/prestige/status etc.. in return

4. Taking advantage sexually of those who are very impressionable/vulnerable to your charms.

5. Spreading misinformation about the teachings of other teachers and demonizing them

6. Starting a cult ^^^Most of these are behaviors of those who start them lol

7. Showing favoritism to certain students of yours within your fold if you are running a class and ignoring complaints about said student and giving them a free pass to not be called out

8. Breaking the law in a way that most in the Spiritual Community would not condone and using Spiritual Teachings to excuse it.

9. This last one is a joke....but most governments would take it serious....encouraging behavior that threatens national security

All of this makes sense,Thank you. But how not to dismiss other people's emotions/feelings ? If they are all me,and not real,and just projections of my mind,how could i deal with it ?

[r0ckyreed]

Connor Murphy, Osho.

[ivankiss]

It is someone who may or may not have had valid spiritual/mystical experiences/realizations, and consciously chooses to use that wisdom to satisfy and justify their twisted, selfish ways. Which more often than not comes at the expense of other's wellbeing. Exploitation, abuse, manipulation... painted with spiritual colours. That's what it is.

A true zen devil, who has attained true realization, is likely just hurting really bad and is extremely confused. It's most likely just a phase.

Someone who's faking being a zen devil (lol), meaning that they have not have any kind of true insights or realizations, and are just straigh out abusing the shit out of everything, intentionally, feeding on the pain of others in the name of God... Well, that... that's no zen devil. That's just a slightly more cleaver piece of shit than your average everyday scumbags.

If you are really committed and are walking your own path, you will inevitably come across the temptation to be a bit of a zen devil yourself, at one point or another. And you might even fall into that trap and stay there for a while. As said, it can be just a phase. I certainly went through it, to some extent. Still dip my toes in there, every now and then. But I know it's just a part of the process. Just like developing a spiritual ego, that you have to dissolve at some point, if you are real about this 'work'.

Edited September 13, 2023 by ivankiss

[Hojo]

Maybe rasputin. There nothing wrong with being one. People get pissed that they are not following the 'rules' but you may be a disobedient spirit and God loves that. Its cool to be one.

If i could pick to become awake and fuck en mass or become a warlord,  or be like a ghandi and cut everything fun out i would pick the former

Edited September 13, 2023 by Hojo

[Ajax]

People who parrot words, concepts, practices, techniques, without sufficient understanding.

[SeaMonster]

You have to distinguish between Zen Devil behavior and just plain Devil behavior.

Zen Devils are typically first or possibly second stage awakening types.  The most notorious examples would be Charles Manson, Jim Morrison,  Rasputin as was mentioned above, Andrew Cohen, etc.

Zen Devilry = nihilism and anarchy let loose after No-Self is stabilized.

[Hojo]

@De Sade  everyone is special and you have absolutely no idea why where or how anyone is thinking or feeling. Its always an ego projection what you think people are thinking or feeling even when you visibly see that they are in distress or not. Almost 100 percent what you think is happening is not happening. Ego is as infinitely complex as anything else in the universe and it controls what thoughts people hear.

we all have thoughts running through our minds insecurities and everything else that we project onto others and then think things that are said and done are hurting or not hurting them. but ultimately its all a projection of ourselves cause there is literally nothing out there its completely empty, there is nothing but light.Its like a painted picture. the space between you and another human is infinite if you see someone crying and you feel it its not them its you projecting the emotions they feel on yourself.

i saw a video one time and there were two men and there was a crackhead nodding out on the side of the street and one of the dudes said man thats just sad. and the other guy said he feels a hell of a lot better than you do right now.

and inside that man could have been experiencing complete peace and happiness and could have been with god

this is why you should stop caring about what others feel or think. you have no idea if they are being deceptive, honest or anything

 

Edited September 13, 2023 by Hojo

[Francis777]

9 hours ago, ivankiss said:

It is someone who may or may not have had valid spiritual/mystical experiences/realizations, and consciously chooses to use that wisdom to satisfy and justify their twisted, selfish ways. Which more often than not comes at the expense of other's wellbeing. Exploitation, abuse, manipulation... painted with spiritual colours. That's what it is.

A true zen devil, who has attained true realization, is likely just hurting  really bad and is extremely confused. It's most likely just a phase.

Someone who's faking being a zen devil (lol), meaning that they have not have any kind of true insights or realizations, and are just straigh out abusing the shit out of everything, intentionally, feeding on the pain of others in the name of God... Well, that... that's no zen devil. That's just a slightly more cleaver piece of shit than your average everyday scumbags.

If you are really committed and are walking your own path, you will inevitably come across the temptation to be a bit of a zen devil yourself, at one point or another. And you might even fall into that trap and stay there for a while. As said, it can be just a phase. I certainly went through it, to some extent. Still dip my toes in there, every now and then. But I know it's just a part of the process. Just like developing a spiritual ego, that you have to dissolve at some point, if you are real about this 'work'.

Good explanation, it’s the same as purging through any other selfish motives, whether it’s from abusing your increased awareness you may or may not have developed or stealing from someone. It’s selfish intentions just now you abuse the advantage of increased consciousness.

Edited September 13, 2023 by Francis777

[De Sade]

2 hours ago, Hojo said:

@De Sade  everyone is special and you have absolutely no idea why where or how anyone is thinking or feeling. Its always an ego projection what you think people are thinking or feeling even when you visibly see that they are in distress or not. Almost 100 percent what you think is happening is not happening. Ego is as infinitely complex as anything else in the universe and it controls what thoughts people hear.

we all have thoughts running through our minds insecurities and everything else that we project onto others and then think things that are said and done are hurting or not hurting them. but ultimately its all a projection of ourselves cause there is literally nothing out there its completely empty, there is nothing but light.Its like a painted picture. the space between you and another human is infinite if you see someone crying and you feel it its not them its you projecting the emotions they feel on yourself.

i saw a video one time and there were two men and there was a crackhead nodding out on the side of the street and one of the dudes said man thats just sad. and the other guy said he feels a hell of a lot better than you do right now.

and inside that man could have been experiencing complete peace and happiness and could have been with god

this is why you should stop caring about what others feel or think. you have no idea if they are being deceptive, honest or anything

 

You're right. People are just projections of consciousness,they are not really there. I'm the sum of all things,thus,no - thing.

[LSD-Rumi]

On 12/09/2023 at 11:24 PM, tuku747 said:

Hmmmm...

 

Leo sure have some weird taste, from these 666 things to the jungle of plants/trees behind his couch. 

Edited September 14, 2023 by LSD-Rumi

[LSD-Rumi]

Talking from the point of the absolute and dismissing the relative relative, like: nothing matters, you are responsible for all your suffering, it is all just a dream, etc... 

Edited September 14, 2023 by LSD-Rumi

[Francis777]

i dont think there meant to represent 666, i think there to represent infinity being spirals, like ying and yang. not numbers 

[Francis777]

actually yeah, the more you look at them, they are the exact same pattern as the Fibonacci sequence, just so happens to look like a 6 from that angle. They're spirals

[Razard86]

On 9/13/2023 at 4:48 AM, De Sade said:

All of this makes sense,Thank you. But how not to dismiss other people's emotions/feelings ? If they are all me,and not real,and just projections of my mind,how could i deal with it ?

How do you want to be treated? Look at situations from their perspective and ask yourself....if I was them (Which you are LOL) how would I like that person (Which you think is only you) to respond to me. It takes a lot of experience being on the other side of things for empathy to develop. Sympathy is when you can intellectually cognize what someone is going through, empathy is when you can draw from a prior experience an emotional understanding of what the other person is expressing.

This is why visualization is so powerful. If you can train your imagination to put yourself in situations of pain and terror then you can leave from those experiences with a WELLSPRING of deep empathy. This is the true value of BAD TRIPS, or suffering in your personal life. It gives you an intimate connection with vulnerability which is the NUMBER ONE FEAR. The number one fear is to be vulnerable....and the funny thing is....vulnerability is intimacy....and the path of Enlightenment is the path of intimacy....LOL.

The best thing that ever happened to me was I was bullied and ostracized as a child, and my parents beat me physically as a form of punishment. LOL. It was the greatest blessing in my entire life...but man was it HELL to live through it.

Edited September 14, 2023 by Razard86

[De Sade]

5 hours ago, Razard86 said:

How do you want to be treated? Look at situations from their perspective and ask yourself....if I was them (Which you are LOL) how would I like that person (Which you think is only you) to respond to me. It takes a lot of experience being on the other side of things for empathy to develop. Sympathy is when you can intellectually cognize what someone is going through, empathy is when you can draw from a prior experience an emotional understanding of what the other person is expressing.

This is why visualization is so powerful. If you can train your imagination to put yourself in situations of pain and terror then you can leave from those experiences with a WELLSPRING of deep empathy. This is the true value of BAD TRIPS, or suffering in your personal life. It gives you an intimate connection with vulnerability which is the NUMBER ONE FEAR. The number one fear is to be vulnerable....and the funny thing is....vulnerability is intimacy....and the path of Enlightenment is the path of intimacy....LOL.

The best thing that ever happened to me was I was bullied and ostracized as a child, and my parents beat me physically as a form of punishment. LOL. It was the greatest blessing in my entire life...but man was it HELL to live through it.

Why ?