Why is it hard to love pain and torture?

[Math]

The hardest thing to love is unbearable pain. In fact, if it wasn't for that, a lot of problems in reality wouldn't exist. There would still be sadness and melancholy, which (imo) are good because they are profound and deep emotions that create a big love... but not harsh desperation and brutality.

I got into personal development to get my things right with my social life, happiness, anxiety, friends, girls, my careeer with music and leo really helped me to solve a lot with problems. I found peace with meditation and understoo a lot about emotions, business, mental healh and truth.

But there was this thing leo was speaking about which is the fact that "the truth is that everything is you" that I couln't really get at first. I was like "okay, but i don't get it really what does he mean" 

 

Now, after some years of videos I think I'm starting to get some of this.

 

I have always been a loving guy, always moved for love. I love animals, nature and when i lost my first dog it really hurt me. I always wanted to fight for good in life and somehow be a hero (when i was younger). I was just very insecure because my dad doesn't like the fact that I want to make music, and in general he always hated my attitude towards life. He is a workaholic/rigid/very severe kind of person who doesn't like fun. So you can understand that doesn't go well with djing and electronic music nor Rap music, which are my fields... if it wasn't for my mom, I'd be a suppressed and desperate child, but thanks to her, I had help when I moved from house and wasn't alone. I've got the opportunity to receive unconditional love and support from her.
So I am a kind of person that found Leo on youtube, searching for happiness and trying to get something right (because I had a lot of insecurities which led to big problems in my social life, with my first girlfriend I was very desperate and that led to the destruction of the relationship, and with friends I always had a hard time to get respected and to fit in).

And I was very in line with a lot of things leo was saying. I liked the fact that he had a formula for things and that it was true! I always cared about truth...

 

until I really started to get it. I was a scientific minded person. atheist. with leo i shifted this and accepted spirituality. I mean, that I understand when he speaks about emotions and love and how things really work ion reality, and that science is just measurements that get confused with the thing itself. which is, apparently, immagination.

What really became a problem for me is, that i hate torture on people or animals in general, and always feared it on myself. I am very sensitive. And I had a lot of trouble when i discovered things like human trafficking, deep web, red rooms and hardcore criminal activities like snuff movies. I was traumatized, kind of, when i first heard of these things. And I didn't even know the truth yet. 
Now it's really becoming a serious issue since I grasped the concept of immortality. Now it really can't go away. It's a permanent fear in me, that things are not going to be well. Immortality is a continuous cicle of consciousness and unconsciousness and nothing won't stop it. Not even leo and gurus all around the world, even if we realise the truth and love and that that is the only direction fo life... still. unconsciousness will occur, like it's always been, and we are going through every life.
cause this separation betwenn life and non life... honestly it's just stupid, there is no difference. now i get it really, it's all conscious so, let's say you can become the rocks, the woods, the planets.. depends on the point of view of the consciousness and its perspective... and this is a thing i still don't understand... why is consciousness frammented and isn't whole? why does it have a perspective? a point of view? from which you can't be conscious of the whole consciousness itself?
but anyways... I'm having a really hard time to accept that I will be tortured to death many times forever.... and that sometimes I will have some "peace" in between...

I feel like i loved my life before so much and had hope.. now with this truth, the hope has gone. I will still fight for love forever and follow the teachings of leo.. as i said, i am like minded somehow... but I can't get over this thing of infinite reincarnation. I feel like this life is a "pause" from the suffering. there i no safety and eternal peace. If I'm getting this right.
I will be any animal, creature, conscious thing in reality which means everything possible. I'll be a dog, I'll be a rock, I'll be an atom... and who knows how much suffering there is there.
I see the higher the intelligence, the higher the pain that can be inflicted. humans really are the scariest thing of reality I know. Cause they are at low consciousness level. and who knows what other horrible things can exist and WILL exist that's a promise. that's the doom to me. I can't get over it and accept it and I am living in fear and anxiety since I understood this with the "immortality" episode.

Why does pain exist. why is it possible to ruin yourself like this. Not that I can change it... I can just do my best in this life until i'll have to let go and who knows what will happen.. I can give my contribute to reality but I look at it and see how bad the thing is. suffering is so big and selfishness is so high everywhere in animals and in humans... to a level where the bad things seem to be stronger that the good things. I mean, all of this suffering... just for a delusion. there is no victory in the other end. when a girl gets raped, an animal gets eaten, a kid tortured or an animal... that is just to serve someone who... isn't really getting anything good in the end. it's very difficult for me to love reality now that I am impersonating with everything. I feel like it's not right, something's wrong

 

Thanks for your time

[Sugarcoat]

So yea you’re just reacting to thoughts in your head , what can change is how you relate to those thoughts.
 

I’ve been like this myself in my past, one time I read about this condition that caused the most painful headaches ever so much some people kill themselves and I felt sick to my stomach for like 2 weeks straight, had trouble sleeping because of it. 

so this is very vague but like if you ground yourself deeper in your body not so much in mental reality then you can’t possibly be disturbed by such thoughts because they’re just hollow images passing by. I bet you have a strong sense of time, that’s also connected to this , when you are living from a dense mind not deep in the body then sense of time can be strong. Can be dissolved tho little by little. When you have those thoughts see if there is like a counter so bringing your attention more to your body for example .. idk . Or if you’re more outwardly then maybe connecting more to your environment and other people  to ground yourself . Idk 

Edited September 10, 2023 by Sugarcoat

[Princess Arabia]

@MathSeems like you're an Empath like I am. I'm not sure but I believe Consciousness evolves by being the elements, rocks, trees, plants  and animals  then humans (in that order) so you won't become those things again. Anyway, I can relate to this topic and also have a hard time dealing with people's pain and suffering and wondered why life had to be structured this way. I can tell you're a very passionate, deep, loving and caring person and I admire those traits.

I'm still trying to fully understand what this means and why it exists. I can assure you, though, it's not how you are perceiving it. This is an Infinite dream and Infinity includes everything, including torture, rape, animal cruelty genocide etc. Consciousness can dream up all kinds of things. Remember I'm just trying to explain this the best I can, and if I'm wrong about something maybe some other experienced person in this field can correct me.

We are here for an experience, to experience that side of Infinity we chose which is determined by our thoughts, feelings, assumptions and awareness. Everything is imagination and there's only the present moment. A lot of what you said you never really experienced directly, it came from the mind, stories, projections. The mind can get traumatized by its own stories and memories of what it believes to be true. What is your direct experience in every moment, that is Truth. All I know is the mind can conjure up stuff and it can only be in the past and future not the present, only awareness is capable of that. 

I believe when we change our beliefs and assumptions of ourselves and the world the world must rearrange it's structure to match those beliefs and assumptions. There is no outside world it is coming from within and our experiences are based on our level of awareness and State of Consciousness. So if you believe there will be rape, torture etcetc, then that will experience that in your awareness. 

There's a lot more to this but the main thing is just recognize that a lot of what you're saying are just mental projections. They are real but not happening. When I say real, I mean real to the mind and then the body responds to the mind, so trauma and all those negative emotions start to arise from what the mind thinks is happening.  You can live your whole life without experiencing any of that directly but only in the mind and still live a life of tremendous hell. It's not about living a life of suffering to come back for more suffering to eternity, but to transcend the mind, raise your awareness and level up your State of Consciousness to recognize your true nature as God and that you are the Alpha and Omega the beginning and the end, the IAM and what you are aware of is not Reality, but rather an experience within your awareness based on your assumptions.

[Raze]

Try “break through pain” by Shinzen Young 

[Math]

@Sugarcoat It gets better by staying present of course. basic advice by leo versus fear. I am just trying to focus on the world i want to create. which is something good and beautiful. that helps. in fact, i believe suffering is created when you are unaware so focusing on awarenessof course is the best deal. just makes me think sometimes that it is so easy to destroy everything good that has been done before. Seeyng what happens in the world show how stupid egothistical behaviour creates massive, crazy, unbearable amount of suffering, sometimes even without knowing, trying to not take responsability for any consequence, not being interested in the consequences. that is scary

[Sugarcoat]

8 minutes ago, Math said:

@Sugarcoat It gets better by staying present of course. basic advice by leo versus fear. I am just trying to focus on the world i want to create. which is something good and beautiful. that helps. in fact, i believe suffering is created when you are unaware so focusing on awarenessof course is the best deal. just makes me think sometimes that it is so easy to destroy everything good that has been done before. Seeyng what happens in the world show how stupid egothistical behaviour creates massive, crazy, unbearable amount of suffering, sometimes even without knowing, trying to not take responsability for any consequence, not being interested in the consequences. that is scary

Yea. The irony of it all is that I believe the best thing we can do for the world is to focus on ourselves.

average person does average things can make average impact

Great person does great things can make great impact 

[Math]

@Princess Arabia i don't know if the stages are like you say, i believe it's rather casual and you may become the "ground" when you die, but really you don't know, then maybe you re-start from zero, to plants, the you die as a plant and return to peace with the ground, then ecc. ecc. or maybe it works completely different and you get to the other side of reality and a new dream completely different starts... we don't know! but we know there will be everything. it will never stop. and if EVERYTHING is possible for INFINITY that really doesn't take anything out from the equation. EVERYTHING is possible. a duality creates 2 sides. 50%. apparently it seems like reality is at peace as one.

When a duality is created, just for the sake of creativity and infinity, and unawareness is in place, i don't know how, but you perceive your perspective only and not all of creation. for example, the table in front of me, or a person. they are real as an image, but i don't feel anything if i manipulate them. it may be impossible to understand and become aware of the fact that you are inflicting on yourself while inflicting on others. that's very scary too.

 

Yes i have a very strong sense of time but i know it's imaginary. simply, a present moment is continuously changing. its impermanence may be perceived as time when it's possible to archieve and have a memory. so it's a feature. yet, there is no way to get back in time cause now it's just an image and reality is only moving one direction

[Math]

@Sugarcoat best thing is being selfless and help others, when that is possible.

the problem is people do interests for a couple of friends or its family, and doesn't care at all about the outside

[Math]

@Princess Arabia sometimes you will be so focused on good, that you have never seen bad things. you can't even imagine them. then something really horrid can happen to you. imagine in the '800 you go in a hotel. there they invite you but when you sleep they take you to the cellar and torture you to death. no internet, no proves, nobody will never find out. it's just an example.

or a little girl in a city in africa that is not afraid and goes for adventure then a man catches her and torture her and rapes her. this will happen without any possible control to you. and i mean, to me,

[Sugarcoat]

1 minute ago, Math said:

@Sugarcoat best thing is being selfless and help others, when that is possible.

the problem is people do interests for a couple of friends or its family, and doesn't care at all about the outside

Mm I see. Having strong enough desire is a major thing I believe 

 

 

[Yimpa]

4 hours ago, Math said:

Not that I can change it... I can just do my best in this life until i'll have to let go and who knows what will happen..

Change your relationship to what brings you pain. Let go, in this context, does not mean to get rid of.

[Math]

@Sugarcoat i don't know. when i was a child i wanted to stop dog fights and save them for example. because i love dogs.

now even realizing that I AM the dogs and that i was the dogs and i will be the dogs (sorry if i speak as if time is real, actually all are real as one in one present moment) creates an even bigger urge and responsability towards that.

or, i always wanted to defend girls. now that i've seen how they have been, and are still treated in most free environments where law isn't strong, makes me see what horrid things happen. Now even nowing that I AM that girl. and that i was and will be... makes me want to change that

[Princess Arabia]

9 minutes ago, Math said:

imagine

Consciousness left itself clues, this is one of them. You're making my point even more. You don't see that because you're stuck in the dream.

[Math]

@Yimpa I shouldn't get rid of the pain... ok.  that, in fact, would not be possible. for how much you'd love to get rid of the pain and not experience it while you are being tortured, for example, that is not possible of course. So I should sacrifice you say. that would be letting go. sacrificing i mean, accepting the pain and suffer for "who's making you suffer"'s sake. so having a mentality of love towards your aggressor?

I don't know... sounds like the only positive thing you could do in that situation... but the reality is being tortured can't be anything but the worst experience ever

[Math]

@Raze can't find the exact episode on youtube

[Math]

@Princess Arabia i know i'm imagining... but let's not be foolish. it will happen! you don't need to imagine it. I am, but still... shit will happen D:

[Princess Arabia]

3 minutes ago, Math said:

@Sugarcoat i don't know. when i was a child i wanted to stop dog fights and save them for example. because i love dogs.

now even realizing that I AM the dogs and that i was the dogs and i will be the dogs (sorry if i speak as if time is real, actually all are real as one in one present moment) creates an even bigger urge and responsability towards that.

or, i always wanted to defend girls. now that i've seen how they have been, and are still treated in most free environments where law isn't strong, makes me see what horrid things happen. Now even nowing that I AM that girl. and that i was and will be... makes me want to change that

I think you're mistaking the ego self for who you truly are. The real you never hurt a fly. When its said that you are them and they are you, that's not referring to the manifested ego who thinks its real. Its real only in the imagination. You have to not look at it as if you are a self doing anything. Your true nature is my true nature, experiencing itself from different perspectives thats what I am you and you are me is. 

[Raze]

3 minutes ago, Math said:

@Raze can't find the exact episode on youtube

It’s a audiobook 

[Math]

@Princess Arabia egos are created, why do i only experience what i see, what i feel in my body, my imagination and nothing else

[Princess Arabia]

3 minutes ago, Math said:

@Princess Arabia i know i'm imagining... but let's not be foolish. it will happen! you don't need to imagine it. I am, but still... shit will happen D:

Ok. I'm through.