Childhood trauma, depression and 5meo

[OBEler]

@Sincerity sorry when this gets too Private but can you Name exactly what Was previously meaning full to you and then became total pointless? 

Were it small things like realizing it doesnt matter if your favorite Sport teams wins or not? 

Edited August 11, 2023 by OBEler

[Yimpa]

Just now, OBEler said:

sorry when this gets too Private but can you Name exactly what Was previously meaning full to you and then became total pointless? 

For me, certain relationships changed meaning significantly, but for the better.

For example, one relationship started off like lightning in a bottle, seemingly out of nowhere and completely unplanned. I tried so hard to recapture that moment after the initial high point, but then I slowly began to realize that letting them go and live their own life freely was the best thing for the both of us. 

[Sincerity]

15 minutes ago, OBEler said:

@Sincerity sorry when this gets too Private but can you Name exactly what Was previously meaning full to you and then became total pointless? 

Were it small things like realizing it doesnt matter if your favorite Sport teams wins or not? 

Not totally pointless, but more pointless:

Keeping an organized commonplace book, writing reports from each week month and year, analyzing my past and how I've changed, setting monthly/yearly goals, saving and keeping track of insights, writing trip reports, buying myself new clothes, arguing and convincing people close to me, studying politics, even travelling to a degree... these are off the top of my head.

Again I'll note it's not all psychedelics' fault, it's complicated & not all of this is "negative" obviously.

Edited August 11, 2023 by Sincerity

[shree]

9 hours ago, Javfly33 said:

I found 5-MeO trips quite therapeutic in regards to trauma!

But I recommend the OP to try psilocybin/4-aco-dmt . By far the psychedelic that has most helped me @shree

Thank you for this Info. I will inform myself more about these substances.

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

@shree No one can predict how you will react. Even from trip to trip your reactions could vary.

Yes, there is a chance that 5-MeO will open things up in your mind and force you to confront difficult existential material, including depression.

Any deep and serious trip can leave you depressed for a while because you are confronting life, death, love, etc.

Could 5meo MALT be a better choice for a first-timer with unresolved underlying issues? Do you recommend I have an experienced trip sitter who I trust on my first trip? I am asking because you were not recommending trip sitters before.

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You can create other new meanings, however psychedelics can undermine meaning across the board, so you should be careful. You might undermine stuff that you will regret. Obviously this is a very personal matter. But undermining of meaning can be a painful and dysfunctional thing if done too hastily. You don't want to lose your passion for life. If you strip away all of life's meaning you will end up depressed with nothing to live for. This becomes more of a risk if you do a lot of psychedelics. So keep an eye out for that and dial if back if you are starting to lose too much meaning.

Now, this is a second problem.

After many hours working on it, I almost finished your Life Purpose Course and I have a strong feeling that after my first trip, the outcome will be messed up.

[StarStruck]

Your mind is like a knife. And psychedelics only sharpens the knife so it really depends on how you use the knife if it will help you or not. If you start cutting in your own hand it won’t be good for you. If you use the knife to cut through gordian knots psychedelics can be great. 

[Leo Gura]

8 hours ago, shree said:

Could 5meo MALT be a better choice for a first-timer with unresolved underlying issues?

They are very similar.

Quote

Do you recommend I have an experienced trip sitter who I trust on my first trip? I am asking because you were not recommending trip sitters before.

Hard to say because I don't know you.

It can be done safely without one. But if you don't trust yourself then use a trip stitter.

I'd say the first few trips are not the real danger. The danger comes much later as you do many trips and start to get cocky and sloppy.

Quote

Now, this is a second problem.

After many hours working on it, I almost finished your Life Purpose Course and I have a strong feeling that after my first trip, the outcome will be messed up.

A few trips is unlikely to mess that up. But again, there are no guarantees.

Edited August 12, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Thought Art]

2 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

.

I'd say the first few trips are not the real danger. The danger comes much later as you do many trips and start to get cocky and sloppy.

.

My experience 

[Jodistrict]

If your psychotherapist does real psychotherapy and not the usual worthless shrink chitchat I would stick with her.   Trying to force a traumatized mind with drugs doesn’t lead to a good outcome.  The process needs to unfold organically on its own time schedule.  I now prefer to practice an authentic yoga while sober.   You are confronting forces that are really spiritual, much more than psychological.   You could go psychotic on 5-meo and end up in a hospital.  I am speaking as someone who has taken strong doses of Bufo Alvarius many times over four years.

[shree]

On 11/08/2023 at 6:15 PM, OBEler said:

@Sincerity can you elaborate? 

For me spirituality, exploring consciousness, developing my mind and body gives me high meaning in life. Dont know how psychedelics could undermine these, they even raise my meaning more the more I take

It makes things easier if your life´s purpose is already aligned with the use of psychedelics and exploring consciousness. I am also super interested in philosophy, spirituality, and all of the subjects that actualized.org is about and it could also launch me in that direction which has nothing to do with my current big passion.

14 hours ago, Jodistrict said:

If your psychotherapist does real psychotherapy and not the usual worthless shrink chitchat I would stick with her.   Trying to force a traumatized mind with drugs doesn’t lead to a good outcome.  The process needs to unfold organically on its own time schedule.  I now prefer to practice an authentic yoga while sober.   You are confronting forces that are really spiritual, much more than psychological.   You could go psychotic on 5-meo and end up in a hospital.  I am speaking as someone who has taken strong doses of Bufo Alvarius many times over four years.

Yep, I am not at all interested in taking SSRIs because they are not aligned with my values. She also told me that she crosses many people who finish in hospital after usage of psychedelics... But of course, it's questionable, what they exactly used, how much, and what was their mental state, set and setting..... I will keep your words in mind.

[shree]

15 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Hard to say because I don't know you.

It can be done safely without one. But if you don't trust yourself then use a trip stitter.

I'd say the first few trips are not the real danger. The danger comes much later as you do many trips and start to get cocky and sloppy.

 

Well, I guess we don't know until I do it. As soon I come across 5meo MALT ( which is super hard to find ) I will plug a minimal dose and test it and hopefully increase the dosage over time.

I will report as soon as it happens.

[Raze]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPKCddixD_M

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiAr3Hgbv60

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4hCKflUUrw4

 

[Breakingthewall]

On 10/8/2023 at 9:34 PM, shree said:

do not care if I scream and suffer in agony for some short amount of time if that is going to help me to let some terrible things from my past go and I would stick 5meo in my ass in this moment if I would have at least some assurances that I will stay functional because I have a family that depends on me.

The thing is, what you mentioned before about childhood trauma and that, is something that is very common in the West, I would say that it comes from weak and very unconscious parents, which is the usual thing, and we develop as invalids, with great difficulty. in my experience, there is only one solution: real awakening. transcendence. The shit you've inherited can't be fixed, and 10 years of psychotherapy aren't going to get you out of there. your roots are rotten, your foundations are made of clay. all your life you're going to be screwed, every minute, unless you transcend. it's challenging work, and 5 meo is the tool. And your will to understand, to see.  if you want to achieve something, prepare to do it hundreds of times, and another psychedelics.  the total psychedelic path, no shortcuts. break the human. This is the real path. You will see. 

Edited August 12, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[Yimpa]

19 hours ago, shree said:

Yep, I am not at all interested in taking SSRIs because they are not aligned with my values.

I relate to that. I’ve tried a bunch of SSRIs and psychiatric meds when I was a teenager (I’m 27 now). Most would work for a few weeks, but then I’d stop taking them. I intuitively knew they were like bandages to me; not allowing deep exploration of my psychological issues. 

This trial and error approach eventually came to good use, though. Two years ago I did ketamine infusions at a clinic. Before they accept you, there’s a thorough interview process. They want to make sure you’ve tried several conventional meds first. So, of course, I had a long list of stuff I’ve already tried, and they were very happy to accept me 

7 rounds of ketamine later, I was able to uncover psychological traumas far deeper than any conventional meds I’ve tried. 6 sessions were done under the guidance of a therapist (she’s done a shit ton of psychedelics herself); then the final session I did solo with just a nurse monitoring me.

Sounds easy? Not at all. This required facing a ton of suffering post infusion. Sometimes even during the trip. My mental health became significantly worse than before I started ketamine, but it slowly got a lot better. 

It takes courage to undergo such treatment, but it can yield powerful results if you’re willing to put your entire heart into it. 

[shree]

21 hours ago, Raze said:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPKCddixD_M

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiAr3Hgbv60

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4hCKflUUrw4

@Raze Very helpful, I will watch them all, thank you.

18 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

The thing is, what you mentioned before about childhood trauma and that, is something that is very common in the West, I would say that it comes from weak and very unconscious parents, which is the usual thing, and we develop as invalids, with great difficulty. in my experience, there is only one solution: real awakening. transcendence. The shit you've inherited can't be fixed, and 10 years of psychotherapy aren't going to get you out of there. your roots are rotten, your foundations are made of clay. all your life you're going to be screwed, every minute, unless you transcend. it's challenging work, and 5 meo is the tool. And your will to understand, to see.  if you want to achieve something, prepare to do it hundreds of times, and another psychedelics.  the total psychedelic path, no shortcuts. break the human. This is the real path. You will see. 

@Breakingthewall Yes, I am born in the Balkans during the war and grew up in a very stage-blue family with a father who had big alcohol problems. 

I agree that my roots are rotten. I am a very functional human today, not seeing myself as depressive or anything similar but Paul Stamets Microdosing Protocol triggered some dark things from the past in me, therefore there is a possibility that stronger psychedelics do it in a much harsher way.  My plan was to continue microdosing and working with a psychotherapist for some time. 

 

1 hour ago, Yimpa said:

I relate to that. I’ve tried a bunch of SSRIs and psychiatric meds when I was a teenager (I’m 27 now). Most would work for a few weeks, but then I’d stop taking them. I intuitively knew they were like bandages to me; not allowing deep exploration of my psychological issues. 

This trial and error approach eventually came to good use, though. Two years ago I did ketamine infusions at a clinic. Before they accept you, there’s a thorough interview process. They want to make sure you’ve tried several conventional meds first. So, of course, I had a long list of stuff I’ve already tried, and they were very happy to accept me 

7 rounds of ketamine later, I was able to uncover psychological traumas far deeper than any conventional meds I’ve tried. 6 sessions were done under the guidance of a therapist (she’s done a shit ton of psychedelics herself); then the final session I did solo with just a nurse monitoring me.

Sounds easy? Not at all. This required facing a ton of suffering post infusion. Sometimes even during the trip. My mental health became significantly worse than before I started ketamine, but it slowly got a lot better. 

It takes courage to undergo such treatment, but it can yield powerful results if you’re willing to put your entire heart into it. 

@Yimpa Good to hear an opinion from somebody who has a personal experience with SSRIs and its cool to read about your Ketamin experience. Unfortunately in Germany where I live now, ketamine and similar things are still not used in treating psychological issues...

I am glad that you are better today and that you can explore consciences using psychedelics. 

[Breakingthewall]

38 minutes ago, shree said:

agree that my roots are rotten.

Maybe I project too much, and I imagine that all cases are similar to mine. I think that in general, Western civilized humans are very far from the essence of life after many generations of relative well-being and comfort. humans fear life and it's normal, life is implies death. we try to build our security capsule to be safe and this generates neuroses. weakness, psyches built on castles of cards, without solid foundations, evasive, addicted to the mind and crazy. the generation of well-being is the generation of anxiety and suffering, but disguised as happiness. a path of evasion and denial of death that ends in the hells of the hospital and nursing homes. We have a revolution to make, which is to reconnect with reality. it seems that it's what reality wants and what it has sought with this strange existential twist that is the human being. Let's see what's happens

Edited August 13, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[cjoseph90]

On 13/8/2023 at 8:34 PM, Breakingthewall said:

Maybe I project too much, and I imagine that all cases are similar to mine. I think that in general, Western civilized humans are very far from the essence of life after many generations of relative well-being and comfort. humans fear life and it's normal, life is implies death. we try to build our security capsule to be safe and this generates neuroses. weakness, psyches built on castles of cards, without solid foundations, evasive, addicted to the mind and crazy. the generation of well-being is the generation of anxiety and suffering, but disguised as happiness. a path of evasion and denial of death that ends in the hells of the hospital and nursing homes. We have a revolution to make, which is to reconnect with reality. it seems that it's what reality wants and what it has sought with this strange existential twist that is the human being. Let's see what's happens

good points here!

[shree]

Are you prepared for the truth?

Sure thing, I love the truth!

Can you handle it?

Fuck... NO... NO...

 

I found myself in a quadratic room, with a mysterious machine standing in the center. This machine represented everything about me - my past, present, future, my very identity.

 

In this room, a middle-aged, unkempt mechanic joined me and the machine. He ventured to the darkest corner, searching for something. And when he found it, I saw it too, illuminated in my mind's eye.

 

There it was, a dirty, dusty part of the machine, untouched and neglected for years. The bearded mechanic wore a mischievous smile, hinting at something unexpected.

 

He blew away the grime and seamlessly integrated that neglected part with the machine. And then it hit me, like a sledgehammer.

 

-I am a survivor of sexual abuse!

 

That forgotten part was the missing piece to understanding myself.

Suddenly, everything made sense.

My bias towards sex, my desperate neediness, my fascination with books about suffering - it all stemmed from this deep-rooted trauma.

I was simultaneously repulsed by those who embraced sexuality and yet, paradoxically, I cherished and craved the act itself.

And the reason behind my actions became clear.

 

You see, during a vulnerable period of my life, when I longed for warmth and comfort, I experienced the unthinkable - sexual molestation, most likely at the hands of my father.

 

The truth hit me like a thunderbolt.

I've got three options:

1. Do I want to relive that trauma?

2. Can I love it?

3. Do I embrace this as a self-chosen experience?

 

Option three resonated with me as the initial step towards healing. The others may follow suit, but for now, acceptance is key. I recognize that releasing this trauma may require delving back into the depths of my experiences, perhaps even finding love in the act itself.

 

This is my trip report on 5MeO MALT...

 

WHAT THE FUCK just Happened? I never in my wildest dreams expected this...

[OBEler]

@shree oh man thats heavy!! You never remembered this? Insane how the mind can lock events to protect itself. 

But Congratulations for open this up! Maybe the key for your healing. I didnt know 5 meo malt can Show you such things.

Your choise of these options sounds wise. 

 

 

[shree]

8 minutes ago, OBEler said:

@shree oh man thats heavy!! You never remembered this? Insane how the mind can lock events to protect itself. 

But Congratulations for open this up! Maybe the key for your healing. I didnt know 5 meo malt can Show you such things.

Your choise of these options sounds wise. 

 

 

I had zero visuals. This was just my mind's way of guiding me through. 

I did have some hints throughout my life...

Korn - Daddy

Edited December 3, 2023 by shree

[OBEler]

@shree Crazy how you discovered something so deep with the help of a chemical. Hope you can integrate that one to the good my friend

This song sounds so disturbing, I feel really sorry for all molested children. Thats total fucked up