Someone please talk Christianity out of me.

[ValiantSalvatore]

Mechanistic wordviews and Christian ideas are almost one and the samething, a more realistic thing to say is simply most Christians etc. Don't have a real practice that produces higher/later states of consciouness, there are some smaller people.

 

I dunno everytime I do retreats and enter a more profound existence I hear church bells and it really helps to deepen my spiritual connection even if there is a lot of "evil" inside the church, same goes for hearing a minaret or a muslim guy singing deeply to Allah etc. 

I can deeply resonate with some of the content of the Bible etc. depending on how that level of depth is conveyed or how I experienced it. 

Generally reading any of this without reading about other traditions is simply dangerous, some cross-paradigmatic thinking has to occure. 

Edited August 7, 2023 by ValiantSalvatore

[MAHAVATAR_-_BABAJI]

16 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Personally I enjoy studying history purely for its own sake.

If you want to study religion as a historical, cultural phenomenon I got not issue with that. But a problem arises if that kind of study is confused with spiritual progress. It can easily become a distraction, as it does for most religious people.

Sure, look at other sources. I recommend modern sources over ancient ones because the ancient ones are so obscure.

Do whatever you want but I cannot endorse organized religion or the Christian church. It creates too much delusion in my view.

---------

Look, in the end you guys do spirituality however you feel like. I advance a certain set of teachings and values which are not going to suit everyone. I advance them because I find them to be very powerful and novel. This comes with certain tradeoffs and costs.

If you want to stand on your head while screaming the name of Jesus Christ as your spiritual practice, what am I supposed to say to that? Is it wrong? Should you do it?

???????????

[Leo Gura]

4 hours ago, Razard86 said:

THERE IS NO HARM in visiting a Christian Church

If you go a few times as a tourist, sure. But if you are actually seriously going to church and consuming their dogma in the hope of realizing God, that can be a serious obstacle to Awakening.

It's not a matter of fear, it's a matter of avoiding distractions that will waste decades of your life.

Edited August 7, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Inliytened1]

No one can talk Christianity out of you.  You have to have an open mind and then be willing to do spiritual practices alone - by yourself - looking into your self. Meditation and self inquiry- to name them.  You must be completely free of bias to find Truth.   If your mind has binded to a particular belief then you are paradigm locked and will remain trapped within the dream.  The only way to wake up from the dream to is be to be completely free of this, and open minded and curious. 

Edited August 7, 2023 by Inliytened1

[Juan]

What helped me to start to question the religion I was (catholic) was cable TV lol. I was on 7th grade (this was when Myspace was bigger than Facebook, so 2006) and I started to watch History channel where they talk about space, aliens, the pyramids/ egyptians, the world, etc. I was SO AMAZED by what is going on outside and inside planet Earth. After that moment I started to ask deeper question like “Why do I and people go to Church?, Is it mandatory to go to Church?, Do I believe in God? What is God really anyway? Who wrote the bible!?” And looking to Spiral Dynamics hehe, I started to penetrate stage Orange habits and beliefs. 

Edited August 7, 2023 by Juan

[Inliytened1]

6 minutes ago, Juan said:

What helped me to start to question the religion I was (catholic) was cable TV lol. I was on 7th grade (this was when Myspace was bigger than Facebook, so 2006) and I started to watch History channel where they talk about space, aliens, the pyramids/ egyptians, the world, etc. I was SO AMAZED by what is going on outside and inside planet Earth. After that moment I started to ask deeper question like “Why do I and people go to Church?, Is it mandatory to go to Church?, Do I believe in God? What is God really anyway? Who wrote the bible!?” And looking to Spiral Dynamics hehe, I started to penetrate stage Orange habits and beliefs. 

No.  It was your open mindedness.  This can't be given to you.

[Juan]

1 minute ago, Inliytened1 said:

No.  It was your open mindedness.  This can't be given to you.

It was both, without haven’t had cable TV and watch History channel specifically, I wouldn’t had started to ask those questions, maybe later on who knows, but at that moment, it was thanks by that. 

[Inliytened1]

6 minutes ago, Juan said:

It was both, without haven’t had cable TV and watch History channel specifically, I wouldn’t had started to ask those questions, maybe later on who knows, but at that moment, it was thanks by that. 

The point is you entertained other possibilities. Many are completely closed off to this.

Edited August 7, 2023 by Inliytened1

[Razard86]

59 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

If you go a few times as a tourist, sure. But if you are actually seriously going to church and consuming their dogma in the hope of realizing God, that can be a serious obstacle to Awakening.

It's not a matter of fear, it's a matter of avoiding distractions that will waste decades of your life.

1. I have already had many awakenings, and already deconstructed reality. I literally have a direct connection with reality sober.

2. This fear of yours you need to address, of course I am there as a tourist, I literally said I went there to see if we were accurate in how hard we rail against them and what I have realized is we are excessive in our criticism of them. When I went there I saw people who to the best of their ability sought to be more loving. 

3. One of my recent awakenings actually informed me that our forums is far too judgmental and is doing it out of ignorance. So I ask....when is the last time you visited a Christian Church? If you have not visited one...you are speaking from a place of ignorance.

Edited August 7, 2023 by Razard86

[Inliytened1]

3 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

1. I have already had many awakenings, and already deconstructed reality. I literally have a direct connection with reality sober.

2. This fear of yours you need to address, of course I am there as a tourist, I literally said I went there to see if we were accurate in how hard we rail against them and what I have realized is we are excessive in our criticism of them. When I went there I saw people who to the best of their ability sought to be more loving. 

3. One of my recent awakenings actually informed me that our forums is far too judgmental and is doing it out of ignorance. So I ask....when is the last time you visited a Christian Church? If you have visited one...you are speaking from a place of ignorance.

Going to a church will do nothing.  After awakening to God - stepping foot in a Church will feel different.  Because now you understand that God exists.  But prior to that - stepping into a Church does nothing.  If I am speaking out of context I have not read your earlier exchange.  I'm just not sure if I have to.

Edited August 7, 2023 by Inliytened1

[Razard86]

2 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Going to a church will do nothing.  After awakening to God - stepping foot in a Church will feel different.  Because now you understand that God exists.  But prior to that - stepping into a Church does nothing.  If I am speaking out of context I have not read your earlier exchange.  I'm just not sure if I have to.

Yeah that's the thing, I felt the presence in the Church, something I didn't feel before my awakenings. I wanted to see if they could really conjure up the presence and they legitimately did. It let me know that the Absolute is using the Church as a kind of kindergarten for Spiritual progression. This is why all this demonization is pure foolishness. 

Not every person is at a developmental level that they can do without the Church. The Church has a purpose. Now with that said.....their understanding of Scripture and its meaning....was....very underdeveloped. But their earnestness and desire to grow in love was evident. I was moved at their desire to learn more about love to the best of their ability.

[Buck Edwards]

3 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

Not every person is at a developmental level that they can do without the Church. The Church has a purpose. Now with that said.....their understanding of Scripture and its meaning....was....very underdeveloped. But their earnestness and desire to grow in love was evident. I was moved at their desire to learn more about love to the best of their ability.

You're right. Sometimes emotions mean more than a scripture. 

[Inliytened1]

8 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

Yeah that's the thing, I felt the presence in the Church, something I didn't feel before my awakenings. I wanted to see if they could really conjure up the presence and they legitimately did. It let me know that the Absolute is using the Church as a kind of kindergarten for Spiritual progression. This is why all this demonization is pure foolishness. 

Not every person is at a developmental level that they can do without the Church. The Church has a purpose. Now with that said.....their understanding of Scripture and its meaning....was....very underdeveloped. But their earnestness and desire to grow in love was evident. I was moved at their desire to learn more about love to the best of their ability.

The presence of God you are feeling is not because of the Christain Church.  The presence of God you are feeling does not source from the Chrisitan Church.  It is a trick of the ego to walk into a place of God after awakening and feel the presence of God more deeply.  It is really within you.   The house of God was always within you - it is the ego that gives it it a physical place in this realm with which to believe it is there.   But it was always within you.

Edited August 7, 2023 by Inliytened1

[Juan]

20 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

The point is you entertained other possibilities. Many are completely closed off to this.

Don’t forget also Food Network haha, I loved to make my own food at that age. 

[Razard86]

1 minute ago, Inliytened1 said:

The presence of God you are feeling is not because of the Christain Church.  The presence of God you are feeling does not source from the Chrisian Church.  It is a trick of the ego to walk into a place of God after awakening and feel the presence of God more deeply.  It is really within you.   The house of God was always within you - it is the ego that gives it it a physical place in this realm with which to believe it is there.   But it was always within you.

It's not a trick of the ego, there you guys go demonizing the ego again. The ego is not a trickster, the trickster is an UNDERDEVELOPED EGO. When the ego is not properly developed it engages in trickery. This demonization of the ego needs to stop. I feel the prescence of God wherever I go, you think I don't realize this? I swear yall are always trying to teach when there is nothing to teach. 

I have awakened to the fact that I AM LOVE, I AM INFINITE BEAUTY, I AM INFINITY GOODNESS, I AM PURE INNOCENCE.

But I also have the ability to feel the fear and distortions in others. I can also feel the earnestness of another. When I walked into that church I felt the love of small children doing their best to learn love. 

I awoke to Absolute Solipsism but I also awoke to Absolute Relativity. Reality is both ONE and MANY. I am referring to the MANY aspect, and that MANY is earnest and doing the best it can. All demonization of underdeveloped aspects of the Absolute doing their best is a reflection of a lack of Spiritual Progression and Maturity.

[Inliytened1]

7 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

It's not a trick of the ego, there you guys go demonizing the ego again. The ego is not a trickster, the trickster is an UNDERDEVELOPED EGO. When the ego is not properly developed it engages in trickery. This demonization of the ego needs to stop. I feel the prescence of God wherever I go, you think I don't realize this? I swear yall are always trying to teach when there is nothing to teach. 

I have awakened to the fact that I AM LOVE, I AM INFINITE BEAUTY, I AM INFINITY GOODNESS, I AM PURE INNOCENCE.

But I also have the ability to feel the fear and distortions in others. I can also feel the earnestness of another. When I walked into that church I felt the love of small children doing their best to learn love. 

I awoke to Absolute Solipsism but I also awoke to Absolute Relativity. Reality is both ONE and MANY. I am referring to the MANY aspect, and that MANY is earnest and doing the best it can. All demonization of underdeveloped aspects of the Absolute doing their best is a reflection of a lack of Spiritual Progression and Maturity.

You are completely missing the point.  There is no physical house of God.  God is within you.  Anything physical that you walk into that brings you closer to God is the ego again wanting to grip onto things like the Bible.  The Bible was written by a bunch of wise unenlightened men.  Yes - it is holy.   But you can see the holiness in your bedroom if you bothered to look.  There is no difference between a Church and your bathroom.   The problem is the ego comes in and makes it feel "holy".  But really the house of God IS you.  

Edited August 7, 2023 by Inliytened1

[Leo Gura]

28 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

So I ask....when is the last time you visited a Christian Church? If you have not visited one...you are speaking from a place of ignorance.

When was the last time you prayed to Zeus? Better get on that.

[Razard86]

Yeah I knew it, you guys just don't get it. Reality is both the same and also different. You are stuck on the sameness which is itself a limitation. Stop putting limitations on reality. 

4 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

When was the last time you prayed to Zeus? Better get on that.

When was the last time you gave a genuine apology and actually meant it? Better get on that.

[Juan]

Since we are talking about the bible, here’s a good bit.?

 

[Leo Gura]

@Razard86 Look, bro, do your spirituality however you want. We are just sharing tips. You don't have to follow any of them.

Keep in mind the context of this whole thread was someone asking for help in escaping the stranglehold of Christianity. It's not like I came beating down your door telling you to quit your church.

Edited August 8, 2023 by Leo Gura