the problem of hyper discipline

[Majed]

i noticed a lot of time we get into personal development and we do a lot of stuff wrong just because of self discipline. like for example you can go on a very restrictive diet that is actually damaging your health but you think you're doing good because you're being hyper disciplined. or you can start doing nofap and repressing your sexuality which is unhealthy, but you think it's good because you're being disciplined. or you can start working 12 hours a day thinking it's good just because you're being disciplined, when in fact it's not.

what's the solution to this prejudice of just because we can be disciplined to do something that it is good when in fact it isn't. 

because on the one hand you don't want to not have discipline at all, but  on the other hand you need to be wise about how you apply your discipline. 

religion has this problem of setting unrealistic standards and expecting to meet them through discipline when in fact most of the time it just doesn't work that way.

and also self help: nofap, workaholism...

also spirituality like not having sex. 

Edited June 11, 2023 by Majed

[charlie cho]

Well, any spiritual circles that promotes 'not have sex' is proposterous, unless they don't have a true understanding of celibacy. Because celibacy has nothing to do with 'not having sex' physically. Celibacy is a state of mind.

And what pertains to discipline and its faults. Krishnamurti helped me out into completely taking action on non-discipline

This concept is not a new-phenomena. It has existed for centuries obviously. When we read Bhadavad Gita, it talks about non-goal oriented action or non-goal oriented fight. When we read Lao Tzu or Chuang Tzu, they both harshly criticize Confucius for being overly effort conscious, habits creating conscious, because Confucius was too much of a pragmatist and a group-think type of person. Confucius understood people don't change and that people are prone to the status-quo, so his idealogy was based off of using that human nature to the advantage of his version of 'harmony'. To Confucius' eyes, this is harmony, but it's an absolute travesty because although people may seem to be following a certain habit, a certain discipline, (people love being enslaved, even if it takes so much effort, but you hold it very well saying this 'effort' is something that is detrimental to society sometimes) Chuang Tzu would argue Confucius just loves to follow the status quo and not challenge people, eventually destroying flow, good reason, even good politics because people don't truly abide by nature. 

But I feel it needs both. Effort 50%, non-effort 50%. OSHO argues the same. OSHO would tell people not to be harsh on 'disciplinaries', but rather adopt them, and at the same time, understand what true 'effortlessness' is. OSHO would even recommend Confucius books to his commune, even though that book is riddled with ideas of discipline, effort, habits, which is a contrary view of what OSHO always held. But he understood so much is important in creating the soil for spiritual growth. And that soil may be something that has to be practical: like effort, discipline etc. of which you like to think is detrimental somehow. 

[Carl-Richard]

Ever since I was little, I had a strong intuition that this kind of blind discipline is not only highly unappealing, but also dangerous. In fact, the very word "discipline" always gave me a bad taste in my mouth every time I heard it. If you're not plugged in to some higher principle or underlying impetus for doing something, or you're not listening to the control mechanisms of your various mental faculties, you're not just flying blind, but you don't know where you're going; you're flying on no fuel, and you have no idea if there will suddenly not be air under your wings, or that where you'll be arriving will not be empty as air itself.

I always struggled with cultivating "discipline", but what I discovered was that true discipline unfolds spontaneously when you have your priorities right. It also cannot be dictated from the outside (although it partially always will be that, but a large part of it has to be an internal drive, or else it's just not sustainable). And this kind of more spontaneous discipline is more in line with your general sense and ability to feel out where you're going, so you'll not become this neurotic mess and slave-like drone to whatever superficial conditioning you happened to be indoctrinated with.

Edited June 13, 2023 by Carl-Richard

[UnbornTao]

Discipline is simply producing a result that doesn't just befall you, it is not a burden as it is commonly considered to be. The etymology of discipline is "learning, disciple."

Edited June 13, 2023 by UnbornTao

[Osaid]

hyper-disciplined = hyper-logical

So the solution is: be more intuitive.