Any genuinely enlightened people I can speak to for guidance.

[SOUL]

1 hour ago, Moksha said:

I wonder why it is that so few enlightened teachers refer to themselves as being enlightened.

There is no separation between 'enlightened' and not so once this is realized it doesn't make any sense to point to that distinction since it doesn't exist. It is those who don't realize it that will point to the separation because their mind creates it for themselves so are 'not'.

Edited June 8, 2023 by SOUL

[Yimpa]

The difference between an enlightened person and one that is not is infinite. 

[Moksha]

3 minutes ago, SOUL said:

There is no separation between 'enlightened' and not so once this is realized it doesn't make any sense to point to that distinction since it doesn't exist. It is those who don't realize it that will point to the separation because their mind creates it for themselves so are 'not'.

Enlightenment is a gradual state of lucidity within the dream, wherein the absolute realizes itself, relative to other states where it does not. It allows the absolute to help awaken itself in other dream forms.

[Yimpa]

@Moksha Damn, that’s meta!

[SOUL]

10 minutes ago, Moksha said:

Enlightenment is a gradual state of lucidity within the dream, wherein the absolute realizes itself, relative to other states where it does not. It allows the absolute to help awaken itself in other dream forms.

We can imagine it to be a gradual state of lucidity and that would be a conceptual paradigm that separates awareness from absolute realization because one imagines it to be that way so pushes it off to some imagined 'future' time. Even to imagine that absolute realization has to take a certain form of experience can be an obstacle to realizing absolute wakening in present experience.

[CARDOZZO]

@ChrisZoZo Go to Ralston’s workshop

[Moksha]

1 minute ago, SOUL said:

We can imagine it to be a gradual state of lucidity and that would be a conceptual paradigm that separates awareness from absolute realization because one imagines it to be that way so pushes it off to some imagined 'future' time. Even to imagine that absolute realization has to take a certain form of experience can be an obstacle to realizing absolute wakening in present experience.

Beyond the dream, there is no falling asleep and no awakening. Nothing actually changes, ever. The entire spiritual journey within the dream is designed to dissolve the dream.

In the dream state, the absolute awakens within an apparent form and helps itself awaken in other apparent forms. This is the cascading dissolution of the dream.

The absolute knows its nature, which is why it rarely identifies as an "enlightened being". There are no teachers and no students, only the absolute in different apparent states of realization.

[puporing]

3 hours ago, ChrisZoZo said:

I can ask and then they can show up its a possibility also no?

maybe. I'm just trying to say there are many levels to awakening so it's not like less awake teachers are not valuable, what you want is teachings just ahead of you. I'm saying you can only learn what you are ready for (so it's not this "catch all" thing with the term "enlightenment"). eg, you can't even begin to recognize the most awake teachers when you're not close and they will likely not "show themselves" to you either coz they know they appear too crazy to you still, and you will also prob ignore them. this works similarly on psychedelics.

Edited June 9, 2023 by puporing

[SOUL]

29 minutes ago, Moksha said:

Beyond the dream, there is no falling asleep and no awakening. Nothing actually changes, ever. The entire spiritual journey within the dream is designed to dissolve the dream.

In the dream state, the absolute awakens within an apparent form and helps itself awaken in other apparent forms. This is the cascading dissolution of the dream.

The absolute knows its nature, which is why it rarely identifies as an "enlightened being". There are no teachers and no students, only the absolute in different apparent states of realization.

If one imagines it to be that way, it is that way for them yet it is not that way for everyone. One doesn't have to imagine a dissolution of the dream to realize the absolute and sure, one can imagine it has to be that way so it is that way for them...but not everyone.

One can transcend the dream so realize absolute awakening in an instant while the 'dream' remains as it is except our perception of the dream ceases to be a dream, we recognize it as reality. One could say that to be asleep is to be dreaming but awake the dream ceases to be it.

Edited June 9, 2023 by SOUL

[PurpleTree]

3 hours ago, Moksha said:

I wonder why it is that so few enlightened teachers refer to themselves as being enlightened.

Maybe because the word doesn‘t make much sense anymore. Nobody gets enlightened 

[Yimpa]

22 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

Nobody gets enlightened 

NOBODY here is AWAKE.

[WelcometoReality]

@ChrisZoZo how far into the process are you?

[gettoefl]

6 hours ago, Moksha said:

Beyond the dream, there is no falling asleep and no awakening. Nothing actually changes, ever. The entire spiritual journey within the dream is designed to dissolve the dream.

In the dream state, the absolute awakens within an apparent form and helps itself awaken in other apparent forms. This is the cascading dissolution of the dream.

The absolute knows its nature, which is why it rarely identifies as an "enlightened being". There are no teachers and no students, only the absolute in different apparent states of realization.

i know i am all i see but all i see doesn't know it is me and therein lies my task that my long lost limbs soar in unison with their fellow wings

daniel brown is asked if he in enlightened in this vid in the q&a part, and in fact the whole thing worth a gander

 

 

Edited June 9, 2023 by gettoefl

[Water by the River]

8 hours ago, Moksha said:

I wonder why it is that so few enlightened teachers refer to themselves as being enlightened.

6 hours ago, Moksha said:

.The absolute knows its nature, which is why it rarely identifies as an "enlightened being". There are no teachers and no students, only the absolute in different apparent states of realization.

Very wise comments. That move tends to blow up any remaining identity. Instead of gradually letting all remains naturally dissolve into the true self-less/impersonal/empty Infinite Totality of Reality itself.

In Tibetan Buddhism, it is frowned upon talking about ones realization, because normally its not beneficial for anybody involved. It tends to blow up self-importance, which is among Mayas most seductive kisses. "Separate-self"-importance, or the equivalent of shooting oneself in the knee and starting running the marathon towards fully empty and impersonal Infinite Consciousness.

A very sharp indiciator is the conduct with which one lives ones life over the years, and the states which one radiates during that. Instead of any claims.

That is how the Tibetans do it. Sadly, not so much the Westener Students that many of the  not-so-enlightened Rinpoches attract...

Water by the River

 

[Water by the River]

23 minutes ago, gettoefl said:

i know i am all i see but all i see doesn't know it is me and therein lies my task that my long lost limbs soar in unison with their fellow wings

daniel brown is asked if he in enlightened in this vid in the q&a part, and in fact the whole thing worth a gander

 

 

Thank you very much for posting that video. 

I can confirm from long time experience (10 years+) of walking this path (Mahamudra, especially the system outlined in Pointing out the Great Way, but also Dzogchen) is very effective.

It is orders of magnitude more effective in taking meditation and Awakening off the pillow into daily life than any other meditation system I am aware of, and I read about & tried quite some. I am convinced that with any other system it would have taken me at least 2-3 times longer at least, probably more. 

Getting meditation off the pillow and into daily life, not as mindfulness but more as Trekchö, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trekchö#:~:text=In Dzogchen%2C trekchö (khregs chod,with its admonition against practice. , is in my experience essential to get the momentum of Awakened States going that is necessary for further insights - at least if one is not (geneticall or karmically) prodigy-like-gifted. 

Here Daniel Brown talks about the beginnings of Awakened-States, starting to get nondual:

One thing to keep in mind: He already had Parkinson at that time of the shooting of that video, it was 3-4 years before his passing away last year. But besides that impacting him already, one can clearly feel his awakened state and presence.

Water by the River

PS: A brief summary of my experiences with the Mahamudra-System:

 

[LfcCharlie4]

What are you looking for? 

[ChrisZoZo]

10 hours ago, WelcometoReality said:

@ChrisZoZo how far into the process are you?

I temporarily passed the threshold guardian of death. I’ve been on the path for about seven years. For about the last 14 months the pressure has amounted significantly. On a good day I can drop 30% of the ego. With consistency I could probably drop 100%. Consistency is where I fail.

[WelcometoReality]

15 minutes ago, ChrisZoZo said:

I temporarily passed the threshold guardian of death. I’ve been on the path for about seven years. For about the last 14 months the pressure has amounted significantly. On a good day I can drop 30% of the ego. With consistency I could probably drop 100%. Consistency is where I fail.

Ok. 

Hope you find the guidance you're looking for.

[SkyGuardian]

Perhaps this video "Enlightenment – Transformative Experience or Journey of Self-Discovery?" by Swami Tadatmananda  might shed some light to this topic for whomever this may concern.

Confusion about HOW to get enlightened is the result of not knowing WHAT enlightenment truly is. The great master Advaita Vedanta, Shankara, said that enlightenment is gained only through self-knowledge. But is knowledge really enough?

Some people believe that enlightenment, liberation, or moksha in Sanskrit, is an unwavering feeling or sense of being limitless consciousness, or a feeling of absolute bliss, or a feeling of oneness, oneness with the universe or oneness with God. But there's no such thing as a permanent feeling. They change constantly. Enlightenment is often called a state, but if it is a state of experience, a state that arises in the mind, it too will soon pass away because all mental states are impermanent.

 

Edited June 9, 2023 by SkyGuardian

[WeCome1]

8 hours ago, Water by the River said:

Here Daniel Brown talks about the beginnings of Awakened-States, starting to get nondual:

 

"GAME OVER."