Is God realization shortcut to solving life problems?

[Javfly33]

On 28/05/2023 at 3:22 PM, CARDOZZO said:

I see, it's not a problem. The point is believing that Enlightenment is the magic pill.

You can pursue Enlightenment while mastering business, pickup, money.

 

it is magic pill, as long as its a living experience for you, from the moment you wake up to the moment you go to sleep.

otherwise, its a cute memory of a trip or of a meditation retreat experience ,

if your body + energy field still feels like separation, guess what, Enlightment not found 404, no matter how many "experiences" you had and 'knowledge' you have gained.

 

Edited May 29, 2023 by Javfly33

[CARDOZZO]

@Javfly33 I understand your point.

The point that I'm conceiving is that THERE IS more to LIFE than ENLIGHTENMENT.

Skill, Mastery, Creativity, Humor... and a lot of other things.

I don't know if it's worth making your whole life about Enlightenment, Spirituality and Psychedelics.

You can pursue it, "achieve it"... but you know, why not put your attention on other matters also?

[Razard86]

1 hour ago, StarStruck said:

I agree. Good analogy with the poison. Thing is that if I gave you poison right now you wouldn’t take it. That is the whole point which such philosophy. I don’t think there is a person who truly believes what you preach. Perhaps Conner but he is being shat out by Leo Gura. It is not practical to live that way. 

Actually I would take it, and if I loved poison I would turn it into a vaccine, which humans have literally done it. Notice how you just let your bias get in the way of truth!! Many people have taken poison, and used it for many purposes. How do you think we even know how different poisons impact the human body? Do you know how much research has been done into the various poisons? They can tell you the chemical compounds, it's half life, the various ways it impacts your metabolism, how fast it is broken down and assimilated into the body, and how various substances can change it.

If you allow fear of poison to control you, it actually ends up controlling you because you become ignorant of it. Knowledge is power, fear is a limit on power. 

Also take it means I would take possession of it, I don't have to consume it to study it. 

Edited May 29, 2023 by Razard86

[Javfly33]

1 hour ago, CARDOZZO said:

@Javfly33 I understand your point.

The point that I'm conceiving is that THERE IS more to LIFE than ENLIGHTENMENT.

Skill, Mastery, Creativity, Humor... and a lot of other things.

I don't know if it's worth making your whole life about Enlightenment, Spirituality and Psychedelics.

You can pursue it, "achieve it"... but you know, why not put your attention on other matters also?

For sure. I was going to add in the first post that you can totally work on Enlightment while working on more material achievements like work, relationships, etc...

[StarStruck]

1 hour ago, Razard86 said:

Actually I would take it, and if I loved poison I would turn it into a vaccine, which humans have literally done it. Notice how you just let your bias get in the way of truth!! Many people have taken poison, and used it for many purposes. How do you think we even know how different poisons impact the human body? Do you know how much research has been done into the various poisons? They can tell you the chemical compounds, it's half life, the various ways it impacts your metabolism, how fast it is broken down and assimilated into the body, and how various substances can change it.

If you allow fear of poison to control you, it actually ends up controlling you because you become ignorant of it. Knowledge is power, fear is a limit on power. 

Also take it means I would take possession of it, I don't have to consume it to study it. 

I think you  are referring to this:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mithridatism

You have to be smart about it though. 

It only works with certain poison. 

If I put some mental fluid in your blood with a needle even a small drop would kill you. And then it will be game over. 

You claim you love everything. If you truly loved everything you would put both hands in boiling water right now and you would be able to type the next message but guess what? You won’t do that and you will type the next message on this forum. 

Edited May 29, 2023 by StarStruck

[StarStruck]

@CARDOZZO mastery and understanding are two different things. Leo Gura does a bad job explaining it. 

[eos_nyxia]

On 2023-05-28 at 1:16 AM, StarStruck said:

There are some people on this forum who claim to reached the ultimate truths of the universe but can’t even solve their own petty life problems. How can this even go together? I mean if you reached the highest truth you could easily solve your self made problems with that truth just like you could illuminate a dark room with the torch of your consciousness so to say. It is kind of tragicomical to see really. It is like saying “I’m Jesus” and people look at you to perform some miracles and you say to your disciples “yea, my knowledge is theoretical, not practical”. Manifest me some fish, cure my blindness or cancer or something. Pull a bunny out of your ass, do something. Or at least solve your own problems before saying you reached the highest truths.  

This worked more simply and straightforwardly when the world was a simpler place, and society was in a different place. We had different beliefs about what was possible, what was acceptable to show in public or not and under what conditions, and different cultural goals. Also, it's really not a given that everything about your understanding of the past, your habits and ways of thinking are compatible with a more primal, empowered functioning, where your relationship to matter and the universal is more wholly direct. You can still end up reverting to past ways of thinking, feeling, and being in order to think and communicate and be on par with other people. Which is why if you want to keep things simple and clean, the best thing to do is to just leave after. Either leave this body or leave society. It does not magically become easier to reconcile one thing with another afterward, particularly if you had any unfinished business that you decided (or were unable) to end for whatever reason. You just pick it back up, but with perspective that does not require more fundamental revelation at its core.

You must fashion it into something which tends to take some amount of time and energy. Probably a lot.

At this point (among other factors), it depends what degree of direct interference in this world you can justify. You cannot say anymore that you don't see the big picture, if that is where you truly are? You cannot be mostly on board for higher functioning to work. You're all in, or you are not. Something will go wrong if you hold back or block channels within yourself (but at least you will know exactly what it is if you are truly clearminded). More likely, you will just not be able to make things happen in certain circumstances, like a rocket that doesn't quite get off the ground.

...why is it, do you think, that people who """reach ultimate truths""" so often end up co-opting for the goals of the collective as their own, even if it's not strictly because of moralism (because they "should")?

Socially speaking, it's not the age of miracles. It hasn't been for a long time. For a long time, our focus has instead been on technological development and all of the psychological externalization that comes with this.

There are prices to pay for steamrolling everything in your path, whether you are successful or not, and really it does not match with the collective state and direction, and hasn't for a long time. There is actually much less you can do in this way at the level of social infrastructure. (Which is why Sadghuru said he opted to change his method of presentation and approach from his past lives part way through this one.) This is especially true in any first world country that doesn't have a strong tradition of believing in the possibility and value of miracles, especially in the plain light of day. There are also certain ways of dealing with people that JUST WORK BETTER.  A certain level of mind is shared in order to communicate, and having an extraordinarily high and directly expressed energy level usually isn't it. Even manifestations of that sort of energy have to be given a suitable human face.

 

Just as an example, there is also a lot of misunderstanding when it comes to psychism and receptivity IMO. There are a lot of people talking and theorizing about things they have no direct experience with, and no experience in verifying and working with anything, even on a personal, micro scale. People tend to think of psychism just in terms of influence, like influencing others. When it's RECEPTIVITY first which makes it work well in the first place. ...which then by definition makes you even more susceptible to direct influence as well. This easily makes you more problems. Many, many more problems, unless you have a way of dealing with them effortlessly so they are not a issue in the present. Does anything in your past identity that you've picked back up make more problems?

Congrats then, you have a problem. Cause, meet effect.

Edited May 29, 2023 by eos_nyxia

[Breakingthewall]

I don't know if awakening helps you with daily life, but opening yourself completely to the now, being one with existence, forgetting all your fear, flowing without resistance...we have to get there, we have to open up, identify what prevents us and get over it 

I'm seeing it right now with 2 puff of weed; I'm opened, I'm looking the immortality now, I'm open to the now just a bit, but my sight is infinite right now, and my mind is empty. This is the state that i want

Edited May 29, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[CARDOZZO]

1 hour ago, StarStruck said:

mastery and understanding are two different things.

We can say that Mastery is the PUREST/DEEPEST FORM of UNDERSTANDING.

You UNDERSTAND something so deeply that you can produce the same results over and over and over.

Without UNDERSTANDING you cannot achieve mastery.

You need to understand how to relate to yourself and your field of mastery to be a Master.

[Breakingthewall]

each of our lives is a challenge, a game that is proposed to us. We have to play it to the bottom, we don't have to leave a particle of fear at this moment that is happening. We have to erase it, go through it. Yes brothers, there is nothing like it. is the eternal smile, the opening

[Yimpa]

8 hours ago, Javfly33 said:

But anyways 99% of people meaning of enlightment its a memory, not a living experience. If it’s a memory, it's cute to write posts on social media but it won't solve anything. 

Enlightenment and people are both dreams. Big shocker. 

8 hours ago, CARDOZZO said:

I don't know if it's worth making your whole life about Enlightenment, Spirituality and Psychedelics.

Have a mystical experience so deep that you can’t tell the difference between any of that. 

Then go deeper.

That’s what people are afraid of experiencing. But it’s important nonetheless as it allows you to cut through a lot of bs.

[CARDOZZO]

14 minutes ago, Yimpa said:

Then go deeper.

Always deeper.

I was contemplating about LEVELS of TRUTH because here in the forum we have different names but I assume that each name describes less/more profound degrees of TRUTH:

• Void.
• TRUTH.
• Absolute TRUTH.
• Absolute Solipsism.
• Alien Consciousness.
• God-Realization.
• Enlightenment.
• No-Self.

If anyone can describe the differences or point to a teaching that talks about that, I’ll appreciate ?

Edited May 30, 2023 by CARDOZZO

[Oppositionless]

it only addresses the existential pit of despair , none of the other stuff

I’m very thankful to have suffered multitudes of mental cataclysms in my life that made me take ownership of my healing process. having a spiritual understanding kept me alive in my darkest moments.

Edited May 30, 2023 by Oppositionless

[Water by the River]

6 hours ago, CARDOZZO said:

Always deeper.

I was contemplating about LEVELS of TRUTH because here in the forum we have different names but I assume that each name describes less/more profound degrees of TRUTH:

• Void.
• TRUTH.
• Absolute TRUTH.
• Absolute Solipsism.
• Alien Consciousness.
• God-Realization.
• Enlightenment.
• No-Self.

If anyone can describe the differences or point to a teaching that talks about that, I’ll appreciate ?

ok, here comes the take of yours truly. Warning: Bumpy conceptual ride ahead! 

All of them: concepts, used with differing meaning in different concepts. Not any kind of Absolute Truth, but concepts appearing in IT. Below is the take of yours truly on the most common usage.

Void: Anything from a state (causal, void state) to Ultimate Reality. But is better used as a state description

Truth: Normally pointer to Absolute Reality. 

Absolute Reality: Same.

Absolute Solipsism:

• Trying to think ones way via conceptual thinking to the Absolute Reality which is infinite, and which can mostly only be described in negative terms, since any positive description would limit it.
• Doing the Universal Mind/Infinite Consciousness thing of Huang-Po (see last post) is ok. But confusing this Impersonal Infinite Consciousness with a mind-stream that is not fully awakened, aka where a separate self confuses itself with Ultimate Reality, is, uh, not so smart.
• Biggest Problem: Proponents of that normally don't have awakened/enlightened states in daily life. Biggest Risk: Narcicissm, not Ego-death but Cosmic-Ego. Identifying separate self or any kind of identity/self with Totality.
• Usefulness for the Path to the Mountain Summit/Nothingness/Absolute: Shooting ones knee with a gun and then trying to start walking and proclaiming how fast one got already on the mountain summit while limping in the valley

 Alien Consciousness:

• Some understanding on the form/manifestation side of Infinite Consciousness, albeit much more than a human is capable off in non-tripping-states, on a very high level.
• Better yet, ask the creator of that concept. Yours truly has no intelectual ownership on it.
• Danger: Proclaiming that as more important than Full Enlightenment, or letting go of the separate-self illusions that cover ones Deep Identity as Impersonal Nothingness/Infinite Consciousness/Absolute Reality, in which every appearance/thougt/self-concept-arising can only arise as Illusion/Dream/Mirage. Leads apparently to chasing the next Awakening, n+1. And not being quite happy on a permanent basis. 

God Realization

• anything from Full Enlightenment to a tool to bash any form of Awakening/Enlightenment one doesn't like. Depens on the usage and author using that term.
• For the bashing-anything-else-version of it, clear definitions are usually not given. Could sound like Full Enlightenment if really spelled out explicitely. 

No-Self

• tricky term. 
• In its highest meaning: the final death/transcedence of each and any separate self arising. True No-Self.
• can be also be used for anything from no-Ego, no-Person, like opaque witness or transparent witness.
• should only be used for Pure Impersonal Nothingness/Impersonal Infinite Consciousness to avoid confusions.

The most interesting conept/pointer would be Full Enlightenment. For that, see my last posts.

Selling Water by the River

Edited May 30, 2023 by Water by the River

[Leo Gura]

8 hours ago, CARDOZZO said:

Always deeper.

I was contemplating about LEVELS of TRUTH because here in the forum we have different names but I assume that each name describes less/more profound degrees of TRUTH:

• Void.
• TRUTH.
• Absolute TRUTH.
• Absolute Solipsism.
• Alien Consciousness.
• God-Realization.
• Enlightenment.
• No-Self.

If anyone can describe the differences or point to a teaching that talks about that, I’ll appreciate ?

The differences are too profound to be described to you.

You'll only understand once you reach them.

Just aim for the top.

Edited May 30, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Water by the River]

3 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

There differences are too profound to be described to you.

You'll only understand once you reach them.

Very wise answer, much smarter than yours truly. And actually true.

frog pond plop - Basho

 

Relative Pointers to the mountain summit, and the different lower peaks/ridges below it leading up there? Maybe a "climbing map" showing the safe way up there? To avoid the dragons/hic sunt dracones, and the paths leading back to the valley?

Not today, darling. 

 

Selling Water by the River  

[Breakingthewall]

9 hours ago, CARDOZZO said:

Always deeper.

I was contemplating about LEVELS of TRUTH because here in the forum we have different names but I assume that each name describes less/more profound degrees of TRUTH:

• Void.
• TRUTH.
• Absolute TRUTH.
• Absolute Solipsism.
• Alien Consciousness.
• God-Realization.
• Enlightenment.
• No-Self.

If anyone can describe the differences or point to a teaching that talks about that, I’ll appreciate ?

 there is only one truth: the absolute infinite total. there are no levels, there are only apparent limits, that is, illusion. remove the false limits and the absolute manifests itself.

[Moksha]

@CARDOZZO Don't settle for anything less than direct realization.

All is a play in consciousness. All divisions are illusory. You can know the false only. The true you must yourself be.

There are the two -- the person and the witness, the observer. When you see them as one, and go beyond, you are in the supreme state. It is not perceivable, because it is what makes perception possible. It is beyond being and not being. It is neither the mirror nor the image in the mirror. It is what is -- the timeless reality, unbelievably hard and solid.

There is only light and the light is all. Everything else if but a picture made of light. The picture is in the light and the light is in the picture. Life and death, self and not-self -- abandon all these ideas. They are of no use to you.

[CARDOZZO]

@Water by the River Thanks as always!!! :)))

4 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Just aim for the top.

I will!  @Leo Gura

2 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

 there is only one truth: the absolute infinite total. there are no levels, there are only apparent limits, that is, illusion. remove the false limits and the absolute manifests itself.

ONE!  @Breakingthewall

27 minutes ago, Moksha said:

@CARDOZZO Don't settle for anything less than direct realization.

 

That's it, direct experience is king.  

[jjkiefer]

@Razard86 - I couldn't agree with you more!  All these labels about green, orange, and whatever...do not understand the Oneness of all.  Once one places a label to spirituality, it is a given that enlightenment is not present.  Wonderful comment!