Many People Who Are Fighting Absolute Solipsism Do Not Even Know What It Is

[Water by the River]

22 minutes ago, Bazooka Jesus said:

Yup, the monkey mind doesn't give up so easily... it will just turn your "awakening" into another well of concepts that it can happily chew on 'till kingdom come, lol.

It for sure does.

That is what happens in most cases.

Which is why a good map is essential. Good pointers, not pointers halfway up the mountain. Suffering doesn't stop halfway up the mountain.

For example:

 

More on that here:

 

Selling Water by the River

Edited May 31, 2023 by Water by the River

[Water by the River]

Jac O'Keffee:

"I even heard a Nondual speaker say that Awareness is always aware of itself. [No] it is not.

Sure it has [mostly] the experience of being aware of itself but: It is totally possible for awareness to be without being aware of itself.

It totally shows itself to not have any clue that it exists at all. You pull away existence there is no sense of itself. "

 

Or Pure Impersonal Consciousness unaware of itself: Possible. No Self-reflective anything appearing in it.

And because that is possible, Infinite Consciousness/Awareness is fully empty, impersonal, infinite. Nothingness. And can be unaware of itself. But with the potential for sentience/awareness. When an appearance shows up.

And self-awareness  as soon as any identity/indivduality/separate-self-arising  appears, and the self-reflective mind starts...

 

 

Selling Water by the River

[Moksha]

This thread began as a looming cloud trying to obscure the sun, but has since been dispelled by gathering winds of pure air. Nothing quite so lovely as an afterstorm.

[Javfly33]

2 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

When the infinity opens, and there is just being, totally expanded, without any hold, there is not "you" in the sense of the person who fears, etc, but still, you are. The infinity is, and it's you, without control, knowing, fear, desire. Just openess, but in deep, you, the existence. 

 

Infinity is already 'open'. 

There's not a self. Only Love. Right now. 

[Water by the River]

4 minutes ago, Moksha said:

This thread began as a looming cloud trying to obscure the sun, but has since been dispelled by gathering winds of pure air. Nothing quite so lovely as an afterstorm.

True.

 

[Moksha]

2 minutes ago, Water by the River said:

Jac O'Keffee:

"I even heard a Nondual speaker say that Awareness is always aware of itself. [No] it is not.

Sure it has [mostly] the experience of being aware of itself but: It is totally possible for awareness to be without being aware of itself.

It totally shows itself to not have any clue that it exists at all. You pull away existence there is no sense of itself. "

Awareness is only aware OF itself within its dualistic dream, which is existence.

It's a subtle but significant point: the absolute is inherently and essentially awareness, beyond existence. To realize awareness requires the illusion of boundaries, but beyond boundaries, awareness is without requiring the appearances of forgetting and realization.

[Breakingthewall]

36 minutes ago, Water by the River said:

To go from nondual-unity to impersonal/no individuality/full infinite real Nonduality. Or waking up.

29 minutes ago, Kuba Powiertowski said:

 

Yes i understand that, but don't you think that this is still somehow limited? I may be fooled by my psychedelic leanings, of course, but I give Leo and his aliens some credit. I think it is terribly wrongly named, it seems made on purpose to provoke rejection and ridicule. maybe it is?

it is necessary to differentiate between states without mind, of total non-duality, and states of deep openness to reality. reality is alive, it is not just the void, it is something that we barely intuit to see. we see the tip of the tip of the iceberg. without drugs there is a limit to the vision.

Of course you could ask: why do you want that punctual and fleeting vision? your job here is to transcend limitation and merge with the now. your human construction does not give for more. but the fact is that drugs exist

[Moksha]

20 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

for me it is something obvious and inescapable. 5meo is a necessary solvent. the armored door that I am would never allow a real opening without it, there are many perfectly designed security mechanisms. a true work of art in a matter of armored doors 

It's lucid to see not only that others take their unique path to realizing the absolute, but also that the path of the self winds its own way upward, without revealing the course of itself entirely.

It may be true that 5Me0 and meditation are ascenders for your current location on the slope, but save room on your belt for other possible tools. You may be surprised what happens around the next bend. ?

[Water by the River]

14 hours ago, Moksha said:

14 hours ago, Water by the River said:

Jac O'Keffee:

"I even heard a Nondual speaker say that Awareness is always aware of itself. [No] it is not.

Sure it has [mostly] the experience of being aware of itself but: It is totally possible for awareness to be without being aware of itself.

It totally shows itself to not have any clue that it exists at all. You pull away existence there is no sense of itself. "

Awareness is only aware OF itself within its dualistic dream, which is existence.

It's a subtle but significant point: the absolute is inherently and essentially awareness, beyond existence. To realize awareness requires the illusion of boundaries, but beyond boundaries, awareness is without requiring the appearances of forgetting and realization.

Yes. "It" never (could) loose its eternal nature of Awareness. As the only Infinite Aware Reality without a second.

If one fully understands what you just wrote... that alone is enough. Beautifully written.

And that Awareness can be unaware of itself prooves its fully Empty Impersonal Nature. That is the point I want to bring across, above all else. Neti Neti to the final end, where concepts have long stopped working. Never stop early while the separate-self-gestalt-arisings are not fully transcended.

And having walked the path of Neti Neti to its end: Infinite and Everything/Nondual. The pointer (fully empty impersonal nature, or Neti Neti) is the ticket for the way back home, And "can be unaware of itself" prooves this pointer.

If IT would be anything other than empty/no thing/infinite, IT could look over its shoulder to see itself. IT can't. When IT does (or better tries), looking deeply into oneself in meditation, it/one has an experience of Emptiness/Nothingness.

quod erat demonstrandum 

Water by the River

Edited June 1, 2023 by Water by the River

[Kuba Powiertowski]

2 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

your human construction does not give for more.

There is a lot to discover in human construction. We have barely started. Don't let any limitation bother you. You are much greater than You think. When You rediscover that, this limited play can be very joyful and fun?. 

[Moksha]

17 minutes ago, Water by the River said:

And that Awareness can be unaware of itself prooves its fully Empty Impersonal Nature. That is the point I want to bring across, above all else. Neti Neti to the final end

Well said. The unveiled absolute is neither aware nor unaware of itself. It is awareness. Not unaware awareness, but unconditional awareness.

Within the dream, it can forget or realize itself, but the appearance of unconsciousness and enlightenment is only the seemingness of transient relative states.

Neti neti helps the absolute unwind its false identification with the mind, but only brings it to the gate. It realizes what it is not, but not yet what it is. To pass through the gate requires absolute grace, which reunifies that which was never actually separate.

[Water by the River]

23 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

1 hour ago, Water by the River said:

To go from nondual-unity to impersonal/no individuality/full infinite real Nonduality. Or waking up.

Yes i understand that, but don't you think that this is still somehow limited?

No.

Go see for yourself. 

It is the only and final Realization that comes with "no more n+1 Awakenings".

That is where the exquisite peace lies.

Any other further Awakening after the Full Realisation of what you really are can only be insight into more form/manifestation.

One can theoretically (and practically) become aware of all of Indras Infinite Net in all its endless possible dimensions. Go exploring it. ALL OF IT. How its imagined/created, up to Buddhafield-Entities creating and managing whole Universes. There are more than enough Trip Reports about that, often centuries old, but also contemporary. Let me know if you want links. Nothing I have seen on this site here I have not found in essence somewhere else also when it comes to the topics above. Hard to find, but can be found.

And that (above) still wouldn't be the Abyss of Fully Empty Infinite Boundless Impersonal Consciousness, the one Infinite Reality without a second. YOU. The real YOU, not the Illusion of what you mistake yourself to be right now. It would be just more form. More form Of God fooling itself in n+1 ways. But still only more form, or the manifested side of Infinite Consciousness. Not the unmanifested empty essence of Infinite Consciousness. (Of course both are nondual, but one "side" is eternal and timeless, and the show passes and ends in time).

So: If one knows who one is, one knows who one is. And it is then known that all possible forms/arisings can only be dreams, a magic show, a beautiful (or not so beautiful)  illusion, a play. All of it, n+1.

That final Realization is where all pointers end, duality collapses IN YOU, and nothing can be prooven by just using language. Only YOU can REALIZE it by BEING IT.

Water by the River

 

And if you want to see an answer on that question as authentic reaction on video, below it is. But find out for yourself. Nobody can proove you that. Only you can realize it by BEING it. Choose who you believe, and listen deeply into your heart while doing so. In your case, the answer won't take long. Consider it takes Neti Neti to the final end, and ask yourself who you assume could have done that. And who hasn't done that. Pointer here: Daily life and conduct. At the end, Realization finds itself in conduct. If not, probably a not a too blissfull "Realization".

 And then place your bet, and walk the path (and your path) to its very end.

 

PS: And if you are so inclined, go hunt the Aliens AFTER knowing who YOU really are. If you are so inclined...

[Water by the River]

Just now, Moksha said:

Neti neti helps the absolute unwind its false identification with the mind, but only brings it to the gate. It realizes what it is not, but not yet what it is. To pass through the gate requires absolute grace, which reunifies that which was never actually separate.

True. I think you would like the Mahamudra-system a lot.

Yoga of One Taste is the Neti Neti path to its end, Yoga of Nonmeditation throws away each and any effort and reamaining separte-self doing anything: One just rests in nondual state that one knows very well then, and waits for the grace of crossing over. Gateless Gate.

"One can do NOTHING here to cross over to Full Enlightenment/Basis Enlightenment. Because that would be an act of a separate self. An effort. A movement of a separate self WANTING something, manipulating the mindstream, grasping for the understanding, doing something....

One can only automize the meditation/mindfullness, staying fully present, letting the Awakened Impersonal Awareness flow by itself, let IT do the meditation itself, get out of the way...

Bringing out the full force of this Utterly Impersonal Awakened Awareness. Ones True Identity.

And that is the last contra-intuitive trap: ONE CAN'T FORCE IT ("artifical activity"). Because forcing it would be a separate self arising doing it. One can try to force it (for example Koan-style), but then the Crossing Over normally happens in a moment of grace, of relaxation, when artificial activity is not present."

Selling Water by the River

[Javfly33]

3 hours ago, Moksha said:

It's lucid to see not only that others take their unique path to realizing the absolute, but also that the path of the self winds its own way upward, without revealing the course of itself entirely.

It may be true that 5Me0 and meditation are ascenders for your current location on the slope, but save room on your belt for other possible tools. You may be surprised what happens around the next bend. ?

At this point I´ve reached more profound and clear states of Being without 'drugs' than with them. And yes, that includes the infamous 5 MEO. Which I´ve done over 10-15 plugged and 2 times inhaled. 'On my own' i go beyond 5 Meo. 

It's even better, because it doesn't have any of the residual confusion and anxiety of the ego. You are supposed to produce all of that on your own, not taking syringes up your ass for life or inhaling from a crack pipe. Fuck´s sakes. 

 

But...nobody wants to open their mind  Because Leo own limitation thoughts about the 'limitation' of normie practices vs the super-power psychedelics, have taken a toll into the projections of their viewers, as it can be clearly observed here.

And I don't mean this is in a bad way for Leo, nor for anyone here. It's my wish that they actually discover what is really possible. 

 

There's actually a TOPIC I opened like +6 months ago talking about a deep experienced I had on LSD that I wanted to replicate. And Leo replied that 'you were tripping, you not going to replay that on your own'.

Fast forward +6 months, I´ve reached those states with 'simple' pranayama techniques (although it's more complex than that), but not one time, not two times, dozens of times.  

Guess what, I´m sure Leo is not going to accept this mistake for what he said (because if I had been just a blind follower like much of the guys here, I would have just not continue to do my own practice). 

 

But hey, to EACH THEIR OWN, I can't repeat myself more times... if they want to keep feeling miserable thinking a chemical has something they don't have, just because 'they want to be right' in their own limiting beliefs, to each their own...maybe when they get tired of it, and truly get in contact with the power is within (as new-agey as that sounds), another perspective can arise.

 

 

Edited May 31, 2023 by Javfly33

[OldManCorcoran]

1 minute ago, Javfly33 said:

At this point I´ve reached more profound and clear states of Being without 'drugs' than with them. And yes, that includes the infamous 5 MEO. Which I´ve done over 10-15 plugged and 2 times inhaled. 'On my own' i go beyond 5 Meo. 

It's even better, because it doesn't have any of the residual confusion and anxiety of the ego. You are supposed to produce all of that on your own, not taking syringes up your ass for life or inhaling from a crack pipe. Fuck´s sakes. 

 

But...nobody wants to open their mind  Because Leo own limitation thoughts about the 'limitation' of normie practices vs the super-power psychedelics, have taken a toll into the projections of their viewers, as it can be clearly observed here.

And I don't mean this is in a bad way for Leo, nor for anyone here. It's my wish that they actually discover what is really possible. 

 

There's actually a TOPIC I opened like +6 months ago talking about a deep experienced I had on LSD that I wanted to replicate. And Leo replied that 'you were tripping, you not going to replay that on your own'.

Fast forward +6 months, I´ve reached those states with 'simple' pranayama techniques (although it's more complex than that), but not one time, not two times, dozens of times.  

Guess what, I´m sure Leo is not going to accept this mistake for what he said (because if I had been just a blind follower like much of the guys here, I would have just not continue to do my own practice). 

 

But hey, to EACH THEIR OWN, I can't repeat myself more times... if they want to keep feeling miserable thinking a chemical has something they don't have, just because 'they want to be right' in their own limiting beliefs, to each their own...maybe when they get tired of it, and truly get in contact with the power is within (as new-agey as that sounds), another perspective can arise.

 

The inhale 5-MeO-DMT trips would be the important ones. Asshole 5 is just perversion, and I mean, Leo literally does jerk off in the bath to porn videos while doing that. Of course, it's possible to have a handshake trip, strong trip, or "release dose" when freebasing.

Of over 100 trips with the DMT family I only attained mystical enlightenment in one of those. One fully I mean, and then a bunch of weird trips, mild uncomfortable "highs", ego changes, and other useless events.

[Moksha]

2 hours ago, Water by the River said:

True. I think you would like the Mahamudra-system a lot.

I haven't studied many spiritual systems, but I'm happy to hear that others have realized the same.

Grace isn't a common pointer in most of the Eastern writings, but it sounds like Mahamudra covers this more clearly. I only know grace through direct realization. When it happens, it is obvious that the absolute within the human had only a little do with it. Once surrendering identification, the infinite flood of the absolute reunites the apparently separate essence with its source. It becomes a continuous flow of light.

Since then, I've realized that grace continues to inform my daily life. I can't choose to channel light any more than I could choose to awaken. It happens in greater or lesser luminosity according to its cadence. The only task of apparent me is to keep the portal open, which becomes frictionless as integration deepens and attachments dissolve. It's all about the I thought getting out of the way of the I am.

[Breakingthewall]

@Water by the River

5 hours ago, Water by the River said:

To go from nondual-unity to impersonal/no individuality/full infinite real Nonduality. Or waking up.

You wrote this in that post answerin to axiom (btw, i think it was a mistake to ban him, true that he insisted a lot with nothing, nothing, but he had some good points) :

"And if you have become so impersonal or universal consciousness (nondual) that you can have that state of huge nonduality/mere appearance of the visual field/infiniteness sobre, well then you have deconstructed your separate self enough. This is the Gate-Keeper of the Gateless Gate. This deconstruction is better said a high-speed-search-task-and-cutting-off of separate self illusion-arisings (I-feelings, I-thoughts, Trekchö-Style), and that is what boosts the nonduality and mere appearance aspect of the visual field, which is  " 

I understand what you say with a non-dual and infinite visual field. i come to that with 1 puff of weed, sober close. the present moment completely loses all interpretation and reveals itself as meaningless, unified, without differentiation subject object, empty of content, and limitless. Over all, real. The naked reality.  But it could be longer, it's just moments, some minutes

I don't understand how you can get to that with the observation and control of thoughts, I would say that it is impossible for me. The way to get there is to erase from this moment any fear, any barrier. open yourself fully to the moment and give of yourself. dissolve in yourself. you can go on thinking, but thoughts don't lock you in, they are surges that happen like anything else. although I suppose that if they disappeared completely the opening would be greater, total. that is where i have to arrive, to the total, absolute emptiness of the thinking mind. surrender must be total, any thought is a hold, we have to let go, totally. The i have to dissapear.  I'm walking in that direction. Every opening is a step

Edited May 31, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[Moksha]

54 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

But hey, to EACH THEIR OWN

Exactly this. I remember talking with you on the forum years ago, and have seen your growth since then. Look how much you have learned in that  time. Had I told you back then what you have realized now, you wouldn't have understood (in fact, I did and you didn't) but now you do 

You can't conceptually convince anyone to awaken. It's like an apple ripening on a tree. No matter how impatient you may feel, nothing makes a difference until the apple is finally ready to release its attachment to the tree. Try plucking it too soon, and a sour apple is all you get.

[Moksha]

14 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

If what you want is really to open up, really, instinct tells you what are the steps to follow

⚡You've already made significant progress. Continue practicing meditation, and once you are able to instantly recognize and dismiss thoughts without identifying with them, extend the practice into your daily life. It's the art of archery, where each thought is brought down with a precisely-placed arrow, before it even has the chance to fly.

Notice your mental and physical habits, which cause you to suffer, and remain within the absolute instead of indulging in them. Gradually, they will dissolve and the inner portal will become more open, naturally without the need for psychedelics.

One thing I've been wanting to ask is whether you are trying to sustain the extreme experiences you have on psychedelics, in the belief that this is possible as a perpetual state. It's not. Enlightenment is the unconditional flow state of the absolute, and ecstasy eventually resolves into serenity. As Ramana Maharshi puts it:

The final obstacle in meditation is ecstasy; you feel great bliss and happiness and want to stay in that ecstasy. Do not yield to it but pass to the next stage which is great calm. The calm is higher than ecstasy and it merges into samadhi.

Edited May 31, 2023 by Moksha

[Water by the River]

1 hour ago, Javfly33 said:

At this point I´ve reached more profound and clear states of Being without 'drugs' than with them. And yes, that includes the infamous 5 MEO. Which I´ve done over 10-15 plugged and 2 times inhaled. 'On my own' i go beyond 5 Meo. 

It's even better, because it doesn't have any of the residual confusion and anxiety of the ego. You are supposed to produce all of that on your own, not taking syringes up your ass for life or inhaling from a crack pipe. Fuck´s sakes.

 

1 hour ago, Javfly33 said:

But hey, to EACH THEIR OWN, I can't repeat myself more times... if they want to keep feeling miserable thinking a chemical has something they don't have, just because 'they want to be right' in their own limiting beliefs, to each their own...maybe when they get tired of it, and truly get in contact with the power is within (as new-agey as that sounds), another perspective can arise.

Really Inspiring. Bon voyage on your path, that will walk itself soon enough all by itself, just following the bliss of its own essence.

The Path showing itself to itself, after having won the grace of your True Nature.

Some day, there will no one walking this path anymore. The path will become the unfolding of Infinite Reality itself. A Reality so wonderful expressing itself in every moment that no interference will ever be necessary again, or even possible again.... 

 

The states that can be achieved by meditation and energetic techniques are real and very powerful with enough practice. Most people get quite serious when they see that:

The awakened states of for example infinite Nonduality, or Real Impersonal No-Self - Impersonal Infinite Consciousness Suchness, do have their impacts on the brainwaves, and for sure for the body-own Endo-Huasca-System producing a cocktail of body-endogenous Psychedelics:

https://dmtquest.org/endohuasca-magic/

How else to explain the powerful infinite nondual awakened states achieveable by Psychedelics can be had with meditation and energetic practices, and which are so similiar to the Psychedelic experiences? 

1 hour ago, Javfly33 said:

It's even better, because it doesn't have any of the residual confusion and anxiety of the ego. 

Yes. Because it is a stage that has been earned by transformation and transcendence. States that have become permanent as stages. Going from states, to plateaus, to very permanent stages. And the remaining self doing these practices gets more and more refined. Pure. Impersonal. Empty. Transcendal. 

Not the remains of a separate ego/self, switched on and off by psychedelics, but never fully gone. The remains hindering the Full Realization in daily life, and are also projected on Infinite Consciousness during the trip, disfiguring its pure empty impersonal nature. So some lense always remain that prevent the final deep shift of Full Enlightenment.

 

Ken Wilber: "The downside comes with people that only use psychedelics or drugs. And I found that over the years they just become mean it's somehow I just kind of closes them down.

Its  like you keep doing it and you keep doing it you keep doing and it doesn't quite cause the transformation. It can cause a peak experience but generally not a transformative experience and some people like David Deida will say that in order for altered changes of state to contribute to transformationpermit transformation it has to be basically endogenous not exogenous.

It has to be has your own source.

The people that do use both [psychedelics and meditation] and use it as a sacrament I think an enormous bit out of it. "

Anybody ever wondered why that is? That Spirit/Infinite Reality prevents the crossing over through the Gateless Gate to Full Enlightenment if the soul is not purified enough, the separate-self/ego-illusion emptied out and transcended completely, all deaths died, all illusions gone? Maybe it is not a bug, but a deep deep feature? If we admit Infinite Intelligence to Infinite Reality, maybe Infinite Reality demands and requires giving up and transcending certain last subtle lenses also, letting the Illusion of separation fully die? And a high degree of compassion and some kind of Boddhisattva-vow? Because Infinite Reality itself IS Love? A fundamental archetype of manifestation, of essence? Sounds familiar and resonates?

This combination of Transcendence and love is a deep structure of all spiritual systems of all ages.

Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj — 'Love says 'I am everything.' Wisdom says 'I am nothing.' Between the two, my life flows.'

Water by the River