The $2M Anti-Ageing Protocol For Longevity - Bryan Johnson

[aurum]

5 hours ago, integral said:

Taking a supplement for a few days you can tell by listing to you body if its healthy or not for you.

No you cannot. You can only tell the most gross, obvious effects. More subtle effects will completely allude you.

The reality for 99.9% people is they have no idea whether the supplements they are taking are doing what they intend for them to do. The natural feedback system of the body that you can tune into by “listening” is not robust enough. Unless you are a Vipassana interoceptive master or extremely gifted psychic, your intuition is not that strong. And even for these people I would have doubts.

To know what effects supplements are having on your body requires not just listening, but rigorous testing. Listening to how you feel is just one piece of data among many other potential pieces of data. It by itself is often incomplete.

5 hours ago, integral said:

I find it hard to believe he can take all of them all at the same time and that works for his body. 

Maybe. But the point is to use data to sift through these sort of hunches. This is the essence of science. Wellness is too complex for any one human to fully understand.

5 hours ago, integral said:

The point I was making is by taking all does supplements and medication and doing everything all at the same time he cant tell what each one does in isolation.

I understand the point. Obviously they don’t have perfect information and could be making errors, even serious errors. 

But consider the alternative, which is that it only seems impossible from your POV because you lack the level of data, testing and experts on staff that he has. 

[aurum]

5 hours ago, undeather said:

People used to ingest toxic amounts of arsenic because it "made them feel better" in the short run but of course is highly carcinogenic.
Ever taken an NSAID (Aspirin/Iburprofen)/Paracetamol or Cortison? You will feel noticabely better/healtier after taking those. Of course none of those meds are "healthy" per se in the long run.

This is what I've been contemplating lately.

Your body's feedback system is not really attuned for long-term, subtle effects on the system, like the slow build of atherosclerosis over 40 years. Hence why people drop dead of a heart attack and have no idea.

But the feedback system IS highly tuned for acute situations, like stepping on a nail or breaking a bone. That you will definitely most likely feel.

The problem becomes when we have long-term goals like longevity, but are relying on short-term, acute feedback. This cannot work.

4 hours ago, Michael569 said:

It probably is as long as he compensates with multi-nutrient formulas. I don't really think we know as much about the long-term effects of IF as we think we do. For longevity, less is probably preferable to more as long as he can keep his muscle and bone density from wasting. 

Any long-term diet where a person is losing muscle mass and bone mass will be cutting lifespan drastically. 

 

Undoubtably.

So far it seems like he has actually been able to put on a ton of muscle and strength. Will be extremely interesting to see where he ends up in 30-40 years.

[PenguinPablo]

12 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

That's from the perspective of your current life. You'd be surprised how easily you can adapt to new habits if you just try. I believe there are virtually no limits to what you can get used to.

exactly youve we've been duped into unhealthy = fun. snap out of that shit. 

[Schizophonia]

12 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

That's from the perspective of your current life. You'd be surprised how easily you can adapt to new habits if you just try. I believe there are virtually no limits to what you can get used to.

I don't know, it's still a lot. 

[Schizophonia]

4 minutes ago, PenguinPablo said:

exactly youve we've been duped into unhealthy = fun. snap out of that shit. 

There's a difference between associating pleasantness with unhealthy things and being disciplined like that.
It's like he never had time to do what he really wanted, or just let go.

[RendHeaven]

19 hours ago, CARDOZZO said:

Quotes that I love about the podcast:

• "My main source of inspiration is having read hundreds of biographies. I love learning about people in their time and place that were able to work on impossibly hard things so talent is the ability to hit the target no one else can, GENIUS hits the target no one else can SEE and the majority of us in life, we play the games that society gives us so that's hitting the target. So currently social media followers. People like to play games where points can be kept and you can be compared to people and ranked. GENIUS is a different GAME, it's trying to find things that DON'T EXIST and you need to have stamina and fortitude to go out and pave your own path and do things that are not recognized, appreciated or valued even in your LIFETIME. So to me reading biographies is about people who do that. They really try to survey all of existence, they are somehow IMMUNE to their time and place and are able to see these things."
• "So I like working with the concept of GEN ZERO of this idea that a group of humans walking into the future that is willing to divorce themselves from all human norms and customs."

 

fuck, that is inspiring

[CARDOZZO]

@RendHeaven ??

I’m thinking how to go to the genius path.

I’m playing some games society loves right now but also playing different games.

Why not create a new game?

[LoneWonderer]

Definitely stuff such as the simulated sunlight could be better achieved by actually going out in the sun as there are a complex array of processes that happen when we expose ourselves to natural sunlight that can't be achived by stimulating it with a lamp.

[sholomar]

I wear sunblock on my face and neck always, use tretinoin on my face, and take glycine supplements. Glycine is a component of collagen that people lack in their diets that helps maintain skin firmness. That's good enough of an anti-aging protocol for me. I allow my legs to get suntanned for the Vitamin D. Sometimes my arms too.

UV exposure causes skin to age faster. Ever notice how African Americans look much better as they age? Whites are ugly when they're old.

Some people also use things like NAC, NMN, and Fisetin. I don't really bother with any of that.

Edited May 26, 2023 by sholomar

[integral]

On 5/23/2023 at 8:50 PM, aurum said:

So far it seems like he has actually been able to put on a ton of muscle and strength. Will be extremely interesting to see where he ends up in 30-40 years.

Well he is taking:

• HGH .6mg, 5x wk
• Testosterone 2mg patch 6x weekly 

Not sure how much this is but doesn't testosterone injection cause muscle growth? Its not exactly "progress" to gain muscle when taking testosterone. Sure we can view it as an improvement but im thinking about this as if hes either taking more testosterone then his body can naturally produce or his body is struggling to produces testosterone so there is a underling problem that is not resolved that he masked with this patch.

If we look at people who abuse HGH and testosterone like body builders they die early from enlarged hearts and other complications. 

On 5/23/2023 at 8:50 PM, aurum said:

This is what I've been contemplating lately.

Your body's feedback system is not really attuned for long-term, subtle effects on the system, like the slow build of atherosclerosis over 40 years. Hence why people drop dead of a heart attack and have no idea.

But the feedback system IS highly tuned for acute situations, like stepping on a nail or breaking a bone. That you will definitely most likely feel.

The problem becomes when we have long-term goals like longevity, but are relying on short-term, acute feedback. This cannot work.

Short term acute feed back tells you to stop taking it. B12 supplementation causes over stimulation, that you can feel immediately, it raises the stress burden on the body. Taking it every day for years just adds stress to the system for years that leads to burn in out in the worse case, when complications happen no one links it back to the supplement or medication. Long term effects of treatment is the least understood thing there is. People that can tollerate taking it everyday are healthy, there body can handle the burden so they missed or did not take the time to understand how the substance is effecting them. 

On 5/23/2023 at 7:30 PM, aurum said:

Maybe. But the point is to use data to sift through these sort of hunches. This is the essence of science. Wellness is too complex for any one human to fully understand.

I understand this perspective and i view it as a over estimating the development of this field. The brightest minds, the innovators, visionaries and creative types arent attracted to the health industry. It attracts a specific type of person who is systemic in there thinking not synergistic. We need engineers not technicians. A doctor is a glorified technician.

On 5/23/2023 at 3:01 PM, undeather said:

Ever thought about that your are giving yourself a placebo/nocebo effect?
If you dont think that's possible - how would you know that?

Everything ingested has a specific effect on the body and mind. Its all psychoactive in a sense indirectly. If I where to ingest something blind I would know what it was based on how it made me feel. Every supplement, medication and food has a specific feeling when ingested. They also have secondary feelings that happen when its absorbed a second type deeper in the digestion system sometimes that happens at night causing disturbances. Im sure you fully understand all this im just explaining how when i eat chocolate for example there is a secondary absorption that i noticed that happends later on that causes a unhealth stimulation at the wrong time of the day like at night. I have no outside source for this knowledge, im not repeating what i saw in a youtube video, i learned this from tracking what I eat and observing my body. If I eat a tomato I get "tomato" high or enter a tomato state, its like mixing colors together in a cup and observing the new color combination. The effects of most supplements are major not minor, B12, vitamin C, omega 3 hit like a tone of bricks and all have a completely different effect, maybe im more sensitive but im guessing its more likely that im paying close attention. 

On 5/23/2023 at 3:01 PM, undeather said:

People used to ingest toxic amounts of arsenic because it "made them feel better" in the short run but of course is highly carcinogenic.
Ever taken an NSAID (Aspirin/Iburprofen)/Paracetamol or Cortison? You will feel noticabely better/healtier after taking those. Of course none of those meds are "healthy" per se in the long run.

Are you saying taking a supplement and feeling bad does not mean its bad for you? That you should keep taking it because its good for you even if you feel bad? 

Edited May 27, 2023 by integral

[aurum]

17 hours ago, integral said:

Not sure how much this is but doesn't testosterone injection cause muscle growth? Its not exactly "progress" to gain muscle when taking testosterone. Sure we can view it as an improvement but im thinking about this as if hes either taking more testosterone then his body can naturally produce or his body is struggling to produces testosterone so there is a underling problem that is not resolved that he masked with this patch.

According their reports, it’s just enough to offset the hormone loss from the calorie restriction he is on. It’s not meant to push him above normal ranges, like with bodybuilders.

I do think this could be an argument against the caloric restriction he is doing. But so far he seems to be managing fine. We will have to see if it crumbles on him.

17 hours ago, integral said:

Short term acute feed back tells you to stop taking it. B12 supplementation causes over stimulation, that you can feel immediately, it raises the stress burden on the body.

This is a gross effect. Yes, gross effects can be felt. But you cannot feel extremely subtle effects, like the build up of atherosclerosis. Proof is that the vast majority of people who have atherosclerosis have no clue about it. They eat like trash and think everything is going well.

If you claim you have an extra level of sensitivity beyond normal humans, fine. Good for you. But that is not 99.9% of people. 99.9% of people need testing and data.

17 hours ago, integral said:

It attracts a specific type of person who is systemic in there thinking not synergistic. We need engineers not technicians. A doctor is a glorified technician.

That is true to a degree. But you can still find many doctors who are deeply systemic and evolved in the health industry. And even doctors who are overly reductionistic still understand quite a lot in their field.

[LfcCharlie4]

Tbf if you was a basically a billionaire & completed all your life's goals maybe you would do this lmao 

I could never be this robotic personally, but I think its great people are testing it 

However, the danger with N=1 is that if he dies at say 70-80 (no matter how many blueprint participants there are) everyone will dismiss it 

I personally think the 'basics' cover the majority of what you need, although maybe this is how you can eek out another 10-20 years of life....

[Michael569]

Well, I officially have a first client who wants to go elbows deep into this protocol You don't realise how much nitty gritty there is until you start to properly dig into the protocol. I mean the guy eats 16 pounds of black lentils a month!! 

The diet part is more or less doable although very restrictive but it is the supplement bit that concerns me a bit and the fact that folks are just buying packs of 30 supplemental boxes without any understanding of what they can do and how they can interact with eachother. 

I don't think Bryan appreciates how some of these supplements can contraindicate each other, not to mention people are taking all sorts of meds which can also be contraindicated. There should probably be more warnings about this all over the page. 

Nevertheless, he is slowly influencing a small generation of excited young men who basically want to become superheroes : D

The potential risk I'm seeing are major health anxieties, ageing phobia, paranoia and obsession about getting endless amount of results. Bryan himself admits that he has now stopped making progress, seems like a lot of the benefits are really down to extremely low body fat, sunlight avoidance and caloric restriction. 

The question is, can this be kept for another 20 years? 

[LfcCharlie4]

@Michael569  Sunlight avoidance? 

I think all the Bio-Hackers admit 85% come from the basics. 

I also think its a lot easier if you have a goal, e.g. you're a pro athlete and want optimal performance

[CARDOZZO]

Bryan is risking all to be a pioneer.

[Michael569]

On 6/9/2023 at 10:34 AM, LfcCharlie4 said:

Sunlight avoidance? 

wrinkles and skin ageing - I am not a huge advocate of complete sun avoidance but anyone who wants to go into this and look like a teenager in their 40s need to minimise sunlight exposure and supplement the vitamin D or get it from a diet. 

On 6/9/2023 at 10:34 AM, LfcCharlie4 said:

think all the Bio-Hackers admit 85% come from the basics. 

Yah, I agree. There is a lot of hype around the supplements he is using and the most important factors (lifestyle, diet and mental aspects) are easily forgotten.

Edited June 10, 2023 by Michael569

[integral]

@Michael569 Make a Bryan Johnson how to guide on youtube with full cooking instruction for all his meals im sure it will do well. ?Ride the trend. 

Edited June 9, 2023 by integral

[LoneWonderer]

Have to say it is very very interesting what this guy is doing for anyone interested in health and longevity. ?

[zurew]

22 hours ago, integral said:

Make a Bryan Johnson how to guide on youtube with full cooking instruction for all his meals im sure it will do well.

Yeah. Maybe Bryan will invite you in his team and you can get inside his rich circle and take your LP to the next level @Michael569 

[Michael569]

@zurew while it would probably include selling a big chunk of my integrity, from a financial perspective being able to leave corporate would probably be worth it  

On 09/06/2023 at 3:40 PM, integral said:

Make a Bryan Johnson how to guide on youtube with full cooking instruction

I already have those kinds of videos up there ..when I was still making content that is.... I made a few legume veg batch cook videos  Dunno why I stopped making those; probably too much work and editing 

Edited June 10, 2023 by Michael569