Dear Leo, is Mathematics legit?

[Husseinisdoingfine]

You published a while ago a blog post claiming that no mathematician knew what infinity was: https://actualized.org/insights/explaining-infinity

I'm wondering, was Pythagoras correct to believe that Mathematics could be used to understand reality? Or is Mathematics a purely ideological game with nothing to do with absolute truth?

In your deepest awakenings, what happens to mathematics? Does it dissolve as its' a self deception or does your understanding of it deepen and enhance?

Edited May 4, 2023 by Husseinisdoingfine

[Leo Gura]

There is truth in mathematics but you have to understand what kind of truth it is. It is conceptual in nature. You have to consider its limits, context, and what you're using it for. You have to be careful about what you think it means.

Edited May 4, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Husseinisdoingfine]

12 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

 It is conceptual in nature.

Is there absolute truth in mathematics or is it entirely conceptual. Or is it like Holy Books, conceptual fingers pointing to absolute truth but not absolute in it of itself.

[SonataAllegro]

I find there is a metaphysically-embodied mathematical nature to consciousness, but it is wayyyy too complex for my brain to understand. It's more like a combination of music and math, which flies by me in seconds during an awakening and leaves before I have time to think about it.

[Leo Gura]

3 hours ago, Husseinisdoingfine said:

Is there absolute truth in mathematics or is it entirely conceptual.

You should contemplate the relationship between absolute truth and conceptual truth.

[Kenza Benjelloun]

On 5/4/2023 at 5:44 AM, Leo Gura said:

There is truth in mathematics but you have to understand what kind of truth it is.

Dear Leo,

I've never dared post anything because since 2014 I've been following you and growing with you. But on this topic I feel the need to comment. In fact I've recently wrote a scientific article about a topic in ordinal computability, some interesting set-theoretic ideas which seemed so important to me last year when I first started to work on them, and now feel so hollow and unsignificant, to the point where I'm considering stepping away from this domain all together. It's such a painful endeavor to dive deep into this set theory universe where nothing seems to make sense. Sometimes I feel the glimpse of hope like maybe I'm starting to see the logic but really I'm starting to realize that a lot of scientists in this domain don't know shit about what life truly is, or even what mathematics truly is. They write articles as though it was the truth, but in the over-complications I don't see the beauty of life anymore. It's like the poetry of it went full-circle and now all I can see is meaningless symbols and people drunk on their own self-importance. I moved to Italy recently for my PhD in theoretical computer science, and it's hard to find meaning when you feel like you're constantly moving everywhere with no real "home". Your work has been with me for now 9 years to guide me and make me feel understood. Some of your most profound insights ressemble things I saw in my dreams before, I feel connected to you and your universe and your view of the world. Mathematics is a powerful tool to explore certain aspects of the universe but there is no such thing as absolute truth through the subjective lenses of this field _ like any another.

[Kenza Benjelloun]

ps. we miss you

[Leo Gura]

@Kenza Benjelloun I hear what you're saying, but there is another level at which you can really appreciate the intelligence of mathematics and symbolic understanding.

So it's not as bleak as you frame it. Symbolic systems and language is really profound stuff once you go post-material, post-rational on it.

Edited May 6, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Buck Edwards]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

@Kenza Benjelloun I hear what you're saying, but there is another level at which you can really appreciate the intelligence of mathematics and symbolic understanding.

So it's not as bleak as you frame it. Symbolic systems and language is really profound stuff once you go post-material, post-rational on it.

Mathematics teaches us unity. We have to square everything to make it fair. 

I've a lot of potential you know. You simply have to give it time for it to really show up. 

One plus one is two. Nothing exists as nothing. 

Food for thought. I mean math for thought. 

 

Edited May 6, 2023 by Enlightement

[hyruga]

Maths is based on axioms so you can do this like 1+1 =2 because you define 1 to stand for quantity of one unit.

So you have things like 1 cookie + 1 cookie = 2 cookies. 

But then: "Teacher, I break one cookie into two so now I have 2+1= 3 cookies."

 

[Defensive Fisherman]

6 hours ago, hyruga said:

Maths is based on axioms so you can do this like 1+1 =2 because you define 1 to stand for quantity of one unit.

So you have things like 1 cookie + 1 cookie = 2 cookies. 

But then: "Teacher, I break one cookie into two so now I have 2+1= 3 cookies."

 

There is an assumption here that two identical cookies exist in reality. And also that a cookie exists. And that we can know when two cookies are the same. And that we know what a cookie is.

[Ninja_pig]