The healthiest diet

[Jannes]

2 hours ago, Someone here said:

They are plant-based. What do you think Oats are? Wheat. And what category of food does Wheat belong to? 

No oats are oats and not wheat. It's a grain where wheat, spelt, rye, .. fall under. Per definition grains are not vegetables.

2 hours ago, Someone here said:

Sure. You might have some nutritional lack in some nutrients like protein and Zinc etc. So you can supplement it.

Sure. I would try to get most of the protein from the diet though as protein powders can contain heavy metals. With legumes and grains you can get enough protein though so you don't even need to supplement that. 

2 hours ago, Someone here said:

Most animal products nowadays are injected with bad hormones for you. 

True. 

Well you could buy very organic animal products but that's expensive. 

 

 

[UnbornTao]

9 hours ago, Someone here said:

vitamins are chemicals. There’s no difference between ascorbic acid from an orange or ascorbic acid from a lab. 

I think I read about whole foods being nutritionally greater than the sum of its parts. Compounds interact in synergistic and complex ways, influencing things like absorption, etc. Taking an isolated supplement doesn't have all of those synergies between compounds, fibre, etc. Between eating a kiwi and merely supplementing vitamin C, there might be a world of difference.

Ask one of the forum's nutritionist, @Michael569.

 

Edited May 1, 2023 by UnbornTao

[Schizophonia]

42 minutes ago, UnbornTao said:

I think there might be. I've heard or read that a whole food and its vitamins and minerals interact in complex ways, influencing stuff like absorption, etc as opposed to consuming a single supplement. Between eating kiwi and merely supplementing vitamin c, I'd say that there's a world of difference.

Ask the forum's nutritionist, Michael.  

There are no particular interactions between vitamins.
There are often some between minerals, but what a difference between complementing oneself excessively in "zinc" compared to copper, and eating too many oysters compared to the liver (or vice versa) ? What is the difference between supplementing too much with calcium carbonate compared to iron, and eating too much milk/green leaves compared to meat, spinach etc (and vice versa).

It's just a story that people make up to inflate their egos.
"I eat real food so it's better than buying vitamins"

 

Anyway the soils are impoverished and everyone lacks vitamins, unless they have a perfect diet or almost.

Edited April 30, 2023 by Schizophonia

[integral]

45 minutes ago, Schizophonia said:

It's just a story that people make up to inflate their egos.
"I eat real food so it's better than buying vitamins"

All talk with no life experience, stop jumping to conclusions. 

Everyone needs to get serious about what they think they know.

Edited April 30, 2023 by integral

[Schizophonia]

47 minutes ago, integral said:

All talk with no life experience, stop jumping to conclusions. 

Everyone needs to get serious about what they think they know.

Can you explain to me what I'm wrong about? Yeah, I can see a lot of people thinking like that because they don't like the idea that you can just take a quality multivitamin to reverse deficiencies. A bit like "bodybuilding is not real muscle", but nutrition version.

 

Note that I am talking about vitamin/mineral supplements only, I know there are polyphenols etc that make the difference in natural products.

[Noahsteelers34]

I went raw vegan for a while. It is expensive, and yes you have to eat a lot. The biggest thing you may be overlooking is how emotionally difficult it is to permanently transition to a 100% raw fruit and vegies diet. It can really be very unenjoyable at times. Im not saying its good or bad I personally don't know, but I personally was miserable on a raw vegan diet. You have to live life a little. Why would GOD create a world filled with thousands of delicious foods and cuisines, yet all you are supposed to eat is raw fruits and veggies all day every day? 

@M A J I You are like a walking parrot of Loren Lockmen. Speaking from someone who has done a long water fast with him, I would be careful about blindly falling into his dogma.

[integral]

1 hour ago, Schizophonia said:

Can you explain to me what I'm wrong about? Yeah, I can see a lot of people thinking like that because they don't like the idea that you can just take a quality multivitamin to reverse deficiencies. A bit like "bodybuilding is not real muscle", but nutrition version.

Note that I am talking about vitamin/mineral supplements only, I know there are polyphenols etc that make the difference in natural products.

There's a bunch of side effects to taking multivitamins that don't happen when eating food. 

A lot of partitions will recommend taking a b-complex to nearly everyone because "just in case" and "youll pee out the extra". But this is actually a mistake and the reason is b-complex is highly stimulatory on the system so your not simply pee in out, its first effecting you. So if you give a b-complex to someone with anxiety and sleeping issues you make the situation worse, they never figure out this "harnessless" vitamin supplement made it worse and they experience hell for a while. If they where to eat foods high in b-vitamins this same issue no longer happens. This is one random example.

To figure out if taking vitamin-c supplement is the same as eating a bell pepper you got to experiment with your body and with other peoples bodies to see. 

[UnbornTao]

@Schizophonia real food provides a plethora a compounds, plus fibre, etc. By eating, say, too many oysters, you may as well increase your zinc levels and so the difference would be negligible compared to taking a Zinc supplement. However, oysters provide more nutritional value than that. Whole foods are greater than the sum of its parts. As far as I know, science doesn't yet fully know how such intricate synergies and relationships between food's compounds work and how they affect the human body. 

in any case im talking out of my ass. better do the research and ask a nutritionist.

 

Quote

 I can see a lot of people thinking like that because they don't like the idea that you can just take a quality multivitamin to reverse deficiencies. 

 

Note that I am talking about vitamin/mineral supplements only, I know there are polyphenols etc that make the difference in natural products.

Ok, then.

Edited May 1, 2023 by UnbornTao

[M A J I]

5 hours ago, Noahsteelers34 said:

I went raw vegan for a while. It is expensive, and yes you have to eat a lot. The biggest thing you may be overlooking is how emotionally difficult it is to permanently transition to a 100% raw fruit and vegies diet. It can really be very unenjoyable at times. Im not saying its good or bad I personally don't know, but I personally was miserable on a raw vegan diet. You have to live life a little. Why would GOD create a world filled with thousands of delicious foods and cuisines, yet all you are supposed to eat is raw fruits and veggies all day every day? 

@M A J I You are like a walking parrot of Loren Lockmen. Speaking from someone who has done a long water fast with him, I would be careful about blindly falling into his dogma.

Let me break this down for you young one. Being 'too expensive' is a poor excuse when it comes to health and vitality of your own body, you won't be saying that on your death bed, you simply don't wanna take full responsibility of your health and life. Because if you truly value health, quality comes first. I consume 90 - 100% organic produce and I am not financially rich, I just know and believe in my energy/frequency as my currency/abundance, so life flows for me very well, everything is often always in sync. I remain as the dominant energy of my universe, not allow others to run it for me.

If you really think about it, people spend $20 - $50 eating out at a nice dinner in one night, instead they could buy a box of fruit & veg and last them all week. Many times its not really more expensive, just how peoples minds 'think' and they also need to shop at local fruit market not supermarkets 10x the price. Buy in bulk, much cheaper. The cleaner your body, the better your health, the more "efficient" you become, the less food you actually need.

You have to 'eat a lot' because your body has become used to eating a lot... You cant just jump from diesel to petrol overnight. All people like you fail because you are uneducated and lack a proper guide and teacher with years of experience because the (transition) does not occur overnight, especially if you been consuming the wrong foods your whole life and your body has become used to that type/source of nourishment so it can be "shocking" for the body if you shift too drastically.

Then there is (detoxification)... if you do not properly detox and fast to remove all the chemicals, meat-parasites, candida, biofilms, heavy metals and other harmful toxins and bacteria, of course you will struggle and experience pain and discomfort. You have to purge yourself of all those "demons" within you that crave the food that makes you sick, so to speak... The original state has no craving, not even fruit, yet in the 'purified state', fruit is the only thing that is appealing.

Its 'emotionally challenging' as I already mentioned before... because once you clear up the "suppression" things (arise to the surface to be met) and most people cannot face their own shit and shadows so they quickly resort back to animal products, junk foods, drugs and comforts, the truth is too much for most people. Hence the people on this forum. It used to be many more conscious souls until Leo brainwashed the majority of you under his imaginary castle and banns all those who threaten his dominion and beliefs.

As you said "I personally don't know" end of story. You have no value or true long-term experience and expertise that I clearly do. 99% of flavors you add to your fake foods stem from fruits and vegetables and salts, nowhere in human nature you actually enjoy the eating and drinking of fresh blood, you are not a carnivore nor an omnivore as much as you wish to believe it so.

Loren Lockmen is all about fasting, I don't agree with him on many things, I am more aligned with the work of Professor Arnold Ehret and Hilton Hotema. If you could actually grasp their intelligence, we wouldn't be having these discussions.

I am only here temporary, its your life.

 

 

Edited May 1, 2023 by M A J I

[M A J I]

Unborn Tao knows his stuff, you guys can learn a thing or two if you actually had the capacity to open those closed minds and listen...

Most people here have little understanding of how nature actually works, they base themselves on online and scientific studies which most are flawed and outdated and funded by the same system that keeps your bodies hooked on the wrong foods and their drugs that have your minds deluded in the first place, a never ending cycle.

Of course deluded people will never see their own delusions until they stop eating and living the way they have been doing their whole lives, which is why fasting and a change of lifestyle/environment is so threatening because it destroys every little artificial barrier and belief you have created or adopted from the world. Its easier to accept the lie you've been spoon fed your whole lives, its easier to do evil than take the heroes journey. The path back to Self is too challenging for most because their minds are in control.

Lets talk supplements: Brazil nuts have the highest Selenium of any food, eat a whole bag full, calculate the selenium intake (that your half-truth medical science) says is dangerously lethal amounts, you will be fine, you will feel nourished and full, maybe a bit heavy for a few days. Now try it with some selenium supplement, make sure to be in a hospital because you will most probably drop dead soon from taking the same amount of something artificially created in a lab.

Nature is an infinitely intelligent organism that has been 'perfecting' life for billions of years, man being its most 'advanced' yet simultaneously most 'dangerous' candidate, also has the capacity to tap into this infinite intelligence but most, almost all men are disconnected from such so they create a artificial nature that they 'think' is better when its their entire downfall into ignorance and the root of the sickness and delusion in this world. Trying to out do Creation when most have no idea who they truly are yet.

Playing gods without Knowing Thyself = the last 12 thousand years of 'dark ages'/delusion.

Edited May 1, 2023 by M A J I

[The0Self]

That would be rather suboptimal protein intake, among other things. To the point of potential health consequences. 

[Noahsteelers34]

@M A J I i did a 21 day water fast with Loren lockmen. I was promised by the end of refeeding I would feel amazing and my body would be detoxed. I was promised I wouldn’t be hungry and my back pain would be gone. All promises were empty. I was constantly hungry on the raw vegan diet. I felt terribly depressed. I was promised the fast and the raw vegan diet would hydrate me, when I reality I got terrible rashes to the point my skin was bleeding, and I was actually dehydrated. My friends all said I wasn’t acting like myself, and I looked like I was dying. 
 

maybe I quit too early, all I know is it was hell and to me not worth it. 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 1, 2023 by Noahsteelers34

[M A J I]

@Noahsteelers34 That is too rapid bro.. I don't agree with Loren lockman he is a bit of a nutcase in my eyes and is more about money than anything else as John Rose would say. I would never pay thousands of dollars to go to his retreat, I usually help people for free. I take the (Mucusless diet healing system approach) by Professor Arnold Ehret

These are the reasons why many people experience health issues and fail at going fully plant-based. The (transition) can take years for most people, and if its hell then you are creating too much "shock" on your body and need to be more gentle.

You have to think of what you put into your bodies like you do with drugs. You cant just stop them cold turkey, you gradually wean off them as you introduce more and more healthier or more natural alternatives until you can eventually stop them completely where the body no longer has withdrawals and negative side effects.

This is why people like myself and Professor Spira and other more health & human nutrition conscious specialists are here to help people transition properly but we can only do so much...

Always happen to help.

[Buck Edwards]

@M A J I do you live somewhere in the US in a city? 

[M A J I]

1 minute ago, Enlightement said:

@M A J I do you live somewhere in the US in a city? 

Australia currently, I move about.

[Schizophonia]

On 30/04/2023 at 10:32 PM, integral said:

There's a bunch of side effects to taking multivitamins that don't happen when eating food. 

A lot of partitions will recommend taking a b-complex to nearly everyone because "just in case" and "youll pee out the extra". But this is actually a mistake and the reason is b-complex is highly stimulatory on the system so your not simply pee in out, its first effecting you. So if you give a b-complex to someone with anxiety and sleeping issues you make the situation worse, they never figure out this "harnessless" vitamin supplement made it worse and they experience hell for a while. If they where to eat foods high in b-vitamins this same issue no longer happens. This is one random example.

To figure out if taking vitamin-c supplement is the same as eating a bell pepper you got to experiment with your body and with other peoples bodies to see. 

No, some multivitamins will on the contrary sedate you by reducing methylation (by niacin, folic acid, b12...)

[integral]

2 hours ago, Schizophonia said:

No, some multivitamins will on the contrary sedate you by reducing methylation (by niacin, folic acid, b12...)

Why would that conflict with what I said? 

Edited May 2, 2023 by integral

[Schizophonia]

46 minutes ago, integral said:

Why would that conflict with what I said? 

You said : 

"b-complex is highly stimulatory on the system so your not simply pee in out, its first effecting you. So if you give a b-complex to someone with anxiety and sleeping issues you make the situation worse, they never figure out this "harnessless" vitamin supplement made it worse and they experience hell for a while"

I argue that it is in fact often the opposite.
Pure Encapsulation's b-complex sedates me and helps me sleep/relax, probably because of the niacin. 

Edited May 2, 2023 by Schizophonia

[integral]

3 minutes ago, Schizophonia said:

Pure Encapsulation's b-complex sedates me and helps me sleep/relax, probably because of the niacin. 

That's it, its a relative. The body of the individual will react differently depending on many factors. I made the statement that it was stimulator and can cause anxiety but that does not match your personal experience. All of this is lost when googling things and forming beliefs with studies and data. 

Edited May 2, 2023 by integral

[Michael569]

22 minutes ago, Schizophonia said:

"b-complex is highly stimulatory on the system so your not simply pee in out, its first effecting you. So if you give a b-complex to someone with anxiety and sleeping issues you make the situation worse, they never figure out this "harnessless" vitamin supplement made it worse and they experience hell for a while"

I argue that it is in fact often the opposite.
Pure Encapsulation's b-complex sedates me and helps me sleep/relax, probably because of the niacin

I think you're both right to a degree but it might just be more complicated than A or B. 

Certain mental health issues have indeed been associated with B-deficiency and giving people B-complex might help (if that was the causative factor) although the data is inconclusive as you may see. Forest Plots are borderline statistically significant and confidence intervals remain fairly wide which tells you there is more to it (as it always is) 

On the other hand, some people do indeed find them energising. B-vitamins are a part of the glycolysis & Kreb Cycle that help your body produce ATP (energy currency) so technically if you were long-term deficient and suddenly you get an influx of B-s in a way you are getting "back on the baseline" but for anyone long term deprived this may come across as "highly stimulating" because they've just been deficient for so long they forgot what it feels like to have energy (this is actually pretty common among guys, I've seen a  fair share of that in my practice) 

In addition, B vitamins are cofactors in all sorts of metabolic processes including things like neurotransmitters and even certain hormones so in a way, you might just be getting back to "feeling normal". 

And finally, B vitamins are notoriously difficult to measure because they do not hang around for too long (with exception of B12) and so most standardised blood tests are inaccurate and specific essays such as EGOT, MMA or Red Blood Cell Folate need to be acquired for an adequate tissue representation. As an example, a person who just took B12 supplement would show "normal" on Serum B12 but would show high on Methylmalonic Acid test indicating that in reality their tissue levels are depleted but the blood test only saw the circulating supplement so we can't really tell if we are looking at the right thing to begin with 

From experience with client work, on their own, they rarely do much if not part of a larger dietary/lifestyle modification and at that point we no longer know what made the difference anymore (the major challenge with epidemiology) 

But then who knows, there is still much we don't understand

 

Edited May 2, 2023 by Michael569