Understanding

[Yimpa]

1 hour ago, Squeekytoy said:

It's a metaphor. I hear you spiritual types love that shit. 

1 + 1 = 2 is a metaphor.

But for someone stuck in logic they are too blind to see that.

[Moksha]

1 hour ago, Breakingthewall said:

You don't understand what I'm saying. When you realize the absolute, is still your direct experience. only that exists. the only absolute there is is your direct experience, which now seems relative, now absolute.

I understand what you're saying, even if you think I don't.

Direct experience isn't what you think. The vast majority of what you experience in life is not direct. It is indirect. You become entangled in phenomena, rather than seeing only the absolute, which is the essence but NOT the appearance of the phenomena.

Direct experience is only absolute. There are no phenomena getting in the way. It is unconditional love and unassailable silence. It bypasses the mind entirely. It's like tasting water for the first time. If there is any thinking involved, any sensations, any perceptions, any experiences, or any dualities, it is NOT DIRECT EXPERIENCE.

It only happens when the price of entry is paid, and when it does, it is absolute and undeniable. It is the tiniest point of absolute reality, and it is so sharp that it can puncture every egoic bubble, no matter how inflated it may be.

[Breakingthewall]

1 hour ago, Squeekytoy said:

Not in the way that you think. 

 

It's a metaphor. I hear you spiritual types love that shit. 

1 hour ago, Squeekytoy said:

 

Saying things like that in a forum doesn't make any sense. Expose what according to you is, do not say: you are wrong, and that's it. what is the purpose of that?

[Breakingthewall]

7 minutes ago, Moksha said:

Direct experience isn't what you think

Why do you assume that? How do you know how I'm experiencing my direct experience? From my perspective it seems that you project baseless ideas

Edited April 28, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[Moksha]

2 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Why do you assume that? How do you know how I'm experiencing my direct experience? From my perspective it seems that you project baseless ideas

Read again what I said. Anything that can be thought is not direct experience.

[Breakingthewall]

30 minutes ago, Moksha said:

It's like tasting water for the first time. If there is any thinking involved, any sensations, any perceptions, any experiences, or any dualities, it is NOT DIRECT EXPERIENCE.

Thats false. when you become completely detached from the content of the mind, you realize that mental noise is the same as silence. 

It's kind of maddening these conversations because you assume that I haven't gotten out of the ego talk and emotional history. I can do mushrooms and not have a thought, or have them but see them for what they are, the same in the sober experience.

although sometimes I enter into mental suffering, I know what that is, the suffering can be conscious, it is one more experience that sometimes happens. silence is one experience, noise another. It's easy for me to quiet my mind and meditate, but what about that? It's just a technique to feel better and more centered, very useful, but silence is no more true than mental noise if you don't get attached to it.

Edited April 28, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[Breakingthewall]

8 minutes ago, Squeekytoy said:

Because everything else that anyone says to you goes out the other ear. 

 

That's very useful too. other people is reading here, not just me. Try be more constructive

Edited April 28, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[Yimpa]

True understanding comes from realizing that you actually don’t know anything.

[Moksha]

22 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

It's just a technique to feel better and more centered, very useful, but silence is no more true than mental noise if you don't get attached to it.

I'm not referring to silence as the absence of auditory sensations.

By silence, I am referring to the direct spiritual transmission of absolute truth which is entirely devoid of every phenomenon.

[Breakingthewall]

2 minutes ago, Moksha said:

I'm not referring to silence as the absence of auditory sensations.

By silence, I am referring to the direct spiritual transmission of absolute truth which is entirely devoid of every phenomenon.

total silence can be achieved with meditation and also with psychedelics. in both cases it is not only the absence of mental noise but the absence of limits. you as ego are a limiter, a wall. you create the appearance of finitude, when reality is limitless, infinite. if you have realized infinity many times, you realize that the walls are infinity too, everything is. This is for me the goal of meditation and psychedelic work, the dissolution of limits. once dissolved, and with the mind in silence, is when the understanding begins. understanding is not mental, learned or achieved by logical procedures, it is direct experience

 

[Inliytened1]

On 4/27/2023 at 4:58 AM, Breakingthewall said:

understanding is the key to spirituality. Imagine a teenager who sees the world in terms of being better or worse than everyone else, completely materialistic and superficial. that is his understanding. for him that is the world, but this does not mean that the world is like that. If his understanding increases, he will see that human relationships go deeper, how people mix with others, how a parent's personality affects a child's psyche. He was subjected to all these tides before, but he did not understand it. now he sees, a new dimension opens in him, his mind widens in depth and breadth. maybe later he will understand that the others are him, and how he is creating this multicolored dance at this exact moment. That there is only inside, and outside don't exist even as a concept. this understanding will bring down another wall, and his psyche will once again increase in depth and breadth. the limits are moving away until they disappear. now there are no limits, but he has only begun to understand. each phase of understanding is difficult to overcome, since before the barrier that prevented you from seeing fell, you did not know what you were looking for. maybe you close yourself thinking that you have already understood everything, or that there is nothing to understand. Bullshit, you've only just begun. let's move on, penetrating into the beauty of reality

Omniscience IS Spirituality.   Love IS Spirituality.   The Unity of both Omniscience and Love is God.

[Breakingthewall]

6 hours ago, Inliytened1 said:

Omniscience IS Spirituality.   Love IS Spirituality.   The Unity of both Omniscience and Love is God.

Exactly, and we are, only we are in the mire of confusion and separation, which veils omniscience and love. Spirituality is coming out of apparent confusion and separation and closer to the omniscience and love that are the truth.

Edited April 29, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[Moksha]

1 minute ago, Breakingthewall said:

total silence can be achieved with meditation and also with psychedelics. in both cases it is not only the absence of mental noise but the absence of limits

Imagination is unlimited, and it is the enemy of silence.

I'm not referring to somatic and mental silence, as if submersing yourself in a sensory deprivation tank will awaken you. I'm referring to the direct realization of the absolute communicating with itself. It is light resonating with light.

The words mean nothing until you realize it, and when you do, the disparagement by others is equally meaningless.

[Yimpa]

6 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

understanding is not mental, learned or achieved by logical procedures, it is direct experience

Logic is also part of understanding. But logic is not the only factor involved.

[Breakingthewall]

10 minutes ago, Moksha said:

Imagination is unlimited, and it is the enemy of silence.

Imagination is limited, in fact, it's a limiter. infinity is like having a hole in your being where there is no limit, it is infinite. then you really realize that this hole is a source of unlimited love and that this experience that is happening right now is existence making love to itself, and it's perfection. This is not mental or conceptual, it is a real realization, of maximum beauty, which can be intuited sober but which is realized to the bottom with psychedelics. after this you realize that everything is that, silence and noise too, it is the understanding of what reality is, but it is difficult to maintain it

Edited April 28, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[Breakingthewall]

7 minutes ago, Yimpa said:

Logic is also part of understanding. But logic is not the only factor involved.

Id say that logic happens after understanding. it is what gives structure to what has been understood

[josemar]

8 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Id say that logic happens after understanding. it is what gives structure to what has been understood

It's not clear to me what you consider the definition of understanding, and how it relates (if it does) to mental concepts

 

[Yimpa]

3 minutes ago, josemar said:

It's not clear to me what you consider the definition of understanding, and how it relates (if it does) to mental concepts

Can you understand mental concepts without understanding what mental concepts are?

[Moksha]

6 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Imagination is limited, in fact, it's a limiter. infinity is like having a hole in your being where there is no limit, it is infinite. then you really realize that this hole is a source of unlimited love and that this experience that is happening right now is existence making love to itself, and it's perfection. This is not mental or conceptual, it is a real realization, of maximum beauty, which can be intuited sober but which is realized to the bottom with psychedelics. after this you realize that everything is that, silence and noise too, it is the understanding of what reality is, but it is difficult to maintain it

I'm referring to limitless absolute, not human, imagination. Give yourself a break from phenomenal exploration for a while, and deepen your direct spiritual realization without distraction.

Just my 2 spiritual cents 

[Breakingthewall]

5 hours ago, Moksha said:

I'm referring to limitless absolute, not human, imagination. Give yourself a break from phenomenal exploration for a while, and deepen your direct spiritual realization without distraction.

Just my 2 spiritual cents 

Did you read what I said? Who talked about phenomena or imagination? Nothing of what is said penetrate in you mind, and your message is just: the absolute is the truth, the relative is false.i realized the absolute, and you don't. Do you think that it's possible to have a conversation in those terms? Frustrating, seems that you have the need of defending a position

 

Edited April 29, 2023 by Breakingthewall