Adeptus Psychonautica talks about Leo/Connor again (another suicide revealed)

[The Mystical Man]

18 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Osho or sadhguru don't try to make you to realize what you are.

Sadhguru doesn't focus on that, but many other teachers do. Maharaj and Maharshi don't care about anything but that.

[Yimpa]

4 hours ago, Thought Art said:

@Yimpa that is common I think

note: I didn’t edit your post I just have big dumb thumbs 

Ha! Didn’t even know that’s possible, cool.

[Danioover9000]

@Thought Art

2 hours ago, Thought Art said:

Leo is best teacher of all time for me personally. 
 

But, he also has a different personality than say Osho. I enjoy Osho. I don’t really resonate with Sadhguru. But respect him. 
 

I like Wisdom, I like insights, I like philosophy, I like music, I like relationships, I like awakening, I like self help… etc in the end, if the guy was named Mark, who taught me how to master life and big picture thinking…. Or if her name was Sarah… it wouldn’t matter.

The teacher doesn’t matter. Though… personality, presentation, and aesthetic do play a role for me. I like the aesthetic of his videos and the wisdom. Honestly, it’s just a great service for me.

   That's nice, I'm similar. Osho though is a bit slower for my view, but if I want to slow down he's good to listen to. Sadh guru is a bit better in pacing and if I want an insight with a story to it and a bit of humour he's perfect for it. Leo is when I'm excited and giddy to listen to his insights, never amazes me that he's the exception to the rule of talking too fast /=/ higher intelligence. 

[spiritual memes]

15 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

I'm not interested in compassion. I'm interested in serious understanding of reality. Any compassion I have -- which I still have plenty of -- is secondary. This is not a mistake. This is by design.

From your very own teachings, and my own insights, love is the ultimate reality. Therefore there should not be a disconnect between the two. Any teaching of the ultimate reality must be loving and compassionate otherwise it isn't the ultimate truth. Because the ultimate truth is love.

If you aren't interested in compassion then you aren't really interested in the highest truth. Since compassion is applied love and love is the highest truth. These are your own words!

your lack of compassion is a serious and legitimate concern for many people, not because they aren't interested in higher truth, but because your lack of compassion is not aligned with the highest truth. And no amount of alien consciousness or god realization is going to change that.

[Yimpa]

17 minutes ago, spiritual memes said:

Any teaching of the ultimate reality must be loving and compassionate otherwise it isn't the ultimate truth. Because the ultimate truth is love.

Isn’t that a limit you’re placing upon Consciousness?

[spiritual memes]

Just now, Yimpa said:

Isn’t that a limit you’re placing upon Consciousness?

Its a limit I am placing on teachings about consciousness. Which is fine.

[Osaid]

10 minutes ago, spiritual memes said:

From your very own teachings, and my own insights, love is the ultimate reality. Therefore there should not be a disconnect between the two. Any teaching of the ultimate reality must be loving and compassionate otherwise it isn't the ultimate truth. Because the ultimate truth is love.

If you aren't interested in compassion then you aren't really interested in the highest truth. Since compassion is applied love and love is the highest truth. These are your own words!

your lack of compassion is a serious and legitimate concern for many people, not because they aren't interested in higher truth, but because your lack of compassion is not aligned with the highest truth. And no amount of alien consciousness or god realization is going to change that.

There was no claim that compassion is disconnected from truth. A lack of interest in something doesn't mean an actual lack of that thing.

What Leo is saying is that he values truth over compassion. So, if the truth is something that might not compassionate, he is not gonna let that stop him from pursuing it. He is not saying that he does not like being compassionate or that you shouldn't be compassionate or that compassion isn't related to truth. It's just that compassion is not prioritized over truth. 

Can you imagine if Leo's mission was instead "I want to figure out how to be as compassionate as possible" or "I want to figure out what is true, but only if I can see that it involves compassion". That would have completely changed his trajectory, because the priorities are different.

Furthermore, how do you know what is compassionate? Is Leo making you feel comfortable compassionate? Is Leo reducing his teachings down in such a way so that there is an absolute 0 percent chance of someone going mentally unstable from his teachings compassionate? I don't think so. There's a reason why Sadghuru's public teachings are more mainstream and less in depth than Leo's. When you position yourself in the mainstream, your teachings are limited to a certain depth, because those teachings exist relative to how palatable it is for the mainstream.

 

[Thought Art]

Saying Leo isn't compassionate I think is a misreading of Leo

[spiritual memes]

4 minutes ago, Osaid said:

Furthermore, how do you know what is compassionate? Is Leo making you feel comfortable compassionate? Is Leo reducing his teachings down in such a way so that there is an absolute 0 percent chance of someone going mentally unstable from his teachings compassionate?

Its not hard to tell compassionate someone is. Have you considered that it's possible to convey these teachings in a way that doesn't drive people away? Have you opened your mind to the possibility and Leo's teaching style might be a bit toxic?

2 minutes ago, Thought Art said:

Saying Leo isn't compassionate I think is a misreading of Leo

If you guys think Leo's behaviour the past few months/year has been compassionate, then this place really is a cult.

[tuku747]

 

[Osaid]

Just now, spiritual memes said:

Have you considered that it's possible to convey these teachings in a way that doesn't drive people away?

There is no teaching that does not drive anyone away. People have different interests and motives. Abiding by such a criteria is not an accurate indicator of the compassion or quality of a teaching.

A teaching that prioritizes whether it appeals to people will always fall short, because at that point you aren't even prioritizing the teaching itself, but rather how people perceive the teaching. Of course, when it comes to teaching, how people view it should be a secondary value.

A teaching that does not drive anyone away will have about 0 depth, for the reasons I mentioned before. It only appeals to the lowest common denominator.

It's a mistake to assume that because someone is driven away by a teaching it means the teaching is flawed.

2 minutes ago, spiritual memes said:

Have you opened your mind to the possibility and Leo's teaching style might be a bit toxic?

Sure, his style has its flaws, if that is what you mean by "toxic".

 

 

[Thought Art]

27 minutes ago, spiritual memes said:

If you guys think Leo's behaviour the past few months/year has been compassionate, then this place really is a cult.

Or, you really just have your own perspective and other people have different opinions. I bet you couldn't even right a paragraph on what a cult is.

Edited March 16, 2023 by Thought Art

[spiritual memes]

Just now, Thought Art said:

Or, you really just have your own perspective and other people have different opinions. 

Perhaps but that doesn't change what I am saying.

[Thought Art]

@spiritual memes It may not change what you are saying, but if you can't describe a cult, then you aren't saying much. 

Why not just insult everyone who follows someone, as well as that person just because I don't agree with him sometimes on a forum.

[spiritual memes]

3 minutes ago, Osaid said:

A teaching that prioritizes whether it appeals to people will always fall short, because at that point you aren't even prioritizing the teaching itself, but rather how people perceive the teaching. Of course, when it comes to teaching, how people view it should be a secondary value.

That is not what I am talking about. I'm talking about the narcissistic, egotistical, borderline abusive language he uses. It doesn't add anything and if anything, it corrupts the teaching. Being edgy doesn't make the teaching better.

[Thought Art]

@spiritual memes Go and read Leo's recent posts. He is just talking about whatever. 

Someone standing their ground in their opinion doesn't make them not have compassion.

I don't really know if you watch Leo's videos but... his video today for example. A person without compassion and emotional intelligence would not have made that video.

That being said, Leo is not really a people person. But, whatever. Everyone can be mean and an asshole to Leo, but God forbid he bite back from time to time.

[spiritual memes]

1 minute ago, Thought Art said:

@spiritual memes It may not change what you are saying, but if you can't describe a cult, then you aren't saying much. 

Why not just insult everyone who follows someone, as well as that person just because I don't agree with him sometimes on a forum.

If you blindly support a spiritual teacher and blindly deny any toxicity, that they do, then that would be a cult. Leo isn't creating the cult, you are by enabling this behaviour.

[Thought Art]

@spiritual memes Those are all words that YOU use. That is YOUR interpretation. 

Yeah, he had a couple rants recently. So what? 

I recently had a guy on the form here, going on and on and on about how Leo is toxic for his rant bla bla bla. And then this guy threatens to beat me up in private messages because I was dismissive of him little bit. 

Anyway, I think I am learning from these conversations that these views on Leo exist and people, and I just don't care. I enjoy his teachings, I like the work, I like the book lists, the principles, the forum.

I also like that, Leo isn't exactly perfect and I don't agree with him on everything.  No teacher is perfect. Ultimately, it's up to me to be my greatest teacher and figure this stuff out for myself. To think my own thoughts, create my own meaning, my own purpose, live my own life. It's not about any personality other than my own. 

Edited March 16, 2023 by Thought Art

[spiritual memes]

@Thought Art I don't think this discussion is going to change your mind, but I do have a question. Where is the line for you? What kind of behaviour from Leo would make you stop defending him?

Edited March 16, 2023 by spiritual memes

[Thought Art]

2 minutes ago, spiritual memes said:

If you blindly support a spiritual teacher and blindly deny any toxicity, that they do, then that would be a cult. Leo isn't creating the cult, you are by enabling this behaviour.

No, that is not a definition of a cult. But, that IS a potential sign of cult like behaviour. However, I am not denying any such thing. 

Leo had some outbursts like weeks ago... They were a little strange. But at the same time. he leaves himself open to CONSTANT criticism. He bites back, and then you guys bitch and moan about it. However, is that ideal? Did he handle it in the best way? No. That is probably obvious, but that the same time. Sometimes you gotta be authentic and just say what you think. 

I am not enabling anyones behaviour. I am not a child, Leo is not a child. We are not a bunch of morons and I don't appreciate you here claiming I am some dumb fucking cult follower. I literally study every religion, and many different Gurus because they all have their own flavours and specialties. I am gonna keep saying that, but some of you guys are so dense and opinionated it's like speaking to fence.