Adeptus Psychonautica talks about Leo/Connor again (another suicide revealed)

[Devin]

 

[Leo Gura]

On 3/15/2023 at 6:13 AM, JosephKnecht said:

What is the effect that you want to have on your students if ultimately you don't care about their well-being?

My care for the well-being of my students is in their increase in understanding of reality. That is my focus. Not pampering their emotions. I don't want you to need me to comfort you. Because I will not be around forever. I want your understanding of reality to comfort you. That will stay with your whole life and comfort you more than I ever could.

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What you are currently doing is talking on a public forum (youtube) to impressionable young people. You have an effect on people and it's best that you are aware of the effect. 

To make an extreme analogy, I can also go to a kindergarten and yell at the kids that Santa is not real. Is it true? Yes. Is it effective? Yes. But at the end of my ordeal, I leave with lots of crying children.

Stop infantilizing my viewers. The majority of people who watch are emotionally strong enough to handle what is said. A few aren't. I provide caveats for those who aren't.

I provoke people into waking up. This will rub some people the wrong way. But if you follow what I teach eventually you will reach a profound understanding of reality. That is what my work is about.

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Don't you want to understand compassion? Or compassion is no longer part of your reality? 

I have no problem understanding compassion. I have my own style of it. It is a more masculine verison of compassion. If you ever deeply Awaken via my work then you will understand why I said the things I said in the ways I said them. And until you Awaken, it won't make much sense. Because I had to prod you to go beyond all human stuff. You want me to cater to human stuff, and I just have little interest in that.

You want me to fit some stereotype of a sweet, harmless guru. And I deliberately don't do that. Because it is not conducive to the levels of consciousness I wish you to reach.

It really is that simple. You guys love to create drama over it. And that's a useful way to not engage the actual work. Those who aren't serious about the work end up creating a lot of drama. Of course. Oldest trick in the book. You like to tell yourselves you already understand what is beibg taught, but you are putting the cart before the horse. You actually start to think you've outsmarted me.

Everyone here should ask themselves honestly: Do I think I've outsmarted Leo? And then seriously contemplate whether you have, and how you can be so sure about that. This is where things get real tricky. Many people come here and mouth off, having convinced themselves they've outsmarted me. Which is a very clever way to avoid the guidance I offer.

As I have warned, this work is extremely advanced and self-deceptive. It will take you many years to fully appreciate that. In the meantime you might blame me. But ask yourself, what have I truly done to hurt you? Said some harsh words? Shared some radical ideas? Are you so fragile? How are you gonna face the brutality of life if my words hurt you so badly? Life is gonna slap you around much worse than that. My job is to make you strong enough to withstand the big things life will throw at you.

- - - - -

And if you care to understand why I act the way I act, you should also keep in mind the enormous personal ordeal that I have had to go through to transcend all human spiritual teachings, including nondualism and Buddhism, in order to reach the levels of consciousness that I have. That did not come without cost. I had to wipe my ass with all human ideas about reality. So excuse me if I'm a bit of a cunt and I am not respectful to your ideas at all times. I did what I had to do to reach where I needed to reach in order to teach at the advanced levels I wanted to teach. I simply did not have the luxury of caring about your emotions during that process.

Edited March 16, 2023 by Leo Gura

[The Mystical Man]

19 hours ago, Wyeth said:

If thousands of people lives are changed for the better because of Leo's teachings and 2 people commit suicide, should he take all his videos down?

You guys are so ensnared by Gura that you can't even see that having two or three suicides under your belt is not normal. If that doesn't sober you up, I don't know what will. Considering that there are so many great teachers out there, I don't know why anyone feels the need to put Gura on a pedestal. I can tell that many of you have not even bothered to read a single book.

[Devin]

21 minutes ago, The Mystical Man said:

You guys are so ensnared by Gura that you can't even see that having two or three suicides under your belt is not normal. If that doesn't sober you up, I don't know what will. Considering that there are so many great teachers out there, I don't know why anyone feels the need to put Gura on a pedestal. I can tell that many of you have not even bothered to read a single book.

        I can see how some of the things would be conducive to suicide for an already unstable person, it's terrible that happens and I think everyone here wants to try to prevent it in the future. Not to be a smart ass but lookup Christian Pastor suicides, happens all the time man.

 

https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/article/why-pastors-are-committing-suicide/

Why Pastors Are Committing Suicide

Nov 23, 2016 — Sarah Zylstra reports on a rising epidemic among pastors of loneliness, depression, mental illness, and even suicide.

Edited March 16, 2023 by Devin

[Danioover9000]

@Leo Gura

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

My care for the well-being of my students is in their increase in understanding of reality. That is my focus. Not pampering their emotions. I don't want you to need me to comfort you. Because I will not be around forever. I want your understanding of reality to comfort you. That will stay with your whole life and comfort you more than I ever could.

Stop infantilizing my viewers. The majority of people who watch are emotionally strong enough to handle what is said. A few aren't. I provide caveats for those who aren't.

I provoke people into waking up. This will rub some people the wrong way. But if you follow what I teach eventually you will reach a profound understanding of reality. That is what my work is about.

I have no problem understanding compassion. I have my own style of it. It is a more masculine verison of compassion. If you ever deeply Awaken via my work then you will understand why I said the things I said in the ways I said them. And until you Awaken, it won't make much sense. Because I had to prod you to go beyond all human stuff. You want me to cater to human stuff, and I just have little interest in that.

You want me to fit some stereotype of a sweet, harmless guru. And I deliberately don't do that. Because it is not conducive to the levels of consciousness I wish you to reach.

It really is that simple. You guys love to create drama over it. And that's a useful way to not engage the actual work. Those who aren't serious about the work end up creating a lot of drama. Of course. Oldest trick in the book. You like to tell yourselves you already understand what is beibg taught, but you are putting the cart before the horse. You actually start to think you've outsmarted me.

Everyone here should ask themselves honestly: Do I think I've outsmarted Leo? And then seriously contemplate whether you have, and how you can be so sure about that. This is where things get real tricky. Many people come here and mouth off, having convinced themselves they've outsmarted me. Which is a very clever way to avoid the guidance I offer.

As I have warned, this work is extremely advanced and self-deceptive. It will take you many years to fully appreciate that. In the meantime you might blame me. But ask yourself, what have I truly done to hurt you? Said some harsh words? Shared some radical ideas? Are you so fragile? How are you gonna face the brutality of life if my words hurt you so badly? Life is gonna slap you around much worse than that. My job is to make you strong enough to withstand the big things life will throw at you.

- - - - -

And if you care to understand why I act the way I act, you should also keep in mind the enormous personal ordeal that I have had to go through to transcend all human spiritual teachings, including nondualism and Buddhism, in order to reach the levels of consciousness that I have. That did not come without cost. I had to wipe my ass with all human ideas about reality. So excuse me if I'm a bit of a cu** and I am not respectful to your ideas at all times. I did what I had to do to reach where I needed to reach in order to teach at the advanced levels I wanted to teach. I simply did not have the luxury of caring about your emotions during that process.

   This is actually a good point, people here are so over focused on the victims that they don't bother to empathize and understand what @Leo Gura had to emotionally go through for his insights. It's like a thought terminating cliche made to make any good faith communication and charitable takes of Actualized.org not possible, hence these drama pandering YouTube Reactionaries are poisoning the well of good faith discussions here, shame on some of you.

[Danioover9000]

@The Mystical Man

28 minutes ago, The Mystical Man said:

You guys are so ensnared by Gura that you can't even see that having two or three suicides under your belt is not normal. If that doesn't sober you up, I don't know what will. Considering that there are so many great teachers out there, I don't know why anyone feels the need to put Gura on a pedestal. I can tell that many of you have not even bothered to read a single book.

   Why are you just assuming those cases are solely on @Leo Gura?

[Breakingthewall]

53 minutes ago, The Mystical Man said:

You guys are so ensnared by Gura that you can't even see that having two or three suicides under your belt is not normal. If that doesn't sober you up, I don't know what will. Considering that there are so many great teachers out there, I don't know why anyone feels the need to put Gura on a pedestal. I can tell that many of you have not even bothered to read a single book.

This message tell me everything: you level of understanding is zero

[Inliytened1]

Guys - spirituality isn't about a teacher or his personality.  It's about actually doing the practices and seeing what is true about reality for yourself.   It's about keeping your mind open.   Because if your mind isn't open you are handicapping yourself from discovering with is actually true, because you may hand wave off something that could actually lead you to it.   So it's about that.  And that is the message here.  You should not have a guru...you should be your own guru.   A trap bigger than Buddhism that I see is the teacher trap.   You may become enthralled with a teacher's style because it resonates but then quickly make it about him and not the material or what he is pointing to.  This is one of the biggest traps I see here, and it will keep you fast asleep.   But those of you who could care less about the teacher's personality and go straight for the jugular - the territory - those are the ones that will reach the deepest levels.  

The world is a dangerous place - and it will break you in a second it you aren't careful.  And spirituality is not for the faint of heart.  It is as dangerous as it gets, and if you go far enough, it will kill you.  And I don't mean the physical body, because that is irrelevant and an illusion.   The mind is reality, and what dies is the illusion.    We are not here to baby you.  Life won't baby you - it will toss you around like a wet noodle, and hang you out to dry in the wind.   

Edited March 16, 2023 by Inliytened1

[Thought Art]

1 hour ago, The Mystical Man said:

You guys are so ensnared by Gura that you can't even see that having two or three suicides under your belt is not normal. If that doesn't sober you up, I don't know what will. Considering that there are so many great teachers out there, I don't know why anyone feels the need to put Gura on a pedestal. I can tell that many of you have not even bothered to read a single book.

How many Buddhist’s have committed suicide?

Not to mention the one who set himself on fire!

People unfortunately kill themselves. I don’t believe you can blame Leo?

Edited March 16, 2023 by Thought Art

[Inliytened1]

3 minutes ago, Thought Art said:

How many Buddhist’s have committed suicide?

Not to mention the one who set himself on fire!

People unfortunately kill themselves. I don’t believe you can blame Leo?

It's a complex issue.  What happens is rather than thinking for one's self, they place all they have into their guru - and then when their guru "let's them down" they blame the guru - when in truth, they should never have given their mind away to another human being.  I don't care who it is - the President of the United States or Elvis Presley.  They are human and that makes them limited.   

The suicide thing is a personal decision...no one can be blamed for someone taking their own life.  That is a decision they made.  Unless it's a case where someone told them to do it because it would bring them to a certain place for.example, or give them something they don’t already have, and they were so brainwashed that they believed them.   That would be a cult.  That's not what the case is here.  Here we stress free thought, and embrace the human condition.   

[Devin]

11 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

 That would be a cult.  That's not what the case is here.  Here we stress free thought, and embrace the human condition.   

         In the detractors defense, what they're calling narcissistic abuse, the "you all are idiots, no one is as awakened as me, ......" that stuff does communicate "believe what I say".

[Thought Art]

40 minutes ago, Devin said:

         In the detractors defense, what they're calling narcissistic abuse, the "you all are idiots, no one is as awakened as me, ......" that stuff does communicate "believe what I say".

True, little iffy there Leo. 
 

[Israfil]

If you guys wanna talk about suicide and teachings, the standard scientific view of being a conglomerate of mass and energy in a completely dumb universe almost made me kill myself, and in the process, I did great harm to my family and relationships. That's spread out far and wide, without any love or care.

It took me years of epistemology and psychedelics to finally break through my limited physicalist view. And that's the mainstream view. When I did that, I came across Actualized.org and Leo never sounded far out or incompassionate, it is just that most people are simply so far from the most basic spiritual realizations and those beyond that, that you sound arrogant when you say that they have no idea what they're talking about. I tell you that they don't.

I have had trips that had me disgusted with myself. I couldn't stop crying and seeing how foolish and nearsighted I was all my life. And I'm just beginning my work. I still have plenty of experiences ahead of me. It is challenging work that puts everything you take as truth as an illusion. That's the point of it. It requires looking to the bottom of the precipice of life and leaning forward as hard as you can without falling. Only this will bring you light.

As a good Brazilian, I shall share a free translation of mine of a piece of the incredible book "The Devil to Pay in the Backlands" (Grande Sertão Veredas, in the original title), by Guimarães Rosa. That's a poetic description of the truth-seeking work that many people took in life and how difficult it is to do it. Hope you guys enjoy it:

The flow of life wraps everything up,
Life is like that: it heats up and cools down,
it tightens and then loosens, it calms down and then relaxes.
What it wants from us is courage.
What God wants is to see us
learning to be capable
of being too happy,
in the midst of joy,
and even more joyful
in the midst of sadness!
Life invents!
We begin things,
not knowing why,
and from then on loses the power to continue
because life is everyone's collective effort,
by everyone, stirred and tempered.
The most important and beautiful thing in the world is this:
that people are not always the same,
they are not yet finished,
but that they are always changing.
They tune or go out of tune. Greater truth.
Living is very dangerous; no it isn't.
I don't even know how to explain these things.
One feeling is that of the one that let himself feel, but another is of the feeler.*"

 

*(The way that Portuguese verbs conjugate make this last sentence very hard to explain, but it portrays passive observation of feelings versus active search for an emotion/sensation)

Edited March 16, 2023 by Israfil

[StarStruck]

Edit

Edited March 17, 2023 by StarStruck

[The Mystical Man]

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Everyone here should ask themselves honestly: Do I think I've outsmarted Leo?

Making people doubt themselves is Narcissistic Abuse.

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

But ask yourself, what have I truly done to hurt you? Said some harsh words? Shared some radical ideas? Are you so fragile?

Trivializing the power of words and ideas is Narcissistic Abuse.

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

And if you care to understand why I act the way I act, you should also keep in mind the enormous personal ordeal that I have had to go through to transcend all human spiritual teachings, including nondualism and Buddhism, in order to reach the levels of consciousness that I have.

Making excuses for bad behavior is Narcissistic Abuse.

This forum serves as Narcissistic Supply.

We've seen what happens when you don't get that supply: Narcissistic Rage.

Edited March 17, 2023 by The Mystical Man

[Osaid]

11 minutes ago, The Mystical Man said:

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Everyone here should ask themselves honestly: Do I think I've outsmarted Leo?

Making people doubt themselves is Narcissistic Abuse.

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

But ask yourself, what have I truly done to hurt you? Said some harsh words? Shared some radical ideas? Are you so fragile?

Trivializing the power of words and ideas is Narcissistic Abuse.

10 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

And if you care to understand why I act the way I act, you should also keep in mind the enormous personal ordeal that I have had to go through to transcend all human spiritual teachings, including nondualism and Buddhism, in order to reach the levels of consciousness that I have.

Making excuses for bad behavior is Narcissistic Abuse.

This forum serves as Narcissistic Supply.

We've seen what happens when you don't get that supply: Narcissistic Rage.

With such broad criteria, you can make anyone look like a narcissistic abuser. How amazingly convenient. 

[vladorion]

It's pretty weird to think of spirituality as "who outsmarted whom". "How dare you think you're smarter than me" comes from a deep insecurity.

But if we play that game, who is more likely to be wrong, someone who thinks they've outsmarted Leo, or someone who thinks they've outsmarted Jesus, Buddha, Padmasambhava, Babaji and pretty much all of the greatest sages that ever lived on this planet?

 

[Yimpa]

4 minutes ago, Osaid said:

With such broad criteria, you can make anyone look like a narcissistic abuser. How amazingly convenient. 

Agreed. I was reading those articles and I relate to everything that was said. Yet, I’ve never once been told by dozens of therapists and psychiatrists over 10+ years that I’m narcissistic. 

Another example is that I convinced myself that I had PTSD a few months ago. Even though the symptoms I read about PTSD related to me, and the scores for the self test were high, my therapist and psychiatrist said I don’t have PTSD. I have OCD. 

PTSD and OCD share overlapping symptoms, but they’re not the same. 

[The Mystical Man]

27 minutes ago, Osaid said:

With such broad criteria, you can make anyone look like a narcissistic abuser.

It's not broad at all. Who does those things on a regular basis? Most criteria apply to Gura, because he's trying to stay in control. 

Edited March 17, 2023 by The Mystical Man

[Osaid]

5 minutes ago, The Mystical Man said:

It's not broad at all. Most criteria apply to Gura, because he's trying to stay in control.

Stop making me doubt myself, you narcissistic abuser.