What AI reminds me of

[Juan]

If you studied a bit of art history, when the camera was invented, many artists was against them because they thought that they’ll lose their jobs and people will think: “if I can take a picture of it, I don’t need a painting”. Nowadays we see the unity of both genres, I think the same will go with AI, traditional and digital art. 

Now the level of how much AI art will get better from now to a decade, could be concerning, but hey I’m open for changes. It is a matter of time when we first see the first movie made with just AI on theaters! Hell there is already music being done with AI. 

Here is a excellent use of AI:

 

Edited March 12, 2023 by Juan

[Danioover9000]

@Juan

10 hours ago, Juan said:

If you studied a bit of art history, when the camera was invented, many artists was against them because they thought that they’ll lose their jobs and people will think: “if I can take a picture of it, I don’t need a painting”. Nowadays we see the unity of both genres, I think the same will go with AI, traditional and digital art. 

Now the level of how much AI art will get better from now to a decade, could be concerning, but hey I’m open for changes. It is a matter of time when we first see the first movie made with just AI on theaters! Hell there is already music being done with AI. 

Here is a excellent use of AI:

 

    It would be good, provided they implement regulations in advance,especially considering how fast technology is developing.

   To me it's mostly a sad state of affairs, certain types of visual art jobs, like editorial illustrations qre getting some disruption. Soon certain musicjobs, and even animations will feel the disruptions. Government has to step in soon or unemployment rates will sky rocket.

[Emerald]

I’ve been saying this since I discovered Midjourney.

My formal education is in Fine Art and Art Education with minor in Art History.

And before the camera was invented most artists were just doing the camera’s job.

And when the camera came out, about half of painters switched to photography.

But the other half had to question more deeply what painting and art meant to them. And this created a lot of expansion in Art philosophy and in many different art styles emerging as a result.

Basically, all of pop art and the New York school… Dadaism, Surrealism, and non-respresentational art (abstract) all arose as a consequence of the invention of the camera and the question “What is the value of art if a machine can do it and do it better?”

And now, artists must face this same question on a much deeper level.

[Danioover9000]

@Emerald

9 hours ago, Emerald said:

I’ve been saying this since I discovered Midjourney.

My formal education is in Fine Art and Art Education with minor in Art History.

And before the camera was invented most artists were just doing the camera’s job.

And when the camera came out, about half of painters switched to photography.

But the other half had to question more deeply what painting and art meant to them. And this created a lot of expansion in Art philosophy and in many different art styles emerging as a result.

Basically, all of pop art and the New York school… Dadaism, Surrealism, and non-respresentational art (abstract) all arose as a consequence of the invention of the camera and the question “What is the value of art if a machine can do it and do it better?”

And now, artists must face this same question on a much deeper level.

   But do it in such a way that it isn't too disruptive of the market place. An entire thread already talks about this issue at length, and the moderator's job is in the process of getting disrupted:

   In this specific context, I don't like A.I, and how big companies are starting to use it to steal art works en masse.

[Emerald]

1 hour ago, Danioover9000 said:

@Emerald

   But do it in such a way that it isn't too disruptive of the market place. An entire thread already talks about this issue at length, and the moderator's job is in the process of getting disrupted:

   In this specific context, I don't like A.I, and how big companies are starting to use it to steal art works en masse.

Technology never takes the marketplace into consideration. Such is the nature of progress.

When the car was invented, the auto industry wasn’t like “How do we make this so that horse and buggy drivers don’t lose their jobs?”

Horse and buggy drivers mostly went out of business. That’s the nature of the free market.

Mind you, this is coming from someone with two bachelors degrees in art related fields.

Edited March 13, 2023 by Emerald

[Juan]

Thank you so much for your input @Emerald, since I make art and took some brief classes on art history, I think you can get me a lot. Yea will see what happens, for now I can use AI for look up new references or even to see how I could improve my art: 

Original:

 

AI:

[Waken]

I've been generation art with AI over the last months (for example: https://deepdreamgenerator.com/u/1934858 and 

). When I first discovered that AI art was make to make psychedelic like animations/video's, I felt, as an animator that loves artful animations, a bit replaced by something better. That was my knee jerk reaction. You can make video's with AI soon, that I could not really beat well without investing a looot of time. But after that initial reaction, I thought how I could use AI to enhance my own work. Work with it rather than competing with it and it's great. I love art generated with the help of AI. I think it may be a good progression, perhaps it'll lead people to start making and appreciating art more for the sake of the beauty of what's created, instead of wanted to be recognized through what's created.

Edited March 13, 2023 by Waken

[Danioover9000]

@Emerald

3 hours ago, Emerald said:

Technology never takes the marketplace into consideration. Such is the nature of progress.

When the car was invented, the auto industry wasn’t like “How do we make this so that horse and buggy drivers don’t lose their jobs?”

Horse and buggy drivers mostly went out of business. That’s the nature of the free market.

Mind you, this is coming from someone with two bachelors degrees in art related fields.

   Of course, technological development over time, and the pioneers and groups/person behind the designs, do so from a place of bias based on their stages of development, cognitive and moral development, personality types, states of consciousness, life experiences and other lines of development in other domains of life, and ideological indoctrination from upbringing. Also, technology is not values neutral:https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwj29vDGutn9AhV4SUEAHcerD54QFnoECA8QAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fconsilienceproject.org%2Ftechnology-is-not-values-neutral-ending-the-reign-of-nihilistic-design-2%2F&usg=AOvVaw2Ibrxt3LZMNTAtdZg8j4f5

   Ultimately, in the long term, degreee and certifications pale in comparison to the disruptive technologies done by those deep into stage orange materialism.

@Waken @Juan  As usual, you all underestimate the disruptive nature of technological development and the increase in unemployment it can cause short term.

[Danioover9000]

@Waken

2 hours ago, Waken said:

I've been generation art with AI over the last months (for example: https://deepdreamgenerator.com/u/1934858 and 

). When I first discovered that AI art was make to make psychedelic like animations/video's, I felt, as an animator that loves artful animations, a bit replaced by something better. That was my knee jerk reaction. You can make video's with AI soon, that I could not really beat well without investing a looot of time. But after that initial reaction, I thought how I could use AI to enhance my own work. Work with it rather than competing with it and it's great. I love art generated with the help of AI. I think it may be a good progression, perhaps it'll lead people to start making and appreciating art more for the sake of the beauty of what's created, instead of wanted to be recognized through what's created.

    In the context of developing drawing skill, I don't think so. The process won't be in a progression that's easy to track and record for the newbie learning to draw. It's possible to use A.I generated images, and trace parts of the shapes and areas, or do additive/subtractive art onto of the generated image, I disagree that it leads to a solid development in mastering the drawing and art fundamentals that takes months to years of dedicated study to master to some level of proficiency. It also feels mostly like a cop out and lazy way of doing art, but that's because excellence is part of my top ten values, and how I honor that value in me is taking a bit more traditional or progressive ways of learning and progression of skill, in a linear fashion. and less non-linearity if possible. I like to feel that I put in some effort, energy and attention to drawing, feels like 80% of my time/energy spent in a 20% action taking that produces 80% of the results. I feel like using A.I generated images is both cheating, laziness and even unethical if those stories of these programs taking other people's art is true.

[Danioover9000]

   Pretty interesting video:

 

[Juan]

@Danioover9000 AI is a tool, learn how to use it! Balance is key for me. 

3 hours ago, Waken said:

 

 

Cool!

[Danioover9000]

@Juan

Just now, Juan said:

@Danioover9000 AI is a tool, learn how to use it! Balance is key for me. 

Cool!

   But @Juan! How do I balance A.I as a tool, when I'm getting mind raped by Tik Tok and social media platforms?!

[Carl-Richard]

On 12.3.2023 at 5:11 PM, Juan said:

Hell there is already music being done with AI. 

That has existed since the early 2000s. It's called Meshuggah 

 

[Juan]

48 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

That has existed since the early 2000s. It's called Meshuggah 

 

This is dope af. But AI? Haha what? 

I thought more of this recently: 

 

[Carl-Richard]

1 hour ago, Juan said:

This is dope af. But AI? Haha what? 

If they're not time travelling AIs from the future, they're at least aliens from outer space. Just listen to Fredrik Thordendal's soloing style in this song. It's like alien morse code or something: 

 

 

1 hour ago, Juan said:

I thought more of this recently: 

 

Omg the "blue jeans and bloody tears" was so funny. It's like a fever dream.

Edited March 13, 2023 by Carl-Richard

[Waken]

@Danioover9000 I disagree. It's not cheating, that is of course a subjective perspective. Technology has always been progressing and taking away work people didn't want to do anymore. You can find all sort of examples where a new technology comes out in the domain of animation, or whatever other field, and others say it's cheating, unfair, etc. You can't invent anything that's of real value, if you want to avoid that someone may lose a job, that can always happen.

It's not about if it's cheating too, it's for many people about creating for the joy of it, and many people, like myself are excited to work with it. With tools as AI, quality of work can go up, and new styles can be explored.
I didn't say anything of the sort that it will increase peoples development in drawing or such. If someone likes to draw, he can draw, if someone wants the aspect of a lot of manually drawing to be taken care of by AI, then he could use that. For animators AI can for example be used so they don't have to manually draw so many frames of a video. You draw perhaps a couple frames here and there, and the AI fills in missing frames. This is just making art in a smarter way, so you can focus on different ways in your art, so your art becomes even better. Technology has always been making things easier and easier. Nothing to do with laziness or the like

[Danioover9000]

   A.I is just so scary now, it's not just going to settle down at creative arts and jobs related to that, it's going to go after knowledge work jobs and even more labor jobs. So, what's the ultimate consequence this technology has for the human race? Get the majority to meditate and be hippies? Even that and spirituality the A.I is going to take away from humanity. What a dark future we're heading to:

 

[Danioover9000]

@Waken

16 minutes ago, Waken said:

@Danioover9000 I disagree. It's not cheating, that is of course a subjective perspective. Technology has always been progressing and taking away work people didn't want to do anymore. You can find all sort of examples where a new technology comes out in the domain of animation, or whatever other field, and others say it's cheating, unfair, etc. You can't invent anything that's of real value, if you want to avoid that someone may lose a job, that can always happen.

It's not about if it's cheating too, it's for many people about creating for the joy of it, and many people, like myself are excited to work with it. With tools as AI, quality of work can go up, and new styles can be explored.
I didn't say anything of the sort that it will increase peoples development in drawing or such. If someone likes to draw, he can draw, if someone wants the aspect of a lot of manually drawing to be taken care of by AI, then he could use that. For animators AI can for example be used so they don't have to manually draw so many frames of a video. You draw perhaps a couple frames here and there, and the AI fills in missing frames. This is just making art in a smarter way, so you can focus on different ways in your art, so your art becomes even better. Technology has always been making things easier and easier. Nothing to do with laziness or the like

   How do you know it's cheating or not? Who gets to decide?

   What group/who gets to decide what's work and what isn't? Is it justified to create and introduce technology, that ends up disrupting and destroying a person's job/career when in their life story they spent 5-10-20 years of education and training to be that role and excel at that field?

   Of course, what you consider cheating, work, justified creating for joy, is largely relative and based on your stage of development, cognitive and moral development, personality type and traits, states of consciousness, life experience and other lines of development in different domains of life. Even ideologies indoctrinated into your mind by your culture shapes what you feel and think, that you falsely think you have agency, and falsely think you are right in certain cases, when in the grand scheme of the world you are fundamentally wrong.

   While I do have some values in stage yellow, and because of how good I am at visualizing places and people and time of passage, I can ultimately see the net positives of this A.I technology, but also can ultimately see the net negative if humanity doesn't put in place ways to regulate these disruptions in technology, because we now are godlike in how we imagine and utilize tech. We have created nuclear plants, strategic/tactical nukes that can wipe out natural environments within seconds that no animal could naturally do. We can develop GMO and CRISPER to develop stronger strains of food types, or mutations of viruses like in gains of research, that is faster than in natural biomes. We can now do cloning technology, create copies of an organ or even a whole human body, and we can splice genes together to create human hybrids and other human variations not normally found in nature, with unknown consequences if such hybrids are allowed to breed and proliferate.

   We have already seen some extent to how disruptive this A.I program can get, eventually outplaying GM chess players and world class talents in Chinese Go, to playing music to a highly reasonable above standard, and creating nearly photo realistic pictures that make my skin crawl.

[Danioover9000]

@Carl-Richard

2 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

If they're not time travelling AIs from the future, they're at least aliens from outer space. Just listen to Fredrik Thordendal's soloing style in this song. It's like alien morse code or something: 

 

 

Omg the "blue jeans and bloody tears" was so funny. It's like a fever dream.

   You have good taste in music, for heavy metal.

[Carl-Richard]

47 minutes ago, Danioover9000 said:

@Carl-Richard

   You have good taste in music, for heavy metal.

Meshuggah is in a league of their own though. They basically revolutionized modern metal all on their own. And they're jazz fusion inspired. And aliens.