Questioning Beliefs

[Venus]

I understand (at least some of) how much beliefs effect a person's life and realise how important it is to question your own beliefs.

But I feel like I've had a strong lack of commitment to properly questioning my own since I don't understand how.

I see there are so many and I don't know where to start or how to dig them all out, so this is me asking where and how?

 

[Huz]

Ahh yes, this is one of the questions I kept asking myself when I embarked on this journey to question thy believes. For me, the key thing I got down was to create structure and order.

This is a serious game. Your web of believes are entangled, looped and overlapping within your mind. Running your machine as live goes on, and what a complicated thing you are. 

The first step is to notice and become more aware of your emotional reactions to certain situations. Areas where you invest heavy emotions, like fear. These are the beliefs ideally you want to doubt first as they are the ones that inhibit you the most from self transcendence. As you attach to them more (because the feel more real). So start slow, you are climbing a mountain here. You don't climb up Everest by running!!! I assume you take you time and care so you don't get sick or die.

Whenever you have a emotional reaction to something, write down the cause. Then keep probing questions like "Why am I emotionally invested into this situation?" "What is the reason why I believe this" etc. It is often due to a rock bottom belief you have deeply ingrained into your mind over time. You want to find this belief and question the fuck out of it. Don't just question it once and that be the end of it. No!! You need to spend time doubting this belief over a long period of time for your mind to realise the need to hold on to it. So you continually change the way your mind relates to this belief overtime. It's not a one hit wonder. So this is why writing you believes down is important so you don't lose track of your work.

Over time you can also categorise them over time (maybe create a mind map) and see how your web of beliefs looks on paper. 

I guess this is all you need to do for now because this is such a big task.

[Danielle]

Deconstructing beliefs isn't easy, but you have to start somewhere. I've had the advantage of having diaries from my past which I reread and spotted subtle beliefs I had.  Start writing a diary or write a list of the biggest beliefs- do shadow work and contemplate where you picked up a  specific belief. Be mindful of the way you look at situations and people that trigger you emotionally the most, It'll be messy at first, but the clearity you start getting after a certain point is liberating 

[Christian]

If you were playing a game like Fall Out 4, you wouldn't spend all of your time reading the manual. You would simply get started and play the game, see what works, what does not work, adjust, improve. 

The same here; it is not that you are lacking the method.. It's that the method comes to you as a result of right action. Action --> know-how. No one can tell you how to accurately question your own beliefs. This is where taking responsibility is crucial. If you want to become better at questioning your beliefs, set aside 10 minutes per day to do so. You probably want to start off dismantling non-threatening beliefs. If you are a muslim, in the beginning,  questioning your belief in the Quran and muhammad the prophet is probably not sustainable.

[Venus]

@Huz &@Danielle so are you both saying that keeping diary-like notes of your beliefs and emotional triggers is one of the most important things?

Also, how quickly does one start noticing lasting change?

[Venus]

@Christian haha I like that. I suppose to be fair there is a little bit of fear as to just getting on with it, hence the post, and I do just need to sit down and take more action. Good call out. Thanks.

[InDaZone]

Your post has hit home with me as I have recently just embarked on a journey of finding and questioning my beliefs so I feel that I can chip in to help you with your predicament.

Like Hulz says, figuring out what triggers you emotionally is what will help you figure out your underlying beliefs. When this happens in day to day life, note that what the situation was, and then when you get time to yourself, sit down formally and brainstorm ideas as to what the underlying belief might signify within you. 

After I had a possible set of beliefs written down for a given situation, I tried making a counterpoint for each. The thing about beliefs is that they are just a perspective and there is always another way of looking at them that could be a more positive representation of reality.

Another thing that I tried to do, was to apply the Lefkoe method to the belief. I did this on myself and didn't actually pay for a trained specialist to do this for me. This helps me gain further perspective on the belief and see it as something "I created unconsciously" and not something that is an absolute truth, so to speak.

I think what really helps, is to really analyze and scrutinize the belief and figure out whether it really makes sense. Often you will find that they can be quite irrational.

When doing your brainstorm for possible beliefs, you will probably end up coming up with a lot of surface beliefs. This is good, and these should be scrutinized too, but don't forget to drill down into them to find the "root cause" of the belief. These are often represented by a deep fear like the fear of being lonely, rejected, embarrassed etc. and will probably offer the most "bang for your buck" in terms of removing them from your subconscious.

It's still early days for me in this process, but these are the things I have come up so far and I hope they help you out.

[Huz]

44 minutes ago, Venus said:

@Huz &@Danielle so are you both saying that keeping diary-like notes of your beliefs and emotional triggers is one of the most important things?

Also, how quickly does one start noticing lasting change?

After about a year, when you start to feel like the reality you perceived starts to break down. Everything you thought you know can be lifted like a veil from your mind showing you a completely new reality, with new possibilites. It gets interesting when you get the feeling that you are really not a "human". I like to question this belief actually a lot.  And you really start to wonder what the fuck you are deeply, because you have no idea. It freaky but amazing that its possible to do this.

Edited March 9, 2017 by Huz

[Nahm]

Describe each of your parents on paper. Then notice how you created beliefs growing up to make sense of the world. Then notice how your motives derive from the beliefs you creates. My example: Dan was always angry about work, my belief was I can have peace of mind all the time and not have to work. This was a good belief, but still I uncovered my belief. 

Also, just notice when you feel less than wonderful. Ask yourself, what belief do I hold that is keeping me from seeing this more accurately. 

 

[Venus]

@InDaZone that's super helpful btw, thanks. But when you get all the way down to that fear, what dost you do?

@Danielle so do you take time to do some meditation on it in the day, maybe some affirmations to help drill into you that your thoughts are meaningless?

@I_Like_Thing it's harder to do that on deeper beliefs that you're barely even conscious you hold though. It also becomes massively time consuming to do that on them all. Surely there's a more efficient way? Maybe it's not too bad. But yeah, deeper beliefs.

@Huz I like that! It sounds a bit like how it often feels when I get into deep states of consciousness (although I could be putting a glamorous coat on them because I'm not feeling them now)

@Nahm I hadn't thought of looking at it that way. But it makes loads of sense. A lot of my negative, limiting beliefs so obviously come from my mother's attitudes. And the positive ones from my dad.

[Venus]

@I_Like_Thing I'll be sure to try watch that one soon. Been meaning to actually. Yeah i m realizing their usefulness a lot now actually.

Edited March 13, 2017 by Venus

[Nahm]

@Venus If you want to speed it up, it may be a little painful, but just list everything you believe in right here. If a belief feels good, acknowledge it is a belief that is giving you energy / helping you, and take it off the list.  Then we can all pretend we're psychotherapists and pick apart what remains on the list. Give me a few minutes on the popcorn first. Thanks. 

Edited March 13, 2017 by Nahm

[CreativeInertia]

One of the things you can do, which can be helpful, is notice beliefs in the moment of their creation (so not by being introspective, but rather accessing them through thought awareness). Be mindful of how you label people. situations, activities, events, yourself, what is possible/impossible etc. So you basically stay mindful of your thoughts. Let's say you notice yourself saying "This person is X" or "This how X works" or "I will never do X". Some of these thoughts, when repeated many times, become beliefs. Some of these thoughts are reflections of existing beliefs. So you can catch yourself thinking those and note "This isn't necessarily true, this is my interpretation". Once you start doing it consistently you will see your relationship to your thoughts change, so you don't take them as absolute truth.

Of course don't do it all the time, just make sure you do it occasionally, especially for thoughts which seem significant, or whenever you remember to

just my 2 cents

Edited March 13, 2017 by CreativeInertia

[Paul Newcomb]

Does anybody have any book recommendations for getting rid of limiting beliefs? That would be very helpful. 

[jse]

33 minutes ago, Paul Newcomb said:

Does anybody have any book recommendations for getting rid of limiting beliefs? That would be very helpful. 

When trying to break through our paradigms, language is one of our biggest limiting factors.  Words tend to lose the author's intended meaning as they are "translated" into familiar thoughts by our ears/eyes and mind.  Best to bypass language and go for a more direct experience if possible.

Edited March 14, 2017 by jse

[InDaZone]

@Venus that's a good question - I don't have the personal experience to back up my answer yet, but I'm inclined to say that the way to do it, would be to accept and love it to death.

In a way its like training a child, you need to show it over and over again that there is nothing to fear.

[InDaZone]

@Paul Newcomb I would recommend the book liminal thinking by Dave Gray. It's a really good book about beliefs and an easy read. 

[Paul Newcomb]

16 hours ago, jse said:

When trying to break through our paradigms, language is one of our biggest limiting factors.  Words tend to lose the author's intended meaning as they are "translated" into familiar thoughts by our ears/eyes and mind.  Best to bypass language and go for a more direct experience if possible.

I can see where you're coming from, but I have a need for guidance on how to think about and meditate upon having a direct experience in such a way that I can clearly identify limiting beliefs and get rid of them with practicality. If everything really came down to just having a personal direct experience, there would be no need for books in the first place.

[Venus]

19 hours ago, Nahm said:

@Venus If you want to speed it up, it may be a little painful, but just list everything you believe in right here.

Okay.

A lot of what I'll right will probably be really irrational but I'll write what I'm aware I believe just off the top of my head. The bold one are the stronger beliefs. I believe...

• My beliefs hold me back
• I have low self esteem
• I'm almost depressed
• My mum's low self esteem and negativity is the main cause for mine and my depression
• There's a powerful force in me that is for me and striving to help my well being. I feel like this force is greater than most people's. It's the same force that stops me from giving up when feeling low
• I'm a really possitive person under my low self esteem
• That my low self esteem has ruined many friendships and holds me back from the bigger relationships I want
• I'm needy
• That raising my self esteem will fix everything
• I'm a really funny person underneath my low self esteem
• My low self esteem is a lie I tell myself and really I just have a problem with believing I'm not worthy of happiness
• Happiness is difficult to acquire
• I make PD too complicated
• I'm nothing special
• I have a lot of talents
• I'm emotionally not very healthy all the time. More so at the moment
• If I talked to someone and vented my feelings more then I'd feel a lot better
• I don't have anyone close to talk to
• I used to have close friends
• Im lost with PD at the moment because I'm confused on what to do first because I'm too perfectionist
• I'm a perfectionist
• I must be perfect
• I'm focusing on the negative stuff here
• That humour is the best way to create good relationships
• I don't stand much of a chance of creating good relationships or making anyone like me if I can't be funny
• I must be funny
• I have to take lots of time to build the habits that will make me feel better eg humour, positivity, non-perfectionism, happiness habit etc
• I'll give up on trying to create these habit after a few days because I'll feel hopeless and that it's pointless
• Me feeling really down at the moment is good for me as I'll be able to help people in the future with their really low emotions because I'll be able to relate. It's also good because it is a big drive towards me becoming the great person that PD will develop me to be
• I need to be perfect
• Perfection is a thing
• I can't be perfect... Therefore I'm not good enough
• I'll only be liked when I'm perfect
• I used to be really popular because I was pretty much perfect but now factors have caused me not to be
• That^ is super irrational but i believe it strongly and it holds me back
• I don't know what is is keeping me in this low mood and rut
• That my beliefs are quite likely keeping me back from improving my mood and progressing with my PD
• My crush likes me
• My crush would be happy to get with me but the only thing that is stopping it from happening is my low mood and low self esteem stopping me from gaining the confidence I need to be more of the person that will be more attractive
• I will always fail to become the person I feel I have to be to attract my crush
• That I put getting with my crush as priority number 1 and that's holding me back in life
• That I need to get over my crush (because she's also my ex but we're still close)
• That there's no way of getting over my crush/ex
• I'll be so distraught if my crush/ex got with someone else
• Lack of love is causing my low self esteem/low mood/hopeless feelings in life
• Achieving the things I want in life isn't difficult but it is for me because I create irrational beliefs that hold me back
• I'll never be happy
• There is hope and I could be super happy
• I won't become happy if I keep trying to get there on my own; I need guidance from others
• I don't need school
• There's plenty of ways to make a living in the world today and the formal education route is actually a really inefficient route unless you genuinely have dreams in those higher education jobs
• Most people are too scared or just to dumb to do the things they want to do in life but I'm special because I realise I can just go for them
• People might get offended by that^ and not help me on this post because of it
• Depressed people can fix their own depression and shouldn't make such a fuss about it
• I really need to work on self acceptance
• Reading is really good
• I will feel quite contempt reading more and gaining knowledge
• I'm a little bit bipolar in the fact sometimes I feel really really down and others I see so much hope
• I don't know where to start to feel at a comfortable level of emotional well being
• This^ is the main reason I'm stuck
• I keep thinking I know why I'm stuck, so I go on to fix that but then think it's actually another reason so stop the first one and go onto the other one. So I never actually create a proper habit because I stop too early. I believe this is why I'm stuck
• Consciousness will help a lot in making my life wonderful
• Self acceptance will help a lot in making my life wonderful
• Feeling I have purpose will help a lot in making my life wonderful
• If I faked to myself that there was actually a God that unconditionally loved me then it could get me out of this rut
• I'll always fail at actually obtaining the mindsets that will get me out of this rut
• Having a girlfriend would really help me feel better
• Having a girlfriend would be bad for me as I would be tricking myself into thinking I'm better but actually just covering up the fact I can't deal with having to lean on myself to think I'm good enough
• I should be able to be perfectly happy without anyone liking me
• I shouldn't be effected by people's negative opinions of me
• This girl that I have been getting with for the last 2 years (not my crush but someone who I was just having fun with ? but we got quite close but I didn't actually get into a proper relationship with because I still wanted to be available for my crush) this girl is the only person who actually properly loved me
• The fact that this^ girl just got with someone else (a week ago) and I think doesn't love me like that anymore, is what's caused me to be in this deeper rut
• For the last 2 years I've been covering up having to rely on myself for acceptance because I had this girl who looked up to me and really loved me
• 2 years is an unhealthy amount of time to not be able to get over someone
• I only still like my crush/ex because I'm needy
• I tell myself it could be genuine love because I don't want to let go of her
• (Like I said earlier) I can't let go of her
• I'm not interesting
• People will start to dislike me when I try to argue how I feel about anything
• No one will like me because I'm not perfect
• There's a lot of positive things in my life but I'm focusing on the negative because of this rut
• I'm annoying when I talk about myself for more than just one sentence
• I should change how I talk because I could try and make it funny and if I did it right I would make people actually interested in listening to me
• At default, I'm not interesting to listen to; my authentic self is boring and annoying and not special
• I will be happier if more people liked me
• I should make everyone like me
• I can't make everyone like me
• I should be okay with no one liking me. Wanting people to like me is weak
• I shouldn't want a lot of the things I want
• I shouldn't believe a lot of the things I believe
• I need to be more conscious
• I need to be more self accepting
• I need to do a lot more things to be an adequate human being
• I need to charge my phone
• I need to meditate more
• Moving to the Himalayas and becoming a monk for a bit is probably one of my best options for my emotional well being
• I am really interesting but I don't believe it
• I'm more interesting than most but have irrational beliefs that hold me back so much
• I have irrational beliefs about how to get rid of or stop being held back by my irrational beliefs
• These irrational beliefs about getting rid of my irrational beliefs are holding me back from getting rid of my irrational beliefs and really keep me in a rut
• Maybe I can get out of this rut but I feel like I've been in it all my life and that my mum and brother are in it so it's something we've learnt off my mum and it's going to be really hard to get out of but it's possible although I have irrational beliefs about it not being possible
• Im starting to realise why I'm in this rut
• My irrational beliefs and lower self will make me feel hopeless again in 10 minutes like always
• I'm very smart
• My intelligence is held back by my emotions
• So much of my potential is held back by my emotions
• If I could control my emotions just a little more I'd go so so far in life
• My goals are much bigger than most's but that's good because I can achieve them, even though I know I'm holding myself back at the moment
• Hating myself is what's holding me back

[Nahm]

@Venus Sounds like there is a lot of stand still from seeing both sides of things. Do you really meditate every morning? If so, what kind of meditation?

With regards to the beliefs, do you see any corilations between how your parents were / are, what beliefs you created with regard to them?

Is this processes helping at all to see that much of your suffering is just from these beliefs?  Is letting go of them because they're just beliefs within sight yet? The relief that will come?