Importance of Nightgaming

[something_else]

12 hours ago, Optimized Life said:

Not necessarily disagreeing with all the points made here, but night game being fun? Cmon. 

It's like fucking torture. 

It is extremely difficult psychologically and ruins your health, business, finances, rhythm. 

A lot of potential fights, arguments, rejections. 

How you meant to do night game and still wake up with sunrise? 

 

 

It's some of the most fun I've ever had, and it also grew me the most. I' almost a different person as a result. But you need to learn to let loose, not give a fuck, go with the flow, have fun. That's what going out at night is all about. Work hard, play hard.

I've been going out for like 2 years and I've never gotten into a fight, or even an argument really. I've debated people but never seriously argued that I can remember. The rejections are part of it, I find rejection at night way easier when I can just laugh and go talk to the next girl without it being weird.

It might just not be for you, perhaps. But most people's body should be able to cope with one or two late nights going out every week, especially when you are like younger than 25 to 30 anyway. You can strike a balance.

Quote

how you meant to meet quality girls during night game that aren't sluts, don't smoke or drink? , which 

 

 

Girls who go out are normal girls. The notion that girls who go clubbing are all addicts, sluts etc. is a really, really dumb myth.

Quote

Night game will end up costing you a lot of money, to enter a club that has hot girls in you normally have to pay a fair amount, and to skip ques or get better treatment you often pay a premium or bottle service ... not always true and depens on where you live of course. 

But generally you always at least pay $10-$20 + entry and then another $10 - $40 + on drinks ... and yes i'm sure some of you "don't drink!" but lets be realistic night game is an extremely strong gateway to drinking and wasting money on drinks, at least 1 or 2 which is so easy to rationalizme to yourself. 

 

 

 

It can be expensive. Depends on location and the club. To me £50 a week to have a couple of great nights in clubs partying is worth it. But you can get by on way less than that. Having to pay for premium or table/table service to have a good time in an average club is some crappy American concoction that clubs everywhere else in the world don't really do. I'm sure there are clubs that don't do that kinda shit in the US too.

Quote

You also need a wing man (who actually is into game) for night game (technically you don't) but to not have an extremely awkward and traumatizing experience you do, which is very difficult to find especially one that won't drink and (at least unconsciously) peer pressure you to doing the same.

 

 

You don't, you can do it solo. First few times are pretty hard and then you just learn how to make new friends quickly every time you go out solo and you're no longer solo.

Quote

Compare that to day game and you can do it at any time, just walk down the street or into a mall and get the number or insta date right there.

 

 

My experiences doing daygame were 100x more traumatising than my nightgame experiences. Talking to a girl you see out and about occasionally is one thing, that's totally great, but actually going out hunting for sex during the day, and approaching a whole bunch of girls for that purpose, is considered weird/predatory behaviour by 95% of the population.

 

 

[Karmadhi]

For me night game seems like a waste of time after you do it for a while. It depends on your personality and behaviour. 

For results I think daygame and online are far superior than night game however night game grows you more because girls in nightgame are super savage. 

Nightgame looks matter more than in daygame and brash loud extroverted behaviour is rewarded a lot more than in daygame. So if you struggle with those things it can help you grow. Also it is amaizing to get over your fear of rejection (main reason I was doing it).

However if you are introverted or more soft spoken, lower energy than daygame is a lot better due to the connection you can create and it is usually 1 on 1. Also it can be more efficient since you can do basically do it anywhere.

Online is best for just maximizing lays (the most efficient by far) but it does not grow you that much.

 

Edited March 7, 2023 by Karmadhi

[Karmadhi]

1 hour ago, something_else said:

actually going out hunting for sex during the day, and approaching a whole bunch of girls for that purpose, is considered weird/predatory behaviour by 95% of the population.

You are right but to be honest mass approaching is seen like that wherever you do it. Girls do not understand how it works for a guy to get girls so they will assume you are weird if you spam approach in general. I have heard girls many times call guys that spam approach in a club desperate and stuff. They are clueless about male attraction struggles.

Best advice is not to tell girls about it because they will judge unfortunately. Guys do not give a fuck, even if you do daygame spam approaching. These are just my observations but my circle is quite international so I feel like it captures most diverse cultures of the world.

Personally I am very respectful and polite whenever I approach so for me it does not make much of a difference. Issue with daygame is that many guys are socially retarted and do not know when to back off and the girls feel super uncomfortable. If you have good social intelligence and high empathy it should be ok.  Also starting with a compliment can create a good vibe and leave the girl in a good mood. If you do daygame right it will make girls happy you approached them, but many guys do not do that and hence it has this bad reputation. You need to stand out from the crowd in a good way.

Nightgame is also great and will grow you more than daygame, especially if you are a nice guy like me however for actual results it seems very very difficult. I would use it more for training and then daygame for actual results (dates, lays etc).

 

 

Edited March 7, 2023 by Karmadhi

[Mada_]

14 hours ago, Optimized Life said:

Not necessarily disagreeing with all the points made here, but night game being fun? Cmon. 

It's like fucking torture. 

It is extremely difficult psychologically and ruins your health, business, finances, rhythm. 

A lot of potential fights, arguments, rejections. 

How you meant to do night game and still wake up with sunrise? 

how you meant to meet quality girls during night game that aren't sluts, don't smoke or drink? , which 

How you meant to avoid drinking in night game? It's extremely difficult not to drink even if you're into self development, and extremely rare to find night gamers who don't drink. It is peer pressure & temptation times 1000 and in many cases you may even look weird or awkward if you don't drink. 

Night game will end up costing you a lot of money, to enter a club that has hot girls in you normally have to pay a fair amount, and to skip ques or get better treatment you often pay a premium or bottle service ... not always true and depens on where you live of course. 

But generally you always at least pay $10-$20 + entry and then another $10 - $40 + on drinks ... and yes i'm sure some of you "don't drink!" but lets be realistic night game is an extremely strong gateway to drinking and wasting money on drinks, at least 1 or 2 which is so easy to rationalizme to yourself. 

You also need a wing man (who actually is into game) for night game (technically you don't) but to not have an extremely awkward and traumatizing experience you do, which is very difficult to find especially one that won't drink and (at least unconsciously) peer pressure you to doing the same.

Compare that to day game and you can do it at any time, just walk down the street or into a mall and get the number or insta date right there. 

Or even "street/night game" where you game girls outside the club (at anytime you want), or like around dinner time you game near the bars or whatever, it's just so much lower investment and downsides. 

I'm not saying you can't get laid from night game, but it will take everything else out of you and ruin your life unless you're quite rich and don't care about your sleep schedule, the problem is I've had a chaotic circ rhythm for years now and it surely has decreased my productivity and life progress by a huge percentage

This is all fair except for the drinking part, you not being self assertive enough to not drink is on you. 

[something_else]

1 hour ago, Karmadhi said:

You are right but to be honest mass approaching is seen like that wherever you do it. Girls do not understand how it works for a guy to get girls so they will assume you are weird if you spam approach in general. I have heard girls many times call guys that spam approach in a club desperate and stuff. They are clueless about male attraction struggles.

 

 

 

 

 

Meh, I admit to girls what I'm doing when I do it in clubs and don't really have any problems. I guess if you say it with the right energy it's fine. You could probably pull that off in daygame too if you wanted but I imagine it would be harder

The fundamental problem of daygame is that it implies you can't attract girls through traditional means, even if that's not true, which is quite a big red flag for a girl.

1 hour ago, Karmadhi said:

Personally I am very respectful and polite whenever I approach so for me it does not make much of a difference. Issue with daygame is that many guys are socially retarted and do not know when to back off and the girls feel super uncomfortable. If you have good social intelligence and high empathy it should be ok.  Also starting with a compliment can create a good vibe and leave the girl in a good mood. If you do daygame right it will make girls happy you approached them, but many guys do not do that and hence it has this bad reputation. You need to stand out from the crowd in a good way.

 

 

 

Yea fair point. I guess my issue with daygame is that 'doing it right' relies heavily on deception. You are trying to create the illusion that you've picked out that particular girl as special when really you're running a numbers game. But I suppose I can't really preach about that, it's hardly like nightgame is a bastion of integrity either.

Quote

however for actual results it seems very very difficult

 

 

 

Venue is pretty important in my experience.

There's a venue I have been to like 7-8 times and never even met a single girl who was interested in me. Then there are other venues where the dancefloor is almost impossible to walk on at the end of the night from couples making out (and often they are a complete mix of good and bad looking guys/girls) and I have met girls like 50%+ of the time I go there.

In general, I've found the best clubs for meeting new people are the ones that have the most diverse group of people in them. The more diverse the club, the more friendly and open everyone is. Clubs that cater to more specific niches of people are always pretty shit for meeting girls. Especially clubs filled with people stuck up their own ass. Techno clubs in my city are a bit like that 

Edited March 7, 2023 by something_else

[Miguel1]

12 hours ago, Ulax said:

@Migue Lonas

Can you give a brief synopsis of your game journey?

Hmm, let me try. I don't have much time so I'll really try to make it brief:

Started watching Owen's (then Tyler) YT videos when I was 15 (13 years ago). When I was 16, I got deeper into studying game, there was a blog by a guy called Shark. At 17, I learned about Osho, through this Shark's forum actually. Someone mentioned Osho in the comments and from there on, there was no turning back from the personal development & the spiritual world.

At this point, I was actually quite depressed. A ton of pressure from my parents and relatives (Asian culture) to succeed in school, and also a ton of pressure from my own dream of succeeding in football. So Osho was actually my way out, and I would probably not have resonated with him, was it not for all the pain of failing and the pressure that comes with it. And oh yeah, the first heartbreak from my high school sweetheart when I was 18, so that all just fueled my desire to learn game to get a new gf (personal development, game) & the desire to understand my pain and ease it (spirituality).

Funnily enough, learning spirituality in all of this mess actually made my skin much thicker, when I first started approaching girls and getting rejected. I basically cared less thanks to Osho's teachings and of course, Owen's infields lol. Altho, looking back now, it was a bit toxic kinda nihilism relationship towards life to cope with the pain of rejection (you can maybe call it by-passing to a degree), rather than the abundance that I got now (spiritually, psychologically, skillfully & result wise).

So, that's for the background.

From 18 onwards, I started going out to clubs, alone. None of my friends (from high school) was down to take this nearly as seriously as I was, so I started going alone. I basically went 4-5 times a week, alone, as an 18-year-old kid. Kinda cool that I did it, now looking back. Def proud of my younger self!

Around the same time (16-18), was when I seriously started contemplating life as well. What the hell is the point of all this? Why does any of the rejections even matter? Live your life to the fullest then! Awaken to your full potential!

Side note: I'm pretty sure I bumped into Leo's videos when he was starting out on YT as well, but didn't resonate until a few years ago when I bumped into his Infinite Consciousness and God videos (the surprise I had on my face, since I had associated him with pickup videos from when he started out, or should I say, making girls squirt ahaha).

From here on, for the next 10 years (18-28), I've been in 3 serious relationships + the one I was with when I was 17 (the last two are basically as hot and beautiful as you can get in Finland, inside and out, currently still together with the last one). Everytime I have been single, I've gone out 3-5 times a week, none stop. Minus the pandemic quarantines.

Approached thousands, hooked up with too many I've lost count a long time ago.

My charisma, confidence, groundedness, wittiness & social intelligence is at a level, I seriously don't even appreciate anymore. To me, it seems like I am not that big of a deal / developed / special, but when I observe guys in different places, I get reminded.

------------------------

Overall, I wasn't the worst case when I started out (the way Leo was - not my biggest weakness). But the development from there to here is extraordinary, I cannot really even describe it. And without the spiritual background, I don't know if I would have been able to pull through. Also, Owen's talks about social conditioning went very well with Osho's talks about social conditioning. They kept reminding me that I am being conditioned to be a much lower self of my full potential.

This journey, like anything meaningful in life, is mostly inner game. The relationship you have with yourself. Probably 85-95% of game is inner game + logistics. The rest is nitty-gritty technicals.

I recommend this path to every guy, no excuses, as long as your health can handle it, because it is brutal and exhausting. But absolutely worth it. Aside from spirituality, this has been the most rewarding journey in my life & has grown me the most.

And it can be a lot of fun! Like Leo said, you just gotta make it fun. Have the proper positive mindset and find good wings.

For all the people who are starting out and thinking that this is silly because you are so spiritual and above it, is just by-passing. My closest friend back in the day was like this and I had to drop him cuz I just couldn't stand all the bullshit excuses and by-passing. He could have become a really good wingman and a friend for life, but no.

Anyway, thanks for your question and for giving me the chance to reflect on this once again! 

Edited March 7, 2023 by Migue Lonas

[Valach]

47 minutes ago, something_else said:

The fundamental problem of daygame is that it implies you can't attract girls through traditional means, even if that's not true, which is quite a big red flag for a girl.

But what is a traditional way of meeting a girl? Like I am not in school anymore, I also work remotely so work is not an option. Sure I have some friends, but what if I am not interested in any of them? I can go for nightgame on the weekends, but what if I want to increase my reach and approach during week when I am working the next day? I cannot stay out late. Online dating also does not offer me girls I'd be interested in. 

I just don't get what is so desperate about daygaming? As if your average guy, who is done with studies is swimming in pussy and because of that is not approaching -> they are not.

Edited March 7, 2023 by Valach

[something_else]

1 hour ago, Valach said:

But what is a traditional way of meeting a girl? Like I am not in school anymore, I also work remotely so work is not an option. Sure I have some friends, but what if I am not interested in any of them? I can go for nightgame on the weekends, but what if I want to increase my reach and approach during week when I am working the next day? I cannot stay out late. Online dating also does not offer me girls I'd be interested in. 

I just don't get what is so desperate about daygaming? As if your average guy, who is done with studies is swimming in pussy and because of that is not approaching -> they are not.

 

It's not about logic, it's about what girls intuit about you from your behaviour.

[Karmadhi]

2 hours ago, something_else said:

The fundamental problem of daygame is that it implies you can't attract girls through traditional means, even if that's not true, which is quite a big red flag for a girl.

Most couples are not found on clubs either. I would say more couples are created from daygame than nightgame. It is just that it is not "daygame", just people randomly somehow meeting. It is quite romantic and movies love to show it. I know people that got girlfriends from train stations that do not even know what game is, they just somehow ended up talking. So in terms of actual couples formed I would say it is around same (meeting during day or night).

Most couples are created via social circle and then online dating and then work/university/common activities.

Pickup at clubs is not a traditional mean either. So your logic, which honestly I find a big limiting belief applies for clubs either. At least where I live it is like this, maybe your country is different.

But if you want to get traditional, that is how couples used to meet in the past. Minus the spam approach part haha.

2 hours ago, something_else said:

Yea fair point. I guess my issue with daygame is that 'doing it right' relies heavily on deception

Let me frame it in a positive way for you: You are a great guy, with high integrity that wants to give love and you are talking to someone you find nice to see if there is any chemistry and if they would be interested to get to know you better and maybe something can come from it. If not, no worries. All she would have gotten from you is positive stuff.

If you do daygame to create harems and sleep with dozens of girls then yeah, it comes off as very scummy. That orange BS to dating is repulsive. Try green values embodiment and you will not feel bad about approaching during the day. It feels to me more romantic and pure and innocent and cute so the reason why you do it is very very important. Try to approach almost like a naive kid discovering the world full of positivity and love to give (while being wise, funny and confident ofc) and you will see it will not feel scummy. 

If you think about it, most guys that do this stuff are pretty scummy with low integrity (at least the good ones), so if you have a heart of gold and a lot of love/wisdom to give to the girl then you will feel pretty good about approaching them. If you come up with positivity and good energy they will not be rude or annoyed. Trust me I have tried it, 90% of reactions are positive and a few neutral ones.

You can use the same mindset for nightgame but since you have no issues with it, no need to apply it.

Edited March 7, 2023 by Karmadhi

[something_else]

5 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

It is just that it is not "daygame", just people randomly somehow meeting.

 

That's the important point. No one has an issue with that, it's the spammy kind of daygame that's questionable

Most of daygame is learning how to make your spammy approach seem like you saw a girl you thought was special and you wanted to ask her out.

6 minutes ago, Karmadhi said:

Let me frame it in a positive way for you: You are a great guy, with high integrity that wants to give love and you are talking to someone you find nice to see if there is any chemistry and if they would be interested to get to know you better and maybe something can come from it. If not, no worries. If you do daygame to create harems and sleep with dozens of girls then yeah, it comes off as very scummy. That orange BS to dating is repulsive. Try green values embodiment and you will not feel bad about approaching during the day.

If you think about it, most guys that do this stuff are pretty scummy with low integrity (at least the good ones), so if you have a heart of gold and a lot of love/wisdom to give to the girl then you will feel pretty good about approaching them. If you come up with positivity and good energy they will not be rude or annoyed. Trust me I have tried it, 90% of reactions are positive and a few neutral ones.

 

Realistically, if you are approaching lots of girls every day with a daygame strategy, you have to hide what what you're doing from them, no matter what your intentions are. You can have the best intentions in the world, a heart of gold, and emobdy green principles fully, but a girl will still look at you like a bit of a creep if she sees you approach two other girls on your high street before you then approach her and ask her out.

[Karmadhi]

40 minutes ago, something_else said:

Realistically, if you are approaching lots of girls every day with a daygame strategy, you have to hide what what you're doing from them, no matter what your intentions are. You can have the best intentions in the world, a heart of gold, and emobdy green principles fully, but a girl will still look at you like a bit of a creep if she sees you approach two other girls on your high street before you then approach her and ask her out.

Totally agree but it is a function of spamm approaching in general, not just daygame spam approaching. Although during day it is more intense, I agree with you.

However, this is a numbers game so we need to play it. Also you need volume to get experience. 

If you want to be honest about it, you can say: If I find a cute girl in public when I am going somewhere  and I am in the right mood I go talk to her politely and see where it goes (you are being honest). I doubt girls will see you as a creep if you say this with positive energy and a warm friendly smile. 

[Valach]

@Karmadhi @something_else

My last girlfriend was from daygame approach in a Park. I literally told her that she is like 7th girl I approached that day and was totally cool about it. It went without any issue and she actually told me that she liked that I went around meeting woman this way. And no wonder.

All the guys that tried to hit on her during our relationship were either sleazy attempts on instagram or some drunk approaches in the club.

I believe it's not so much about what you are doing, but how are you doing it and what is your vibe.

[Ulax]

 

3 hours ago, Migue Lonas said:

Hmm, let me try. I don't have much time so I'll really try to make it brief:

Started watching Owen's (then Tyler) YT videos when I was 15 (13 years ago). When I was 16, I got deeper into studying game, there was a blog by a guy called Shark. At 17, I learned about Osho, through this Shark's forum actually. Someone mentioned Osho in the comments and from there on, there was no turning back from the personal development & the spiritual world.

At this point, I was actually quite depressed. A ton of pressure from my parents and relatives (Asian culture) to succeed in school, and also a ton of pressure from my own dream of succeeding in football. So Osho was actually my way out, and I would probably not have resonated with him, was it not for all the pain of failing and the pressure that comes with it. And oh yeah, the first heartbreak from my high school sweetheart when I was 18, so that all just fueled my desire to learn game to get a new gf (personal development, game) & the desire to understand my pain and ease it (spirituality).

Funnily enough, learning spirituality in all of this mess actually made my skin much thicker, when I first started approaching girls and getting rejected. I basically cared less thanks to Osho's teachings and of course, Owen's infields lol. Altho, looking back now, it was a bit toxic kinda nihilism relationship towards life to cope with the pain of rejection (you can maybe call it by-passing to a degree), rather than the abundance that I got now (spiritually, psychologically, skillfully & result wise).

So, that's for the background.

From 18 onwards, I started going out to clubs, alone. None of my friends (from high school) was down to take this nearly as seriously as I was, so I started going alone. I basically went 4-5 times a week, alone, as an 18-year-old kid. Kinda cool that I did it, now looking back. Def proud of my younger self!

Around the same time (16-18), was when I seriously started contemplating life as well. What the hell is the point of all this? Why does any of the rejections even matter? Live your life to the fullest then! Awaken to your full potential!

Side note: I'm pretty sure I bumped into Leo's videos when he was starting out on YT as well, but didn't resonate until a few years ago when I bumped into his Infinite Consciousness and God videos (the surprise I had on my face, since I had associated him with pickup videos from when he started out, or should I say, making girls squirt ahaha).

From here on, for the next 10 years (18-28), I've been in 3 serious relationships + the one I was with when I was 17 (the last two are basically as hot and beautiful as you can get in Finland, inside and out, currently still together with the last one). Everytime I have been single, I've gone out 3-5 times a week, none stop. Minus the pandemic quarantines.

Approached thousands, hooked up with too many I've lost count a long time ago.

My charisma, confidence, groundedness, wittiness & social intelligence is at a level, I seriously don't even appreciate anymore. To me, it seems like I am not that big of a deal / developed / special, but when I observe guys in different places, I get reminded.

------------------------

Overall, I wasn't the worst case when I started out (the way Leo was - not my biggest weakness). But the development from there to here is extraordinary, I cannot really even describe it. And without the spiritual background, I don't know if I would have been able to pull through. Also, Owen's talks about social conditioning went very well with Osho's talks about social conditioning. They kept reminding me that I am being conditioned to be a much lower self of my full potential.

This journey, like anything meaningful in life, is mostly inner game. The relationship you have with yourself. Probably 85-95% of game is inner game + logistics. The rest is nitty-gritty technicals.

I recommend this path to every guy, no excuses, as long as your health can handle it, because it is brutal and exhausting. But absolutely worth it. Aside from spirituality, this has been the most rewarding journey in my life & has grown me the most.

And it can be a lot of fun! Like Leo said, you just gotta make it fun. Have the proper positive mindset and find good wings.

For all the people who are starting out and thinking that this is silly because you are so spiritual and above it, is just by-passing. My closest friend back in the day was like this and I had to drop him cuz I just couldn't stand all the bullshit excuses and by-passing. He could have become a really good wingman and a friend for life, but no.

Anyway, thanks for your question and for giving me the chance to reflect on this once again! 

@Migue Lonas Jheez dude! That's amazing! Thanks for sharing.

Edit: Also the part about going solo really challenged some limiting beliefs I have. I've only heard of one other pick up guy doing that before, and he's an instructor now.

Edited March 7, 2023 by Ulax

[Optimized Life]

7 hours ago, something_else said:

 actually going out hunting for sex during the day, and approaching a whole bunch of girls for that purpose, is considered weird/predatory behaviour by 95% of the population.

Huge limiting belief & negative framing right there. 

I've  had several positive reactions from hot young girls during the day, including in front of her mum and family.

Example I approached one really hot 19 year old girl in front of her mum, little sister, little brother. 

She and her mum were qualifying herself to me, telling me how mature she was and she inmediately texting me back, only reason I couldn't meet up with her was my own self doubts & hesitation to text her fast enough as she had to leave next day, but I may still meet her again if visit her city, and she still texts me back and flirts. This approach was in the afternoon. 

If you present the frame that you're out hunting all day then it's bad game, if you only approach hot girls and make it seem spontaneous then they (some of them) truly appreciate it ... 

I don't like how your biased perception frames it with pseudo statistics and percentages as if you're claiming some objective universal truth. 

Reread that statement and realize how stupid and arbitrary it is, and how you're obsessed with being a sheep and a slave to irrational cultural norms and dogma.

"IF you interact with an attractive women before the sky is dark you are automatically a creep and a rapist!" 

Lol.

Edited March 7, 2023 by Optimized Life

[Optimized Life]

2 hours ago, something_else said:

That's the important point. No one has an issue with that, it's the spammy kind of daygame that's questionable

Yeah, I do see what you mean in this sense. 

I've met wings who do spammy day game, which means approaching even girls that aren't that attractive but they're "their type man!" or "she has nice ass or she's blonde" as if that's enough, and these guys are quite embarrassing to be around and I try not to associate with them unless it's a huge city. 

Spammy daygame only works in huge cities but I don't like it either way as I have high standards and can feel like you're playing Game GTA.

Edited March 7, 2023 by Optimized Life

[Optimized Life]

2 hours ago, Karmadhi said:

Totally agree but it is a function of spamm approaching in general, not just daygame spam approaching. Although during day it is more intense, I agree with you.

However, this is a numbers game so we need to play it. Also you need volume to get experience. 

It's a difficult balance but yes you have to get in high volume without ever giving your cards away and making it obvious that you're spam approaching, or lets say strike the balance between high volume vs spam approaching and also having high standards and giving off a spontaeous vibe.

[Optimized Life]

2 hours ago, Karmadhi said:

If you want to be honest about it, you can say: If I find a cute girl in public when I am going somewhere  and I am in the right mood I go talk to her politely and see where it goes (you are being honest). I doubt girls will see you as a creep if you say this with positive energy and a warm friendly smile. 

If you're energies good then you'll get more positive reactions. 

But lets be real, a significant percentage of women will always find you creepy or just not be interested, this includes at night game and sometimes even more so with night game, so who cares you can't make every girl like you or respond well.

[LordFall]

14 hours ago, AriSujan said:

But the problem I'm facing currently is that the conversation is just surface level talk which seems to go nowhere...I'm not being able to get into deep conversation during the dates

The first date should be mostly about getting to know on the surface level and building attraction through banter, teasing, etc. A few more dates in is when you should start talking about the future of socialism and weird traumas and deeper conversations. 

[something_else]

37 minutes ago, Optimized Life said:

Huge limiting belief & negative framing right there. 

I've  had several positive reactions from hot young girls during the day, including in front of her mum and family.

Example I approached one really hot 19 year old girl in front of her mum, little sister, little brother. 

She and her mum were qualifying herself to me, telling me how mature she was and she inmediately texting me back, only reason I couldn't meet up with her was my own self doubts & hesitation to text her fast enough as she had to leave next day, but I may still meet her again if visit her city, and she still texts me back and flirts. This approach was in the afternoon. 

If you present the frame that you're out hunting all day then it's bad game, if you only approach hot girls and make it seem spontaneous then they (some of them) truly appreciate it ... 

I don't like how your biased perception frames it with pseudo statistics and percentages as if you're claiming some objective universal truth. 

Reread that statement and realize how stupid and arbitrary it is, and how you're obsessed with being a sheep and a slave to irrational cultural norms and dogma.

"IF you interact with an attractive women before the sky is dark you are automatically a creep and a rapist!" 

Lol.

I’m talking about spammy day game which you agreed in the next post is not well received.

It’s not a limiting belief. You could do a survey and find that most girls find it creepy or weird. I’m alright with being creepy or weird occasionally in nightgame but doing daygame you’re being viewed as creepy or annoying by probably a solid 50%+ of the girls you approach which is where it reaches the point that I don’t really want to get involved.

Talking to the occasional girl you find cute as you go about your day isn’t even really day game. It’s just being a sociable, confident man who finds women attractive.

Daygame specifically is when you leave your house with the intent to search for sex during the day by approaching like 10+ women, and it universally is viewed as creepy by the majority of society and especially women. Every approach in daygame your goal is to hide what you’re actually doing from the girl because if you don’t, you know full well she’d be creeped the fuck out. 

To be clear I’m not denying it can work, I know it can. I just don’t like that principle component is blatant deception. If that makes me a sheep, so be it.

[Miguel1]

3 hours ago, Ulax said:

Edit: Also the part about going solo really challenged some limiting beliefs I have. I've only heard of one other pick up guy doing that before, and he's an instructor now.

That shit grows you the most :).

Basically, you are forced to socialize with new ppl because your other choice is to look like a creep lurking around.

But learning this is hella rewarding: being able to just hit any random place alone in any random city and make friends.

—-

Funnily enough, I am transitioning into becoming a coach / mentor as well in the world of self-development and game. Basically self-mastery for men. I’ll try to make it as healthy and conscious as possible.

Something like what Owen is doing nowadays. The plan is to become financially free this way, then I will probably transition into teaching pure philosophy and spirituality. We will see!

Perhaps for the next 5-10 years I’ll do this, gather perhaps 5-10 million, travel around the world and socialize + pick up girls with my gf (we share the same vision & she is also a coach, but for women). I’ll exhaust this material world completely and slowly I’ll probably transition into teaching higher stuff.

——-

What about you? Would love to hear about your game career, career & life purpose & vision in life!

P.S. You’re def one of the more mature people in this forum, with a good balance of playfulness and seriousness & wisdom, love it!