Leo's worst outburst yet

[meta_male]

54 minutes ago, supremeyingyang said:

where did he say that?

 

[supremeyingyang]

@meta_male  Thx I missed that.

...and who replied there the first? Coincident? I doubt it.

[meta_male]

8 minutes ago, supremeyingyang said:

@meta_male  Thx I missed that.

...and who replied there the first? Coincident? I doubt it.

It doesn't matter, some of us have been dealt a bad hand.

[supremeyingyang]

@meta_male  The history of this person in the forum is just another example of laissez-faire and good will of mods exploited. Bad Hand? Be assured I have compassion, but when I discuss seriously I don't want people with problems. For that is family there

See they don't let you play profi sport unless you are good enough.. see what I mean?

[Ulax]

1 hour ago, supremeyingyang said:

@Ulax  see, we could have both. Make new subsection where certain people can be sorted out and need to prove worthy again

@supremeyingyang I like that idea in some ways.

However, then I imagine you would have one forum with really high quality posts, and one side of the forum with much lower quality posts. And i imagine higher consciousness folks would hang out in the higher quality post section, and wouldn't interact so much with lower consciousness users who behave poorely. Meaning the likelihood that poorly behaved lower consciousness users who behave would likely be diminished.

And i think that lends itself to seeing the point of the forum as allowing for sophisticated discussions amongst higher consciousness people.

I actually prefer that vision of actualized.org, as a more elitist place. Elitist in the sense not of level of consciousness, but in terms of being very exclusionary of people who behave poorly. If I could mod in line with my preference I would be swift to ban poorly behaved members. However, I accept it is not my place to mod in that way, and as such I defer to the way Leo wants me to mod, and in effect defer my vision of the forum to his.

That said, I recognise that I had the privilege of being socialised into valuing etiquette and treating others with respect. And that for some that isn't the case, so by being very exclusionary in that manner we would excluding a certain demographic of people from getting value from the forum. However, this would be an exclusion I would nonetheless prefer to have.

However, Leo may see that differently. If the forum were to become more exclusionary then I imagine it would mean that some folks who would have otherwise had their lives radically changed would later not. Maybe 9/10 poorly behaved users never change despite their use of the forum. But that would still leave 1/10 who change their ways and grow, and live rich, meaningful lives.

Yet, you could also see that poorly behaved users likely dissuade some well behaved users from getting growth from the forum and the actualized.org community. And by not excluding poorly behaved users quickly, many would-be well behaved users miss out on rich, meaningful lives.

Hence, i think its important to understand the tough choices involved in making decisions about the forum. And, that any change involves benefit and sacrifice. Though perhaps some are more attractive based on our current values.

Make sense to you?

Edited February 24, 2023 by Ulax

[meta_male]

16 minutes ago, supremeyingyang said:

@meta_male  The history of this person in the forum is just another example of laissez-faire and good will of mods exploited. Bad Hand? Be assured I have compassion, but when I discuss seriously I don't want people with problems. For that is family there

See they don't let you play profi sport unless you are good enough.. see what I mean?

Yeah, I get you, you're an intellectual.

[supremeyingyang]

28 minutes ago, Ulax said:

@supremeyingyang I like that idea in some ways.

However, then I imagine you would have one forum with really high quality posts, and one side of the forum with much lower quality posts. And i imagine higher consciousness folks would hang out in the higher quality post section, and wouldn't interact so much with lower consciousness users who behave poorely. Meaning the likelihood that poorly behaved lower consciousness users who behave would likely be diminished.

Won't happen, people will come down to enjoy the antics. Plus the higher forum will have afracture of the posts as highquality posting taks effort.

28 minutes ago, Ulax said:

 

I actually prefer that vision of actualized.org, as a more elitist place. Elitist in the sense not of level of consciousness, but in terms of being very exclusionary of people who behave poorly. If I could mod in line with my preference I would be swift to ban poorly behaved members. However, I accept it is not my place to mod in that way, and as such I defer to the way Leo wants me to mod, and in effect defer my vision of the forum to his.

That said, I recognise that I had the privilege of being socialised into valuing etiquette and treating others with respect. And that for some that isn't the case, so by being very exclusionary in that manner we would excluding a certain demographic of people from getting value from the forum. However, this would be an exclusion I would nonetheless prefer to have.

I see.

28 minutes ago, Ulax said:

However, Leo may see that differently. If the forum were to become more exclusionary then I imagine it would mean that some folks who would have otherwise had their lives radically changed would later not. Maybe 9/10 poorly behaved users never change despite their use of the forum. But that would still leave 1/10 who change their ways and grow, and live rich, meaningful lives.

and 9 /10 of ....

28 minutes ago, Ulax said:

 

Yet, you could also see that poorly behaved users likely dissuade some well behaved users from getting growth from the forum and the actualized.org community. And by not excluding poorly behaved users quickly, many would-be well behaved users miss out on rich, meaningful lives.

Exactly.

28 minutes ago, Ulax said:

Hence, i think its important to understand the tough choices involved in making decisions about the forum. And, that any change involves benefit and sacrifice. Though perhaps some are more attractive based on our current values.

Make sense to you?

Totally. I propose to cut the 10% worst, the worst of the worst. Some here had a wild life for MONTHS or YEARS - that can't be good.

Edited February 24, 2023 by supremeyingyang

[supremeyingyang]

14 minutes ago, meta_male said:

Yeah, I get you, you're an intellectual.

It doesn't matter who I am.

Edit:

What matters is if my point is valid or not. I interpret you are not fond of my reply, which is no problem to me by all means. What do you think? A serious discussion creates barriers of does not happen.

Edited February 24, 2023 by supremeyingyang

[nhoktinvt]

i think you should take a shower just my humble opinion

[meta_male]

38 minutes ago, supremeyingyang said:

What matters is if my point is valid or not. I interpret you are not fond of my reply, which is no problem to me by all means. What do you think? A serious discussion creates barriers of does not happen.

You gotta take emotions into consideration is what I'm saying. Which is also the reason for people's outbursts and they should be tolerated to a degree/certain period. Mods handled it well imo, they did seed out users for the overall health of the forum after all.

Edited February 24, 2023 by meta_male

[Ulax]

13 minutes ago, supremeyingyang said:

Won't happen, people will come down to enjoy the antics. Plus the higher forum will have afracture of the posts as highquality posting taks effort.

@supremeyingyang Perhaps. i imagine some would just leave the forum though. So, it might just turn into a ban in substance. Though, not to say I wouldn't welcome that approach.

18 minutes ago, supremeyingyang said:

Totally. That why I would only cut the 10% worst, the worst of the worst. Some here had a wild life for MONTHS or YEARS

Hahaha I would agree with that. I'm just imagining in like 50 years some polite grandpa talking to his grandkids about his wild, reckless, rebellious youth. You know how maybe today the grandpa would show a young picture of them riding a motorcyle or shouting at a protest. But instead in the future its just a set of screenshots of them mouthing off at other users on the actualized.org forum in the 2020s.

[supremeyingyang]

47 minutes ago, Ulax said:

Hahaha I would agree with that. I'm just imagining in like 50 years some polite grandpa talking to his grandkids about his wild, reckless, rebellious youth. You know how maybe today the grandpa would show a young picture of them riding a motorcyle or shouting at a protest. But instead in the future its just a set of screenshots of them mouthing off at other users on the actualized.org forum in the 2020s.

Hahaha, I like that:)

[caspex]

You can't really defend Leo here. I mean, yeah sure everything he said is true and yeah sure he is pointing towards the truth. And let's even say that the post involved no emotional charge like him being angry or anything as well. That still leaves the fact that you can't awaken someone through force. This should be super obvious. "Treating someone like an adult" makes no sense when that someone is a kid. @Leo Gura You yourself have said that there is no point shouting calculus at a first grader.

People here are not even addressing the main issue. Everyone is dancing around the main topic. "But he is right!" "He didn't have any anger behind it!" "All I see is pure love!" "Guidelines don't apply to the owner" OR "He is toxic" "He is hypocritical" "He should be more polite"
Or people just straight up talking about the whole forum itself.
This is just more bullshit which, either Leo or more people in his support will point out. Instead of ofcourse, talking about the main issue.

The main issue is does what Leo did works? It doesn't work for the vast majority, he shouldn't even be talking this forcefully until he is sure it'd work. Now you can specify all sort of nuances of what he really meant or how he was feeling at that moment or if what he said is true or what not. That doesn't matter.

Yeah sure, "the vast majority" is more bullshit and just a concept when in fact only you are real. But the fact that you are posting on the forum at all means you are participating in the relative. You can't pick and choose which part of the relative you want to interact in, in this context.

This is so obvious that I am shocked no one is mentioning this.
 

[zurew]

Also, for the people who are saying "just leave dude, if you have a problem or if you don't like it" are basically implying that the value on this forum only comes from Leo, but I would argue otherwise. I think a lot more value comes from the fact that a lot of intelligent people are gathered in one place and can interact with each other and I would not trade that experience and the value of it just because the admin is behaving in silly ways. 

[Thought Art]

1 hour ago, zurew said:

Also, for the people who are saying "just leave dude, if you have a problem or if you don't like it" are basically implying that the value on this forum only comes from Leo, but I would argue otherwise. I think a lot more value comes from the fact that a lot of intelligent people are gathered in one place and can interact with each other and I would not trade that experience and the value of it just because the admin is behaving in silly ways. 

True.

I am still contemplating this situation. 
 

I want to say I am open to changing my mind, learning, and contemplating different perspectives in this. 
 

I initially felt annoyed and a bit sarcastic when I came into this thread. I am working on coming from a more neutral and understanding place.  

Edited February 24, 2023 by Thought Art

[ValiantSalvatore]

A elitist selection would be a total regression for the forum, even if it will pull up most likely all stakeholders. 

I don't really think this is very fair and it's pure survival of the fittest and heavy dominance oriented. 

I would block and define toxic behavior more instead of making the place "elite", most would simply buy themselves in and benefit from favouritism on the forum. 

It also screams cult in a sense as no one has public access to the stuff anymore.

Let people do mistakes and ban them if they missbehave to often.

 

Edited February 24, 2023 by ValiantSalvatore

[Gesundheit2]

4 hours ago, supremeyingyang said:

I propose to cut the 10% worst, the worst of the worst. Some here had a wild life for MONTHS or YEARS - that can't be good.

I suppose that's over now?

[Noahsteelers34]

Sometimes it's nice to get a good dose of harsh truth or a wake-up call. For that reason, I am not complaining.

I feel it's exactly what I need to hear. 

It really humbles me and for that I am grateful.

This message of "the truth doesn't care about your feelings" is an amazing lesson and I feel people here are too busy focusing on pointing fingers to focus on the fact he is trying to jolt you out of your human bullshit.

This being said... It would be nice if people welcomed a sense of belonging and acceptance here.

Edited February 24, 2023 by Noahsteelers34

[Thought Art]

25 minutes ago, Noahsteelers34 said:

This being said... It would be nice if people welcomed a sense of belonging and acceptance here.

 

I think it is welcomed. ?

[supremeyingyang]

2 hours ago, Gesundheit2 said:

I suppose that's over now?

For the moment - yes