Does 5-meo permanently raise consciousness?

[Mips]

18 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

infinity is a completely different state than normal, it is another frequency. if you do it many times, little by little it becomes normal for you. I dream of infinity many nights, it's almost the same as a trip. my baseline, my energetic vibration, has completely changed. a total experience of absolute infinity is something beyond any explanation. we are finite, apparently. we live in the finite. entering the real dimension, the infinite, changes you forever

 

43 minutes ago, Jodistrict said:

I have done a lot of Bufo Alvarius, you have amazing experiences, but the next day it is just a memory.  The same problem with Ayahausca.  Lately, I have been looking into Iboga.  From what I have been reading about Iboga, it could bring about permanent changes.  The Iboga actually goes into your past and shows you the most important events that influenced you and gives you a chance to resolve your issues.  This is really something valuable, if you can heal your past-created mind to free you to have a joyful life.  I am beginning to question the usefulness of the “enlightenment” model.  Healing is what we need.   Expanding out of the mind-created prison is what I am looking for.  I am looking at the Iboga retreats.  I don’t like the hospital model and i don’t have any drug addictions.  

Interesting, two different viewpoints from two who've both done a good few trips. @Breakingthewall - so do you feel this infinity in your everyday consciousness on a daily basis as a very advanced meditator would? And roughly  how many times did you do it before this became a reality? And how often?

Edited January 30, 2023 by Mips

[Jodistrict]

5 minutes ago, Mips said:

 

Interesting, two different viewpoints from two who've both done a good few trips. @Breakingthewall - so do you feel this infinity in your everyday consciousness on a daily basis as a very advanced meditator would? And how many times did you do it before this became a reality? And how often?

What I want to know is how "infinity" helps you when you have a flat tire?  Or any other shit comes up.  Does your mind remain calm and in equilibrium, or even joyful?  

Edited January 30, 2023 by Jodistrict

[Mips]

@Breakingthewall Do you feel equanimity in all situations, untouched by change and adversity as @Jodistrict alluded to?

[Flyboy]

This idea of "baseline" consciousness vs "elevated" consciousness is one of Leo's most dangerous abstractions, and is fundamentally incorrect.

Consciousness is NOT a scale of lower states and higher states, despite the way it can appear like that during mystical experiences.  The only thing that is meaningful to say is that there is delusion, and lack of delusion, but EVEN DELUSION is lack of delusion, in an ultimate sense.  That last part usually isn't helpful though, because that isn't seen until delusion is very very thin.  Focus on seeing clearly, on releasing resistance to what IS.  Enlightenment is not a state of consciousness, but a seeing that is deeper than mind and deeper than even experience.  Leo completely misses this, as he is so in love with this idea that he just keeps climbing higher on this imaginary scale (and hence the narcissism).

[Mips]

@Sincerity Wrote a great post the other say in a similar thread, coincidentally:

 

"It's gonna be much harder. But not impossible. (btw, define enlightened)

I guess You could say it's like this: psychedelics provide understanding and groundwork provides embodiment. It's kind of theory (but experienced directly) vs practice. Both are important. Psychedelics are AMAZING for showing You what's possible, states You would never be able to access with traditional methods. Also they help open You up, help You temporarily go beyond your fears and attachments, bring stuff to the surface, all that.

Without psychedelics your groundwork might be wrong, misguided, uninspired. Without groundwork You are, well, ungrounded. The theory doesn't stick in your mind and make a difference for your everyday life. It doesn't change You on a deep level.

In theory You don't need psychedelics but in practice I think You do. If You want to go really far."

 

Good response, a combo is perhaps the answer, with a very deep, dedicated meditation practice.

 

 

 

[Sincerity]

@Mips ??

[Breakingthewall]

2 hours ago, Jodistrict said:

What I want to know is how "infinity" helps you when you have a flat tire?  Or any other shit comes up.  Does your mind remain calm and in equilibrium, or even joyful?  

I'm not bad at keeping my balance in harsh conditions 

1 hour ago, Mips said:

Do you feel equanimity in all situations, untouched by change and adversity

Let's see if the real shit comes. disease, disability, misery. who knows how he will react?

[Mips]

30 minutes ago, Sincerity said:

@Mips ??

:):)

I'm thinking perhaps a good while with 'standard' psychedelics like LSD/Mushrooms to clear trauma/shadow stuff, then 5-meo down the line for the transcendent experience. Doing my first mushroom trip in 20 years in a couple of weeks with a psychedelic coach to learn proper preparation & integration.. 5-meo one day perhaps. Maybe by then someone will find a way to make it less terrifying/dangerous. Or perhaps another more approachable substance that does the same job.

 

Edited January 30, 2023 by Mips

[axiom]

58 minutes ago, Mips said:

Psychedelics are AMAZING for showing You what's possible

I consider that psychedelics show how deep and nuanced and crazy and profound the dream can be. They show the dream in hitherto unimaginable depth and glory. It is truly something to behold.

I've had my share of trips, but I do not consider that any peak states from psychedelics - no matter how extraordinary - have anything to do with enlightenment really. They're a bit of a red herring at best, and kinda dangerous at worst.

Edited January 30, 2023 by axiom

[axiom]

2 hours ago, Flyboy said:

This idea of "baseline" consciousness vs "elevated" consciousness is one of Leo's most dangerous abstractions, and is fundamentally incorrect.

Consciousness is NOT a scale of lower states and higher states, despite the way it can appear like that during mystical experiences. 

 Enlightenment is not a state of consciousness, but a seeing that is deeper than mind and deeper than even experience.  

Yes

All experiences / states are dream states - all are on a level playing field. None is "higher" or "more advanced" than another.

Enlightenment is beyond experience. Certainly it is beyond mind. And is not a state of consciousness. 

Good stuff. 

Edited January 30, 2023 by axiom

[OBEler]

@Mips I have a way which takes the fear out of 5 meo dmt completely. 

Take Mdma (120 micro or more ) and then take 5 meo direct after the peak of Mdma is over (1.5 to 3 hours in). 

Some 5 meo facilitators did this combination also on hundrets of people and they think also it's the best way to do this for beginners

Edited January 31, 2023 by OBEler

[Jordan]

From my experience with around 15 trips it seems to be a temporary change in your consciousness. I have heard someone claim that after taking it daily for 30 days it has had a permanent effect but other people that tried 30 days in a row had some negative side effects. The consciousness carry over effects from meditation are much more obvious than 5MEO Dmt. You do get many insights on it though.

[Mips]

1 hour ago, OBEler said:

@Mips I have a way which takes the fear out of 5 meo dmt completely. 

Take Mdma (120 micro or more ) and then take 5 meo direct after the peak of Mdma is over (1.5 to 3 hours in). 

Some 5 meo facilitators did this combination also on hundrets of people and they think also it's the best way to do this for beginners

I saw this solution before on the forum, I think it must have been you. I’m gutted I can’t do this, mdma triggers my epilepsy. Thanks for the input, though, much appreciated.

[Xochiquetzal]

But I dont think willing to *raise your consciousness* through psychedelics, especially 5-MeO-DMT is not quite the right way to see things ...

I guess spiritual practice is all about *raising your consciousness* , then, you might want to use a psychedelic to go deeper if you feel like it's necessary for you . 

But as said above, such trips are just experiences, next day, just memories of feelings ... pretty vaporous I would not rely too much on that .

Dont be in a hurry, don't forget to have the best life hygiene as possible, both for your mind and body, don't forget other spiritual practices ...

By the way, the trip has to be integrated otherwise you can smoke 5-MeO-DMT or Crack-Cocaine, if you don't work on integration, it will be value-less , you will make it just another drug .

And I'd be very careful mixing 5-MeO substituted tryptamine with any serotoninergic drugs ... There have been deaths with MAOIs and their Pharmacology seems complex and not yet understood. I'd be extra careful with MDMA since i's a huge releaser ...

Oh and if you have epilepsy ... are you and anti epilletic meds ? Most of them might be deadly combined with 5-MeO-DMT unless it's Lyrica, Pregabalin, or a benzodiazepine. 

And sadly, 5-MeO-DMT with epilepsy seems even more risky to me than MDMA , have you ever used 5-MeO-DMT ? It's a real massive overload, most people shake, there has been seizures even with healthy individuals so, be real careful, it's not as safe as DMT . 

[Breakingthewall]

21 hours ago, Mips said:

 

Interesting, two different viewpoints from two who've both done a good few trips. @Breakingthewall - so do you feel this infinity in your everyday consciousness on a daily basis as a very advanced meditator would? And roughly  how many times did you do it before this became a reality? And how often?

5meo is a purification process. At first, every time you do it, your impurities, your lies, your fears, your attachments are revealed. in order to fully do 5meo you have to let go of everything. when you really get it, it is total liberation, a cleansing of all your energy channels that remains in time, but to have gotten there you have to have let go of control and attachment to yourself. This does not mean that you have become an ascetic or someone indifferent to the vicissitudes of life, obviously if they tell you tomorrow that you have cancer, it will generate anxiety, less than if you are a materialistic, of course.  the difference is more in your ability to surrender to the present, to perceive the infinity of this moment, of what you are. If I compare myself with two years ago, when I started with 5meo, the difference is enormous. I've cleared megawatts of constant anxiety. I lived looking forward, conceptualizing, in the surface, now I'm more and more just in the present moment, almost totally. I will continue with this substance as long as it continues to be useful to me in my work to achieve total freedom

Edited January 31, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[Salvijus]

@Breakingthewall nice 

[PeaceOut96]

Speaking from my own psychedelic trips, than there is indeed a difference between before the breaktroughs and after. In the first few trips there wasn't a big difference, but when you go deep and enter these higher states than it does affect your "baseline" state. All from energitic changes, physiological etc. But its not the same as when you took the substances.

[Jodistrict]

I don’t find the words “raise your consciousness” to be particularly edifying.   I prefer the Shinzen “shoe” test.  You have been meditation day and night for two weeks and at the end of the retreat you discover that someone took your shoes.  How do you react?   If you get angry and upset, that is evidence that you haven’t become detached and your meditation didn’t have a lasting affect.

If someone tells me that they are infinity, God, enlightened, life is a dream, etc., I’m not interested.  But if you tell me that you have just noticed that things your brother did that use to annoy now you don’t even notice.  I say that is huge and you have made a permanent change.  If you can forgive you mother.  Huge.  Real change.  You can now let go of negative thoughts more easily.  Real change.  Someone insults you, and instead of feeling anger, you feel compassion.  Nice job.
 

[tuku747]

Everything permanently raises your consciousness. Entropy always increases.