How to achieve this state of consciousness more times? What is it?

[Javfly33]

I've tried to talk to some people about this (in real life and also in other forums) and nobody seems to get what im talking about. Its frustrating. 

A year ago I was tripping on acid and at the comedown I took my phone and started scrolling Youtube and Sadghuru video popped up. The video was called 'Infinity Meditation' or something like that. It consisted on following a white dot through the screen.

What followed was one of the most intensely pleasure experiences of my life, if it wasn't the best one. I was able to focus so fucking deep into this dot that It felt like time was being "frozen" when I focused enough. Like time itself would stop moving, the sounds of the cars, dogs and bikes on the street would 'freeze', and then when I would unfocus on the dot, time would be 're-activated.'

This wasn't hallucination of psychedelics, (also I was already at the comedown), but rather that my perception was in an state of consciousness so focused and intense that I suspect I was 'merging' with time using the focus of awareness. Truly mindfucky shit, but so fun.

I know this is 'just' a non-dual state like many I´ve experienced other times in the past, with psychs and with meditation practices. But this was another level of des-integrating with reality and intensity of unity that it felt pure pleasure through all my body (actually calling it pleasure its kinda of false, its more like your body becoming bliss - reality itself, its so difficult to explain)

Least to say I haven't able to fully replicate the experience totally sober. (Not that I tried that much). It's frustrating to have experienced this and being clueless how to produce this state again. It seems impossible. I guess I have to be thankful for having known that 'feeling'. And pray that after death that its what we experience for ever.

Edited January 20, 2023 by Javfly33

[BipolarGrowth]

My thoughts would be to try more visual forms of meditation like this, especially after cultivating a lot of stability in attention through another form of meditation or even just use the visual meditation the whole time. Fire kasina could be a good one to try as the flame as well as the point and images after closing your eyes will fluctuate similar to how the white dot does. It seems like you might have a greater ability to focus on visual objects in meditation if you’ve noticed this experience was above the rest or near the top of your list. 
 

That hyper-focused state can induce a lot of interesting and enjoyable stuff. Your description lines up quite a bit with what I’ve heard of the second jhana. Intense pīti (joy/bliss) is the defining characteristic of the second jhana. The time altering effects seem to be coming from the intense focus and stabilized attention which allows your mind, ego, body, etc. to melt away into the background of your experience or even disappear entirely. This would be my guess of what’s at work here although I haven’t experienced an exact copy of what you describe. 
 

It also is going to probably be easier to recreate this while in more fluid and relaxed states similar to the come down of a trip. If you find yourself in a strong mystical state, trying out a visual form of meditation at that point in time might give you a good chance at revisiting this or at least a version of it. 
 

The important thing is to find a way to get back to that single pointedness in mind/attention/focus. This is basically the essence of samadhi and strong “concentration”. 

Edited January 21, 2023 by BipolarGrowth

[Leo Gura]

You were on LSD. You're not just gonna get that sober.

Maybe if you spend 100 hours on a retreat focusing you might get something akin to it.

If you want to access psychedelic-like states sober, you can only approximate that with 100hrs of hours of unbroken concentration.

Edited January 21, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Michal__]

3 days, all day concentration (kasina) + 2 days dry fasting, 1 day water fast.

You will wish it was weaker.

Edited January 21, 2023 by Michal__

[Rafael Thundercat]

10 hours ago, Javfly33 said:

I've tried to talk to some people about this (in real life and also in other forums) and nobody seems to get what im talking about. Its frustrating. 

A year ago I was tripping on acid and at the comedown I took my phone and started scrolling Youtube and Sadghuru video popped up. The video was called 'Infinity Meditation' or something like that. It consisted on following a white dot through the screen.

What followed was one of the most intensely pleasure experiences of my life, if it wasn't the best one. I was able to focus so fucking deep into this dot that It felt like time was being "frozen" when I focused enough. Like time itself would stop moving, the sounds of the cars, dogs and bikes on the street would 'freeze', and then when I would unfocus on the dot, time would be 're-activated.'

This wasn't hallucination of psychedelics, (also I was already at the comedown), but rather that my perception was in an state of consciousness so focused and intense that I suspect I was 'merging' with time using the focus of awareness. Truly mindfucky shit, but so fun.

I know this is 'just' a non-dual state like many I´ve experienced other times in the past, with psychs and with meditation practices. But this was another level of des-integrating with reality and intensity of unity that it felt pure pleasure through all my body (actually calling it pleasure its kinda of false, its more like your body becoming bliss - reality itself, its so difficult to explain)

Least to say I haven't able to fully replicate the experience totally sober. (Not that I tried that much). It's frustrating to have experienced this and being clueless how to produce this state again. It seems impossible. I guess I have to be thankful for having known that 'feeling'. And pray that after death that its what we experience for ever.

I had simillar experiences with hyper-foucs. I was interesting but consciousness can be applied to more than looking at a dot and not move. Because soon or later you will need to move, pee,shit,make food and go back to the normality that you call frustrating. For me my deep psycadelic moments make daily life more fullfling and not frustrating. Also, trying to reapeat an experience is like trying to dream again the same dreams I had tonigth, or watch the same movie again and again. 

 

[Javfly33]

15 hours ago, BipolarGrowth said:

My thoughts would be to try more visual forms of meditation like this, especially after cultivating a lot of stability in attention through another form of meditation or even just use the visual meditation the whole time. Fire kasina could be a good one to try as the flame as well as the point and images after closing your eyes will fluctuate similar to how the white dot does. It seems like you might have a greater ability to focus on visual objects in meditation if you’ve noticed this experience was above the rest or near the top of your list. 
 

That hyper-focused state can induce a lot of interesting and enjoyable stuff. Your description lines up quite a bit with what I’ve heard of the second jhana. Intense pīti (joy/bliss) is the defining characteristic of the second jhana. The time altering effects seem to be coming from the intense focus and stabilized attention which allows your mind, ego, body, etc. to melt away into the background of your experience or even disappear entirely. This would be my guess of what’s at work here although I haven’t experienced an exact copy of what you describe. 
 

It also is going to probably be easier to recreate this while in more fluid and relaxed states similar to the come down of a trip. If you find yourself in a strong mystical state, trying out a visual form of meditation at that point in time might give you a good chance at revisiting this or at least a version of it. 
 

The important thing is to find a way to get back to that single pointedness in mind/attention/focus. This is basically the essence of samadhi and strong “concentration”. 

Woah! Thanks a lot dude very interesting information, it's a pleasure to receive this kind of quality comments ?? I will research more visual meditations, I indeed might have a personal inclination to this kind of focus and I might benefit from it if I research it more 

 

10 hours ago, Michal__ said:

3 days, all day concentration (kasina) + 2 days dry fasting, 1 day water fast.

You will wish it was weaker.

What is kasina? I'm going to be fasting next week for a couple of days portably.

15 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

You were on LSD. You're not just gonna get that sober.

Maybe if you spend 100 hours on a retreat focusing you might get something akin to it.

If you want to access psychedelic-like states sober, you can only approximate that with 100hrs of hours of unbroken concentration.

Yeah it's really disheartening man, I guess we will keep on putting the hours...

[Cathal]

Realistically you may touch that point on retreat. If you are busy with worldy things on a day to day basis there is just no way you will be able to just pull up concentration when you want like that. The danger is using chemicals is the instant access to intense states of bodily bliss is that you may be so dissatisfied with the gradual slope of developing your mind through a mapped out path that you won't endure it long enough to attain to be able to to do that as you want

[Kamo]

On 1/20/2023 at 6:27 PM, Javfly33 said:

I've tried to talk to some people about this (in real life and also in other forums) and nobody seems to get what im talking about. Its frustrating. 

A year ago I was tripping on acid and at the comedown I took my phone and started scrolling Youtube and Sadghuru video popped up. The video was called 'Infinity Meditation' or something like that. It consisted on following a white dot through the screen.

What followed was one of the most intensely pleasure experiences of my life, if it wasn't the best one. I was able to focus so fucking deep into this dot that It felt like time was being "frozen" when I focused enough. Like time itself would stop moving, the sounds of the cars, dogs and bikes on the street would 'freeze', and then when I would unfocus on the dot, time would be 're-activated.'

This wasn't hallucination of psychedelics, (also I was already at the comedown), but rather that my perception was in an state of consciousness so focused and intense that I suspect I was 'merging' with time using the focus of awareness. Truly mindfucky shit, but so fun.

I know this is 'just' a non-dual state like many I´ve experienced other times in the past, with psychs and with meditation practices. But this was another level of des-integrating with reality and intensity of unity that it felt pure pleasure through all my body (actually calling it pleasure its kinda of false, its more like your body becoming bliss - reality itself, its so difficult to explain)

Least to say I haven't able to fully replicate the experience totally sober. (Not that I tried that much). It's frustrating to have experienced this and being clueless how to produce this state again. It seems impossible. I guess I have to be thankful for having known that 'feeling'. And pray that after death that its what we experience for ever.

It sounds like Samadhi. Was this state very "vibrant" almost fluid like, yet very still, To include feelings of euphoria? 

Edited January 22, 2023 by Kamo

[BipolarGrowth]

@Javfly33 https://firekasina.org/fire-kasina-book/

There’s a free and high quality book all about fire kasina if you follow that link. Fire kasina is a meditation where you use a candle flame or other weak light source as the focus object of your meditation for usually at least several minutes before closing your eyes to change the focus object to the small after-burn image in your field of vision. Think of any time you’ve stared at the sun for a moment. This is the kind of image we’re talking about. Focusing on this can produce really strong concentrated states in meditation and plenty of people who do it on retreat can create a sort of waking dreamlike reality once their concentration has been built up enough. “Psychic” phenomena and other mystical stuff can come quite easily from this technique compared to many others. 
 

There are a number of other forms of kasina which entail creating images with the eyes closed, but fire kasina is a bit unique in how quickly and easily you can start to work with an image with eyes closed. 

[Loveeee]

Trippers call it "moments of eternity" 

[Carl-Richard]

I one time meditated eyes open on my porch on a microdose of LSD, weed, 5-HTP, L-Theanine and green tea. The porch is on a height relative to the surrounding area, viewing a hill with houses and pine trees in the far distance. I was staring at one of the pine trees. I tried to really perceive the tree "as it really was", and the more I focused, I felt like I couldn't get it, as I kept feeling like my vision was shifting or refreshing in this kind of loop. So I tried to sit very very still, still looking at this little green and brown smudge of a tree, and then I figured that I was not going to get rid of this refreshing motion, so I just surrendered to that. Then suddenly, I was looking at this shifting piece of smudge, just looking at it, and I saw that "this is not real". It was as if I was seeing a virtual reality being rendered before my eyes, breaking the illusion of a solid reality. All it really was was this groundless projection. That freaked me out. I literally said "oohh shiit" and stood up and went for a walk. I walked to a bench that I used to get high on with my friends, and I just sat there semi-blissed out (this was the time I kinda half-hallucinated a phoenix taking off inbetween slowly blinking my eyes shut). This post reminded me of this

Edited January 22, 2023 by Carl-Richard

[Javfly33]

6 hours ago, BipolarGrowth said:

@Javfly33 https://firekasina.org/fire-kasina-book/

There’s a free and high quality book all about fire kasina if you follow that link. Fire kasina is a meditation where you use a candle flame or other weak light source as the focus object of your meditation for usually at least several minutes before closing your eyes to change the focus object to the small after-burn image in your field of vision. Think of any time you’ve stared at the sun for a moment. This is the kind of image we’re talking about. Focusing on this can produce really strong concentrated states in meditation and plenty of people who do it on retreat can create a sort of waking dreamlike reality once their concentration has been built up enough. “Psychic” phenomena and other mystical stuff can come quite easily from this technique compared to many others. 
 

There are a number of other forms of kasina which entail creating images with the eyes closed, but fire kasina is a bit unique in how quickly and easily you can start to work with an image with eyes closed. 

Dope ??

 

7 hours ago, Kamo said:

It sounds like Samadhi. Was this state very "vibrant" almost fluid like, yet very still, To include feelings of euphoria? 

Yeah, kind of. Like dissolving into the present moment so intensely that the feeling of the body becomes an expression of that 'unity', therefore creating an intense feeling of euphoria. 

 

4 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

I one time meditated eyes open on my porch on a microdose of LSD, weed, 5-HTP, L-Theanine and green tea. The porch is on a height relative to the surrounding area, viewing a hill with houses and pine trees in the far distance. I was staring at one of the pine trees. I tried to really perceive the tree "as it really was", and the more I focused, I felt like I couldn't get it, as I kept feeling like my vision was shifting or refreshing in this kind of loop. So I tried to sit very very still, still looking at this little green and brown smudge of a tree, and then I figured that I was not going to get rid of this refreshing motion, so I just surrendered to that. Then suddenly, I was looking at this shifting piece of smudge, just looking at it, and I saw that "this is not real". It was as if I was seeing a virtual reality being rendered before my eyes, breaking the illusion of a solid reality. All it really was was this groundless projection. That freaked me out. I literally said "oohh shiit" and stood up and went for a walk. I walked to a bench that I used to get high on with my friends, and I just sat there semi-blissed out (this was the time I kinda half-hallucinated a phoenix taking off inbetween slowly blinking my eyes shut). This post reminded me of this

We are fucking Yoguis man hahaha

 

13 hours ago, Cathal said:

Realistically you may touch that point on retreat. If you are busy with worldy things on a day to day basis there is just no way you will be able to just pull up concentration when you want like that. The danger is using chemicals is the instant access to intense states of bodily bliss is that you may be so dissatisfied with the gradual slope of developing your mind through a mapped out path that you won't endure it long enough to attain to be able to to do that as you want

Yes, I'm starting to see the downsides. That's one of the reasons I feel my use of psychedelics are kind of done. 

[Kamo]

Yeah it sounds like a taste of Samadhi. It seems to only come about spontaneously. Any further chasing after it will always keep it from you. So just keep doing your meditation practices and maybe youll hit it again one day. But you can not chase or recreate it by desire. It doesnt function that way. This is a good example of the power of "not knowing" because you did not know about it, it was able to come about, now that you know about it you will be forever chasing, which keeps it from you. Because there was no desire to reach it, it was given to you. Now there is an egoic desire for it which it will be withheld from you. When you let go of that desire it may be once again experienced spontaneously. LSD was an important component so that factor may also still be necessary for you.

Edited January 22, 2023 by Kamo

[Javfly33]

1 hour ago, Kamo said:

 LSD was an important component so that factor may also still be necessary for you.

Good excuse to keep dropping acid from once in a while I guess ??

[Carl-Richard]

7 hours ago, Javfly33 said:

We are fucking Yoguis man hahaha

Lol. 

I might add that when I had surrendered to trying to stop the refreshing motion from happening, I realized that the refreshing motion wasn't because of my inability to perceive the thing, but more that it was the inherent nature of the thing from my current perspective. It was as if I had zoomed in so closely that I could see the pixels on my screen of perception. Every "pixel" in this case was an oscillating, circular, morphing piece of "smudge", kinda like an actual refreshing icon:

 

So imagine your visual field consisting of many refreshing icons like this closely next to each other (only the refreshing is maybe 0.5x speed, and it's made out of the things you're looking at):

 

That was essentially what I discovered. And before you say "it's the 5HT2A agonism from the LSD and the weed though": our brains literally run on 5HT2A activity at baseline. I can still see the refreshing happening completely sober if I just focus for a moment, it's only very subtle. The way I got to have the insight may be due to the LSD, etc., but I can never unsee that.

Edited January 22, 2023 by Carl-Richard

[Kamo]

2 hours ago, Javfly33 said:

Good excuse to keep dropping acid from once in a while I guess ??

Id just say its a useful tool to integrate into your practice. "dropping acid" pings it into the stigma. So how you word things can have an impact on how your viewing it. How you view can influence the results. LSD is a serious tool to be using. Its been one of the main substances that influenced my perception and insights into the nature of reality, so use it methodically.

[Jordan]

On 1/21/2023 at 6:28 PM, BipolarGrowth said:

@Javfly33 https://firekasina.org/fire-kasina-book/

There’s a free and high quality book all about fire kasina if you follow that link. Fire kasina is a meditation where you use a candle flame or other weak light source as the focus object of your meditation for usually at least several minutes before closing your eyes to change the focus object to the small after-burn image in your field of vision. Think of any time you’ve stared at the sun for a moment. This is the kind of image we’re talking about. Focusing on this can produce really strong concentrated states in meditation and plenty of people who do it on retreat can create a sort of waking dreamlike reality once their concentration has been built up enough. “Psychic” phenomena and other mystical stuff can come quite easily from this technique compared to many others. 
 

There are a number of other forms of kasina which entail creating images with the eyes closed, but fire kasina is a bit unique in how quickly and easily you can start to work with an image with eyes closed. 

Hey thanks for sharing this. I watched an interview with Daniel Ingram about fire kasina and didn't know about this book. I listened to the first part of the recording of their first fire kasina retreat found on the same website. I got the red dot and different colors with surrounding colors and tendrils coming off of them with it turning black and rotating sometimes. I could see it rotating in 3d a few times. I practised as they were explaining it on the recording. I used the flashlight on my phone instead of a candle since I have no candles right now. It seems really promising object of focus to practice entering the first Jhana.

Edited January 25, 2023 by Jordan

[Javfly33]

On 22/01/2023 at 8:15 PM, Kamo said:

Id just say its a useful tool to integrate into your practice. "dropping acid" pings it into the stigma. So how you word things can have an impact on how your viewing it. How you view can influence the results. LSD is a serious tool to be using. Its been one of the main substances that influenced my perception and insights into the nature of reality, so use it methodically.

I've used LSD for over +15 times by this point. I can't deny that thanks to it I´ve built some serious spiritual foundation that it has started to pay dividends finally.

At the other hand, I feel my relationship with psychedelics have changed and I don't see them as the magic pill I used to saw them. I can proudly say that If I go back to psychedelics, I´m doing them purely by recreation and to explore, rather than personal or spiritual development, since I feel I have gotten to their ceiling point by now.

[BipolarGrowth]

9 hours ago, Jordan said:

Hey thanks for sharing this. I watched an interview with Daniel Ingram about fire kasina and didn't know about this book. I listened to the first part of the recording of their first fire kasina retreat found on the same website. I got the red dot and different colors with surrounding colors and tendrils coming off of them with it turning black and rotating sometimes. I could see it rotating in 3d a few times. I practised as they were explaining it on the recording. I used the flashlight on my phone instead of a candle since I have no candles right now. It seems really promising object of focus to practice entering the first Jhana.

This is about exactly how it’s gone for me also. I haven’t done it for an extended period on retreat which is where its power truly lies, but it definitely is an effective way of getting into jhana. It’s the easiest technique for that I’ve found.