How Leo's teachings are becoming corrupt

[UDT]

1 minute ago, Mohammad said:

 

Leo is just a guide and a teacher. And a good one. We have to walk our own path.

 

I like this, you understand  Love & Peace to your path.

[kamwalker]

The corruption is not necessarily a fault of Leo in that he's just a dude who recording himself on camera and posting it on the internet. What people chose to believe is pretty much on them after a certain point. I think one thing he said in a video that was very accurate was, "If it's not true for you then it's not true at all". Don't subscribe to all of his teachings just because he said them. You will greatly fuck with your mind and perception of reality if you start walking around in the world holding onto other people's perspectives as your own when they have not been your own direct experience. Listen to other people and decide for yourself how it fits into your paradigm of reality. As far as Leo's ego that you speak of I think it is still incredibly obvious that he's still a normal guy with human conditionings. Same with Sadhguru, Tolle, etc. They are a bit more removed from the egoic mind than your average person but they are still susceptible to the same traps that everyone else is. 

Edited January 7, 2023 by kamwalker

[Mohammad]

3 minutes ago, kamwalker said:

The corruption is not necessarily a fault of Leo in that he's just a dude who recording himself on camera and posting it on the internet. What people chose to believe is pretty much on them after a certain point. I think one thing he said in a video that was very accurate was, "If it's not true for you then it's not true at all". Don't subscribe to all of his teachings just because he said them. You will greatly fuck with your mind and perception of reality if you start walking around in the world holding onto other people's perspectives as your own when they have not been your own direct experience. Listen to other people and decide for yourself how it fits into your paradigm of reality. 

Totally agree.

Even Leo himself pointed out this point many times in his videos. In recent videos, in the quality of consciousness is everything episode, he talked about this in a very honest manner at the end of the vidoe.

Although the forum is good, it also has many bullshit content. Leo's videos are much more high quality content.

1 hour ago, UDT said:

I like this, you understand  Love & Peace to your path.

And to you dear friend <3

[Breakingthewall]

Leo's teachings, that is, his videos, are intended for a type of person. Leo's videos are totally conceptual. explains things on a mental level. You are God, the others do not exist, God gets bored of infinity and creates the relative, God creates limits, otherwise it would be a boring video game, etc. 20-year-olds see this and discover a revolutionary new way of looking at things. it is, shall we say, an introduction to spirituality. Also, Leo is a guy who goes to club, etc. Easy to identify with him.

but these leo teachings are not really teachings, they are an inspiration to go deeper using psychedelics. Obviously, people immediately appear saying: leo, I took psychedelics and I realized that I am God! all conceptual... but it is already a huge step compared to being a total materialist, when it comes to facing life.

For example, imo the solipsism video is completely toxic, but at the same time necessary. says: you are the only one who can wake up. Leo's teachings are surely the ones that will lead more people to transcend the ego of history. this means very few people, but some. 

 

 

Edited January 7, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[Jowblob]

18 hours ago, Scholar said:

I have finally come to see an important, in fact essential, dynamic that one can fall victim to. In my eyes Leo has fallen to this dynamic, a trap he was unable to predict to due certain biases within his ego.

 

We all understand that to access higher states of consciousness we must alter the structure of our ego-mind. There are different ways to access higher states of consciousness. Leo is a proponent of a brute force methodology, namely the attempt to use radical psychedelic states to dissolve certain egoic structures so that we get access to higher states of consciousness. I will go into detail for why this is dysfunctional in a moment.

Now, there is one important key insight that must be kept in mind. A state of consciousness fundamentally has no evaluative quality to it. Meaning, Infinite Love is not inherently mindblowing, it is not inherently awesome. When you have a radically high consciousness experience, you are not crying in amazement because of the experience, you are crying because of the way your egoic structures react to the state.

If you were ultimately selfless, meaning you had no egoic structure, you would not get amazed by Pure Infinite Love. There would be no reaction to Pure Infinite Love, you would not deem it to be extraordinarily important. All of those things are egoic mind reactions. When Pure Infinite Love is terrifying, or beautiful, or amazing, that's all a function of egoic structures reacting to an influx of energy.

Why is this important? It's important because the degree of corruption of the teachings is determined by the difference in compatibility between the egoic structure and the state that was achieved. The more underdeveloped an ego is, the higher the corruption of the state will be once the structure re-emerges.

 

Leo is exceptionally underdeveloped for someone who has reached such high states of consciousness. His mind is far less developed than that of people who have not even remotely reached the states that he has with the help of psychedelics. This means that his insights, his understanding, his reaction to the states he is experiencing are all corrupted. His teachings are for that reason more corrupt, perverted and devilish than someone like Eckhart Tolle or Sadhguru, people who presumably have not reached the same states of consciousness.

There is an inherent limitation to the way Leo is approaching spirituality. The more violent the reaction to a given state that you achieve, the more friction there exists between your mind and the state. Violence in this means any extraordinarily intense emotional reaction, independent of positive or negative charge. To a super-developed alien being, your most intense psychedelic trip would not even evoke a reaction. It would be normal, like you looking at the color red. If this is inconceivable to you, then you do not have a prosper grasp of what ego is.

It is true that such experiences permanently change the egoic structure, and to a degree they can aid in development. However, the attempt to bent egoic structures through highly energetic states is barbaric, unsophisticated and impatient. The state can be imagined to be a highly energetic force which is discharged into the egoic structure. The less reaction to a state, the less imprint on the egoic structure, the more appropriate that state was for your mind. The higher the energetic state, the more friction there will be between your mind and that state. To use this as a developmental tool can lead to extreme dysfunction because it is akin to trying to brutally shape an object into a form that will be able to support that amount of energy. It can cause damage to a mind for that reason, damage that can be impossible for the mind itself to detect, because it is changing the very structure of the mind.

Leo's entire approach is based on an idea of reaching extreme states to induce extreme egoic friction, in an attempt to reach Infinity. The truth is, the human mind is not capable of holding Infinite Energy. It's not designed to hold that much energy, and the radicalness of his experience is only a demonstrating of the existence of egoic structures.

In the future we will not employ such methodology. We will not force inappropriate states into minds to change the structure of those minds. That's just stupid. We will change minds to allow states. It takes more time, more wisdom to do so. And this is good, it is a function of Divine Intelligence to allow for the existence of evolution. The future will not be paved by Psychonauts. The future will be built by people who create roads people can walk on, to venture further and further into the infinite realms of consciousness. In time, this methodology will get us much further than some children tripping their brains out on some psychedelics.

What Leo currently is doing is child's play, it's taking a mind and blasting it as far into Infinity as possible. So far that your ego will then inevitably corrupt it because it is not at the appropriate level to process that state. How the egoic structures will bent and permanently change in the process of energetic overload is largely random. If you use this methodology, it is literally only a matter of time before your mind will develope dysfunctions. It comes with the energetic overload, it's literal function is to shred your mind enough to allow that amount of energy to pass through for the amount of time you reside in that state.

 

In conclusion, Leo's teachings are corrupt because his mind has grown dysfunctional, but also because his mind is not developed enough to process the states which he explores during tripping. His teachings, of course, will not be the future of consciousness work. The mind structures required for a proper engagment with the infinite do not even exist today, and the people who will design those minds will not use Leo's teachings either. It will be a slow process, a changing of minds until we reach the states, not the other way around.

That is the only sustainable way. What Leo is doing is nothing but the tickling of his own ego, using the Divine to stimulate himself. The best evidence of this is this forum, which has grown to be little more than a platform to fullfill his own egoic desire for self-expression.

 

A clear symptom of this corruption is the idea that you need to reach Infinite, as if this life was some sort of rat race to God. That's absurd. You came from Infinite Love, and you will return to Infinite Love, inevitably, no matter what you do in this life. Leo's most mind blowing trip is nothing compared to what awaits you. Imagine what happens when everyone finds out that all this work was for something everyone gets for free at the end anyways. But hey, the ego is going to ego.

 

You're missing a very important point, there are layers to everything. So if he teaches something or says something he is speaking from a particular layer of consciousness that he experienced and thinks he understands. If we haven't experienced those layers that he did we can just be open minded and take it in. The problem with Leo teachings though on the forum, is that it's very simplistic... He just writes a sentence without explanation most of the time and that's it. If he takes the role of a "teacher" atleast explain what you're saying to lower levels.

Here is an example of consciousness layers:

1. I can't live without millions of dollars.

2. Money is very important.

3.  Money doesn't matter, but it's good to have it.

4. I can live with little money, i don't place importance on money.

5. Money doesn't matter to me, i just want to be free.

6. I'm not materialistic and don't place any importance on money

and so on

[Ulax]

8 hours ago, Mips said:

@Scholar Looking at his huge amount of videos, don't you agree that he's done the work? I've never seen such a succinct and all encompassing dive into the foundational and advanced topics and practices involved. I'm incredibly grateful, it's the first setup I've found that really works with my cerebral type mind.

I'm no expert but it seems obvious from his 500 or so videos that he seems to have developed his mind to a good degree.

@Mips Bit of a naive mindset imo.

A lot of misleading people can produce a lot of professional seeming videos. Appearances can be deceiving.

[Mips]

@Ulax I think you’ve made an assumption - I’m basing on my assessment on many years of searching & listening to enlightened teachings. Leo’s teaching are much more on the money than you think, and have a huge amount of depth and insight - very far from just some guy producing professional seeming videos. 

Edited January 7, 2023 by Mips

[Ulax]

@Mips It seemed to me you were just referencing the fact that he made lots of videos you thought seemed professional, without having watched most of them.

If you have watched a multitude of them then my comment doesn't apply.

[Mips]

@Ulax ?

[Leo Gura]

7 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

The psychonaut doesn't have to care much about gradually unwinding the ego.

I do care about unwinding the ego. Nothing I say precludes that.

[Carl-Richard]

35 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

I do care about unwinding the ego. Nothing I say precludes that.

I know. It's just not the main deal imo.

Edited January 7, 2023 by Carl-Richard

[Leo Gura]

3 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

I know. It's just not the main deal imo.

My main deal is understanding because you cannot do anything else without it, certainly not unwinding the ego.

[BlessedLion]

One thing that helped me greatly in this arena was unfusing my relationship with Leo. Although it feels personal since I’ve been watching his stuff for years, it’s not. He’s reporting to a camera that goes out to from his pov his followers, same with any teacher. I read Ralston and realized he’s just writing this to a general audience. It’s not personal at all. When in the video or book they say “you” they don’t actually mean YOU. I know this sounds obvious but there’s a subtlety here I’m pointing out that people don’t pick up. And they imagine this relationship that doesn’t exist. Some people grow dependent on teachers in this manner and spend a ton of energy trying to make them wrong or glorify them, like Scholar is doing. Either way it’s a distraction. And they create imaginary conversations either agreeing disagreeing asking questions wondering what they would think of or if they would approve. It’s delusion. See it for what it is. 
 

Just sit alone, breathe contemplate and not know. There is only one Truth and it exists. There’s def a point where you must go your own way and deprogram your own mind and you are totally alone in that battle. Not know. Kill the Buddha. 

[BlessedLion]

It still boggles me that people can sit around and bitch about Leo’s work after the decade of heart and soul he’s put into it. If you don’t see it as massive value, then you stupid. It’s helped clarify so many things for me. Still, there’s a time when you must put the teacher down and go. Go! Come to your own conclusions. 
 

The biggest thing I’ve learned from teachers is to go within and question/deconstruct. Until there’s nothing left. 

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, BlessedLion said:

It’s not personal at all.

When you realize this about ALL of life, your work is done

[Yimpa]

1 hour ago, BlessedLion said:

It’s not personal at all.

 

26 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

When you realize this about ALL of life, your work is done  

“I used to think there was a difference between rich men and poor men, until I realized… amen!”

[Breakingthewall]

Leo's teachings on spirituality have always been corrupted because he has always spoken from absolute understanding and omniscience, when this was never the case. It's a humility issue. Leo is not allowed to express doubt. when he interacts in the forum it is from the maximum arrogance, nobody's idea is never an interesting point for the one who has made him see something. he is always on top! and let's see... the reality is that no. He is a smart, brave and ambitious guy. but omniscient, no 

The problem is that humans are genetically programmed to bow their heads to alpha, and here it is, so a vicious feedback loop occurs. if leo says solipsism, all are solipists. if multiple gods, not so much solipsism anymore. that's how we humans are

[NoN-RaTiOnAL]

14 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Leo's teachings on spirituality have always been corrupted because he has always spoken from absolute understanding and omniscience, when this was never the case. It's a humility issue. Leo is not allowed to express doubt. when he interacts in the forum it is from the maximum arrogance, nobody's idea is never an interesting point for the one who has made him see something. he is always on top! and let's see... the reality is that no. He is a smart, brave and ambitious guy. but omniscient, no 

The problem is that humans are genetically programmed to bow their heads to alpha, and here it is, so a vicious feedback loop occurs. if leo says solipsism, all are solipists. if multiple gods, not so much solipsism anymore. that's how we humans are

OR
He's just saying what he found out in his awakenings. 
i mean, if he found out we are all a part of giant banana and then he goes and says that in the forum with confidence then that is because there is literally no other way to verify this shit other than to awaken. 
he never said you should believe that blindly but to verify these stuff in your own experience if you dare. 
why shouldnt a men be confident about his own experience? 
should i not be confident around the fact i have pants? its just my experience. 

[Breakingthewall]

11 minutes ago, NoN-RaTiOnAL said:

OR
He's just saying what he found out in his awakenings. 
i mean, if he found out we are all a part of giant banana and then he goes and says that in the forum with confidence then that is because there is literally no other way to verify this shit other than to awaken. 
he never said you should believe that blindly but to verify these stuff in your own experience if you dare. 
why shouldnt a men be confident about his own experience? 
should i not be confident around the fact i have pants? its just my experience. 

It is not the same to say: I had this understanding. to say: I reached omniscience and I saw that God was bored and that's why he created limited reality, and he makes it difficult because a video game in which there are no obstacles gets boring right away. but hey, if you want, you can go to him in the forum and refute something, to see what he answers you 

But in another hand, it's the way to reach the people. If you come doubting, nobody is going to take you seriously 

Edited January 8, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[Lunatic]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdWxdhEB19s [1:17:45]

@Scholar

 

Edited January 9, 2023 by Lunatic