Vaush on the failure of the Left to address Men's issues

[DocWatts]

Kudos to Vaush for bringing attention to this issue, which I've long felt has been a huge blindspot for the Leftists/Liberals.

Is it any surprise that young men gravitate towards emotionally validating grifters like Andrew Tate and Jordy P? Especially when the issues they're facing in their lives are being downplayed by Green ideologies that aren't willing to extend much in the way of compassion to men who are struggling to find a sense of purpose and belonging?

Of course that's not to say that the Left needs its own version of predatory content creators that use self help advice to indoctrinate people into an ideology, but we should be doing much more to help people cultivate healthier forms of identity. 
 

 

Edited January 6, 2023 by DocWatts

[Happy Lizard]

This post will seem like I’m giving my own conclusions or my own anecdotal stories, but I hope that it in this way might shed a light on what maybe, in addition to Green/leftist pushing their agendas, what can be another layer to this problem.

I’m a foreigner living in the us for about 9 years now, and form my point of view having lived and traveled outside of the the US, this loneliness problem also definitely has to do with how the American society and even (to a very apparent degree ) the way cities are designed in here that drive people appart.

The sense of sick “individualism” that is, even though it breath of fresh air to people used to less individual oriented societies, can quickly turn toxic and sickening.

In retrospect, Men where I’m form in college never struggle with having friends, you meet people and you hang out with them like a pack. 
I don’t know a single guy who’d tell you they felt lonely or isolated.
Not to mention people knowing their immediate neighbors, or staying in close touch with their childhood/early school friends, having deep life-long relationships with them. 

When I fist arrived I was shocked, and honestly stayed in disbelief of how things are like here! Yet I played with it, being used to not having this much binderies/autonomy/freedom. yet I quickly realized how it made me feel like I didn’t belong/alienated and its wierd that even people who are born and raised feel the same way about where they live.

What I’ve gathered is there is a false sense or a promise that you are going to go “someplace” or find “someone/some people ” “somewhere”  where then and there you’re at the right spot with the right people where you can form friendships and/or commit to “being” there - in reality of course  you never do. - So it's ok to spend a semester talking to your classmate, or year working with you co-workers and then not talk to them ever again. “Your not “there” yet and so these people are not so important to keep in touch with.”  This seems to be like a program that everyone here has running in their heads, which is madness to people living anywhere else!

Social life in the us sucks! even though I live close to a major city, where you can find people actually walking side to side -instead of all packed up in cars- It’s still tainted with this crap individual sense. That you would be breaking an invisible norm to ask for directions, or to asume someone has the time to help you or give an honest little piece of their time. 

Compare this to were I was last summer, in France: we were lost somewhere on the edges of Paris.
Some 3 old folks (white guy, and two black and Indian ladies) saw the look on our face, said something in french, guided us to hop on the bus with them and on the road were fighting over who’s got the right directions that can lead us where we wanted to go; they were complete strangers, not even in a trouristy part of the town, didn’t speak English and me and my family differently didn’t look like them, yet they helped us like we where citizens of their country.

On the streets kids were playing on the side of the road with their parants barely paying attention to were they where going. Families, friends and couples hanging out in open parks giving zero attention to time, relaxed.
What it brought to back to me was the feeling of what it felt like to live in a “society”.

Compare that with the US where the past 2 paragraphs are practically impossible in so many different ways. No wonder people are lonely here,  society is spilt between ridged individualism and leftist agendas that misguide the young folks, where the hell can they go?

Edited January 5, 2023 by Happy Lizard

[trenton]

A lesson I'm taking away from this is how to detect blind spots especially in politics.

Pay attention to the group being judged or demonized. In many cases it is because they are misunderstood. This is when you should be skeptical and do a deeper investigation. 

Especially, you should do this for the people you judge the most. You will not get these people on your side If you are mean to them. Stereotyping and harsh generalizations are foolish approaches to politics.

The most important lesson to me here is how to detect blindspots within a paradigm. It can be applied to any world view. 

[Ulax]

@DocWatts Think this is spot on.

Nature abhors a vacuum.

Edit: Damn dude, I watched the youngTurks vid, made me wanna cry. Generation of lost boys looking for love in all the wrong places

Edited January 6, 2023 by Ulax

[Raze]

 

Edited January 6, 2023 by Raze

[Ulax]

4 minutes ago, Raze said:

 

@Raze Why'd you post this?

[Raze]

3 hours ago, Ulax said:

@Raze Why'd you post this?

To show the context of the conversation on Twitter he’s responding to

Edited January 6, 2023 by Raze

[DocWatts]

13 hours ago, trenton said:

A lesson I'm taking away from this is how to detect blind spots especially in politics.

Pay attention to the group being judged or demonized. In many cases it is because they are misunderstood. This is when you should be skeptical and do a deeper investigation. 

Especially, you should do this for the people you judge the most. You will not get these people on your side If you are mean to them. Stereotyping and harsh generalizations are foolish approaches to politics.

The most important lesson to me here is how to detect blindspots within a paradigm. It can be applied to any world view. 

Totally agree.

[Ulax]

14 hours ago, trenton said:

A lesson I'm taking away from this is how to detect blind spots especially in politics.

Pay attention to the group being judged or demonized. In many cases it is because they are misunderstood. This is when you should be skeptical and do a deeper investigation. 

Especially, you should do this for the people you judge the most. You will not get these people on your side If you are mean to them. Stereotyping and harsh generalizations are foolish approaches to politics.

The most important lesson to me here is how to detect blindspots within a paradigm. It can be applied to any world view. 

Agree.

Everything that happens is exactly what should have happened and had to happen.

[trenton]

On the idea of detecting blind spots in paradigms, it applies even to board games like chess.

Throughout history world class players would discredit the Sicilian defense or hyper modern openings. If there is social pressure around what what openings you play and in what style, then it limits the extent to which you can understand the game.

In a similar case, board game players commonly discredited computers and artificial intelligence, arguing that they could never match human intelligence. Many world chess champions made the mistake of taking the limits of their imagination for the limits of reality.

In one case, I detected a blind spot in a modern grandmaster and pointed it out to him, allowing him to make better lessons. I clued into this blind spot because of his emphasis on a source of authority like a chess book. Furthermore, he made seemingly sensible moves as if they were obvious. This prevented him from considering alternatives. After doing a deeper investigation, I discovered a novel bishop sacrifice. On move 14, GM Mesgen Amonov assumed white should play dxc5. Follow the main line in this study to see what I mean.

https://lichess.org/study/b5voOvhK

A few red flags for detecting blind spots in paradigms are as follows. I feel like this is a good lesson to include in improving chess thinking and thinking in general.

1. Harsh judgements, stereotypes, and scapegoating. Calling something or someone evil.

2. Appeals to authority, such as a book, celebrity, or system of thinking

3. Taking knowledge as obvious

4. Dogmatism, such as strictly following chess principles without concrete analysis. In fact I defeated a chess instructor by making several queen moves early on without developing my knights.

5. Confusing the limits of our imagination for the limits of reality, or claiming that something is impossible. How do we know for sure what is impossible for the universe?

6. Arguing against the utility of understanding a new field of knowledge. My sister argued against the utility of studying psychedelics. Many people don't think deeply about politics because they don't see the value in deeper understanding. This could affect how we vote.

I think it would awesome if Leo made a video on this topic of how to deconstruct a paradigm. How to think outside of the box. How to discover the limits of our current way of thinking and how to move beyond it.

If you can think of more red flags, try to add some.

[Rafael Thundercat]

My personal experience on this topic is as far as I remember.

I found online stuff as Incell, MGTOW and similar lines of thought only after a breakup with a girl I used to date. 

I that times I used all that narratives to downplay my mistakes in the relationship and make in my mind her dark feminine aspects more prevalent. In the end she was as ignorant as me on how our dynamic was not balanced. I had overcome that insecure self and had many quality Intimacy with more mature woman. But I can see clearly that in that state I was I was a easy target to buy into ideological distortions of female/male relationship. 

When a man is happy in his own body, making his thing, eating healthy, reading good stuff, resting, going on healing retreats or meditation retreats, he will very rarely fall pray to bullshit. Is easy to make every boy receive healthy environment that sustains all his potential? Yes and no. And honestly, by that times I was so in pain that no amount of advice could help me get out of the hole. There are dark nigths of the soul that a man need to gather forces to lift himself up alone, even if he use some external sources as books, masters etc.. there are times he need to go deep in his inner being and drag himself up from his pit of self-pity. And I am thankfull I found stregth to do the moves necessary to save myself from myself that days.

 

[Rafael Thundercat]

This is somehow related with this topic about Masculinity.

Judge by yourself the validity of the content to your inner work. 

And wishing that we as men can more and more communicate as this two guys in the podcast. 

 

https://open.spotify.com/episode/5qLk6lhc93r6uTRhH12pqd?si=BMYoWy6ZQu2LwNuWb0OriA

[Lyubov]

The USA left makes little room for men and masculinity. The best you can hope for is to caucus with the left and sit as a centrist or center left and you will still be shit on by these leftists and called a racist. It’s been turned into a “safe space.” stage green in the USA is a mess.