Gender and sex. How the f you enlighten people?

[Thought Art]

@Alta for 99% of people though, these boundaries are is if they are real. For sports, relationships, roles  etc… 

For a lot of people, these dynamics are so real that if they get caught up in all this identity ambiguity they can become mentally ill and confused. Men for example, feel lost an confused with all this messaging. 

Edited January 5, 2023 by Thought Art

[AdrianBartan]

@Alta

16 minutes ago, Alta said:

Absolutely. I agree that it is impossible to make definitive arguments without testing and examining a situation.

What I am proposing is that, by fostering an environment of acceptance and understanding of gender fluidity, we could potentially create a more respectful and appreciative society. We can provide a platform of support, respect and openness, where people can be accepted as their full and unique selves without labels, and without the pressure to conform to a certain gender. This environment of understanding and respect can be the foundation of a more connected, accepting and compassionate society, where everyone is valued for who they are without superficial gender distinctions. 

We can choose to use our free speech to express love and understanding, rather than hatred and discrimination. The key is to create a social environment of inclusion and understanding, where people are encouraged and accepted to be their true selves. No one is inherently evil or malicious, though it may seem like it. Everyone has the capacity for good, and sometimes people make choices that may lead to negative consequences for themselves and others. Everyone is responsible for their own actions and must be held accountable for their choices. Ultimately, we must strive to be tolerant and act with understanding in order to create a more peaceful world. We must remember that everyone is a human being, and they deserve to be treated with respect, regardless of any negative actions they have engaged in

Respectful and appreciative society? Why? 

It needs to be also functional and practical society. Why you do not see this? 

It is not practical to express yourself all the time, you need to fall in line sometimes, and compassion works to a certain degree.

Look the only society where this is applicable is a very wealthy society, where you have this luxury to express yourself and think about what you are feeling, can I be a man/woman etc.

Where there is survival in question, everything you said falls out the window, respect and compassion do not build the world, it just makes the world better with a foundation in place.

The problem is that with this you risk destroying that foundation.

Sometimes maybe you are stupid and do not deserve respect or compassion, a metaphorical slap on the face has some positive effects.

[Ulax]

Any identity is a social construct even these new woke ones

[Thought Art]

2 minutes ago, Ulax said:

Any identity is a social construct even these new woke ones

I’ve noticed people are Cisphobic lol

Most these woke people ain’t Woke… just relatively liberal in areas.

Edited January 5, 2023 by Thought Art

[Ulax]

@Thought Art Why'd you reply that to my comment?

[Thought Art]

@Ulax because I was thinking about what you said. These “woke” identities are actually very flimsy. Not really woke. 

[Ulax]

@Thought Art Its kind of funny. Its like im gonna point out your gender terms are social constructs, and then replace them with gender terms that are also social constructs.

Tbf tho I like that they have these new identities. Its a bit narcissitically done atm imo, i.e. you must subscribe to these new terms, but this new gender role stuff is in its infancy, so its understandable that the movement will be a bit insecure.

[Thought Art]

I agree with Alta about promoting an accepting and loving society. But, I stress that… that’s not going to be a linear thing in reality 

[Alta]

56 minutes ago, Thought Art said:

@Alta for 99% of people though, these boundaries are is if they are real. For sports, relationships, roles  etc… 

For a lot of people, these dynamics are so real that if they get caught up in all this identity ambiguity they can become mentally ill and confused. Men for example, feel lost an confused with all this messaging. 

 I understand that its threatening to their identity to suddenly shift their perspective so much, so I guess the best way not to get caught up in the negatives of it, is to become aware of the things our mind is playing with us, the moment its seen, no concept no idea and no change in perspective can reach to your inner understanding of yourself

[Alta]

@AdrianBartan I just provided one way of changing things, and to change such a complex system even as i suggested takes lots of time and effort to do so. Changing any system is difficult and you can never know the results it might lead to, but the place I was speaking from, is from inner understanding that anyone can achieve if they will ponder these matters deeply enough. Cultural development plays a big role as well, but we are evolving even though maybe at a slow rate, but there are different fields in which we gain more understanding, right now its science, because of how practical it is, but ultimately we have inner desire to be happy, and its hard to be at peace when there is judgement from others, or inside you, thats why society evolves and strives to a more all encompasing perspectives

[Alta]

38 minutes ago, Ulax said:

Any identity is a social construct even these new woke ones

I am unclear as to how and when the term "woke" began to be employed in these contexts. I can see how mass media can shape cultural beliefs about woke people, but I am not fully familiar with the roots and utilization of this particular word. Its cringe when such matters are introduced through the most brain damaging means possible

[Ulax]

@Alta I'm woke. Sorry to hear of your brain damage btw

[AdrianBartan]

@Alta I can share a personal story about this topic in private if you want to learn about the dangers of this expression and what it can lead to.

 

[Alta]

@AdrianBartan Great! I'm open to that

[Thought Art]

25 minutes ago, Alta said:

 I understand that its threatening to their identity to suddenly shift their perspective so much, so I guess the best way not to get caught up in the negatives of it, is to become aware of the things our mind is playing with us, the moment its seen, no concept no idea and no change in perspective can reach to your inner understanding of yourself

Wut

Anyway, I personally think people can be more open to relativity. Doesn’t mean everyone has to be trans, non-binary, gay or whatever. People can be themselves. 
 

To me , you being authentically you without harming others, and others being authentically them without harming you or others is ideal. 

Edited January 5, 2023 by Thought Art

[Alta]

@Thought Art When people come to comprehend their true self, irrespective of labels such as 'human', 'male' or 'man', no potential info hazard can influence you. Like a construct aware state of our mind

[Thought Art]

@Alta Sure, but 99% of people won’t be construct aware ahah 

Welcome to the void 

[Alta]

@Thought Art Also about this void thing, I saw someone describe the exact situation that happened to me. Its like I could see the void around my vision, and when I would try to focus on "somethingness" I could see that its made out of nothigness. But the question is that the person on this forum also described that the void around his vision was black, but isnt black is something? Its so weird. I'll be glad if you could share something on this.

[Razard86]

14 hours ago, Bobby_2021 said:

Biology is a social construction.

Sex is a social construction.

Male/Female is a social construction. 

Male and female are just as arbitrary labels as man or a woman is. 

Gender and sex are not that different as you think. Both are pure social constructs and labels. 

You can literally make up anything you want. Tadaaa

Glad you got it. To me the creation of gender has not been used properly, as the people who use it don't even understand what the purpose of it was and have been wreaking havoc on it.

Gender = Cultural understanding of male and female roles.

Sex= Cultural understanding of male and female anatomy. 

Its as simple as that. The moment you start forgetting this, and using it interchangeably it can start to get confusing which is what has been going on. As the world's soup of definitions start mixing and mixing more you start creating more chaos. Currently in America we are starting to stifle freedom of speech, you have no clue how much worse you are going to make things. It's why majority of terrorist attacks are domestic and are done by home grown extremist groups. Whenever you try to suppress/control anything, you actually make it worse. Don't even get me started on America's war on drugs, and everything else. 

These identity games are confusing because most don't even understand the identities, and you keep erecting even more identities. 

And here is the kicker....they don't have to agree to your definitions either. 

Edited January 5, 2023 by Razard86

[Thought Art]

@Razard86 I totally might get in trouble for this… 

But, I actually think there is a correlation with sex and gender. Though, I am aware all dualities collapse and there are exceptions. I think your physical, chemical anatomy has a role in your personality, cognitive function and preferences. Though, as humans we are varied. 
 

I don’t think it’s as simple as “all men and woman are just acting out roles” I think this is an over simplification and case of making sex/ gender and case of making ones personality, taste, identity etc overly arbitrary. 
 

There of course elements of social construction. And, the lines between all these things blur because they all aspects of finite existence is a construction.  
 

Like, how should a man eat, act? Dress? Dance? Speak? Etc… there is construction here. Yet, idk. It’s not just arbitrary. 
 

Humans exist as generally male or female leaning for a reason. It’s not just all arbitrary social convention. It’s obviously what humans have enjoyed and use for survival…

However, when someone naturally falls outside of the norm, then, they would be acting just to maintain social norms…

But, yeah it is a construct. But, people are not just pretending to me masculine or feminine to fit it.

There are male traits, there are female traits. They may not be absolutes… but this is something I think is important to include in this. 

Edited January 5, 2023 by Thought Art