Why do I see from my eyes and not yours? Why am I me and not you?(answered )

[Carl-Richard]

7 minutes ago, Sincerity said:

How do You know there can be consciousness with no content? From experience, theory or what?

I have no stance of this. I don't know. 

I've sat in meditation many times where the sensations of my body, the perceptions of my visual field behind my eye lids and the sounds in the room, literally start fading away, consistently the same way every time, to the point where I feel like I have no body, no mind, and that there is no space, no time. I didn't go all the way though, only up to the point where I felt like I was no one, nowhere, and that I would disappear forever and never come back, because that is a scary thing to let go into when you're completely sober.

Edited January 10, 2023 by Carl-Richard

[Thought Art]

Why should I trust you, Leo, or these two kind gentleman kastrop and spira to tell me what’s true? 
 

I guess I should trust my own direct experience. Both Rupert and Kastrop think there is an external world being sensed by perceptions. But, I’ve experience this is false. 
 

There is no sense perception, just absolute truth. As entertaining as all this is, I’m gonna let it go. I am seeing the futility of this conversation. 
 

Truth, over being right. 

Edited January 10, 2023 by Thought Art

[Sincerity]

15 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

I've sat in meditation many times where the sensations of my body, the perceptions of my visual field behind my eye lids and the sounds in the room, literally start fading away, consistently the same way every time, to the point where I feel like I have no body, no mind, and that there is no space, no time. I didn't go all the way though, only up to the point where I felt like I was no one, nowhere, and that I would disappear forever and never come back, because that is a scary thing to let go into when you're completely sober.

Oh wow. Okay.

Don't know what to tell Ya. Good luck confronting the fear!

[Carl-Richard]

11 minutes ago, Thought Art said:

Why should I trust you, Leo, or these two kind gentleman kastrop and spira to tell me what’s true? 

I guess I should trust my own direct experience.

Trust your experience and trust your rationality.

 

12 minutes ago, Thought Art said:

Both Rupert and Kastrop think there is an external world being sensed by perceptions. But, I’ve experience this is false. 

They're talking about conceptual distinctions that are useful for describing some limited aspects of reality. They're not describing the ultimate nature of pure consciousness, which is unlimited.

 

13 minutes ago, Thought Art said:

There is no sense perception, just absolute truth. As entertaining as all this is, I’m gonna let it go. I am seeing the futility of this conversation. 

Truth, over being right. 

You do you. I used to be like this. I prefer to have my rational mind on team with my spiritual experiences as much as possible (which is never 100%, but it's better than being perpetually confused).

[Osaid]

9 hours ago, Someone here said:

This is akin  and reminded me about  the measurement problem in quantum physics. You can't measure the state of a system without disturbing the system. More accurately, whenever you measure a system, you are merging with it, to create a hybrid system. You can't disentangle the observer from the observed. It's all tangled up in itself lol 

That's cool, I can see the similarities

[Osaid]

31 minutes ago, Sincerity said:

How do You know there can be consciousness with no content? From experience, theory or what?

You become conscious of it. It becomes much easier to become aware of this aspect of reality if you can enter a complete state of nothingness. This is one of those things where it's hard to comprehend without experiencing a certain state. It is a paradox, and it exists. You can't imagine it, because nothingness is infinite, and your imagination is finite.

It's like trying to imagine what having no eyesight is like, it's just absent. There is the experience of it being absent. You don't see black, you don't see any colors, it's just completely gone. That's what pure nothingness is like, but extend that absence to all of your senses. Then, you just exist there.

You are actually experiencing nothingness to a certain degree right now. For example, you can't see anything behind your head. That "not seeing" isn't something that doesn't exist, it is actually a form of perception which is being contrasted to what you can see in front of you. A recontextualization has to take place here to understand this. The only reason you can see in front of you is because you can't see behind you. They both equally exist together and they both define each other.

 

 

 

[Thought Art]

@Carl-Richard I don’t think you are grocking what I am saying but, this is a looping conversation. This is the end for me. Best of luck.

Rationality is useful, but what I am saying is trans rational, and useless. 
 

What I am saying doesn’t change anything in the human plane. Because this finite domain is as if: eyes, brains, others, etc. 
 

But, it’s not happening to someone, or somewhere. It’s just pure being, pretending to be sense perceptions of a human. There’s nothing for God to sense because it’s all alone. So it imagines distance… when you walk… your not really going anywhere except changing where you imagine you are.
 

Red, when you see it… it’s not happening anywhere or in a brain, and it’s not a sense perception . Red actually exists absolutely, as does people, cars and fridges. But, at the same time they don’t, they are just your consciousness. English doesn’t work you have to have a mystical experience. 
 

Rationality is perfectly useful for human existence. But, With regards to solipsism and consciousness these are for me, personally translational subjects. 
 

I respect your views. 

Edited January 11, 2023 by Thought Art

[Sincerity]

19 minutes ago, Osaid said:

For example, you can't see anything behind your head. That "not seeing" isn't something that doesn't exist, it is actually a form of perception which is being contrasted to what you can see in front of you.

I don't know. "Behind my head" seems like only imagination and concepts.

Lately I've confronted my false belief that I as the Source am somewhere behind my eyes. Then I realized I am everywhere (and nowhere in particular).

I'm saying this because your example of "perception behind my head" reminds me of my own thinking that I am behind my eyes. That there is something I don't see. I don't think that's the case. 

I see everything

[Osaid]

50 minutes ago, Sincerity said:

I don't know. "Behind my head" seems like only imagination and concepts.

Lately I've confronted my false belief that I as the Source am somewhere behind my eyes. Then I realized I am everywhere (and nowhere in particular).

I'm saying this because your example of "perception behind my head" reminds me of my own thinking that I am behind my eyes. That there is something I don't see. I don't think that's the case. 

I see everything

I am not pointing to concept or imagination. I am saying that "not seeing" is actually something you can become conscious of and that it exists outside of concepts and imagination. The lack of seeing is a form of perception/consciousness which you can experience.

It's just that your mind is myopically focused on the presence of qualia rather than the lack of it. 

Edited January 11, 2023 by Osaid

[Sincerity]

12 hours ago, Osaid said:

I am not pointing to concept or imagination. I am saying that "not seeing" is actually something you can become conscious of and that it exists outside of concepts and imagination. The lack of seeing is a form of perception/consciousness which you can experience.

It's just that your mind is myopically focused on the presence of qualia rather than the lack of it. 

Ok, thanks. I'm going to investigate this.

[Thought Art]