Andrew Tate Arrested

[Nilsi]

3 minutes ago, Consept said:

Everyone has some form of ethics, really it just depends on how far your scope of concern reaches. Does your ethics include others or does it just include yourself? Tate has ethics in that if someone wrongs him from his perspective he would be against that ie him being put in prison, to him unfairly, is 'wrong'. However his ethics dont extend to other people, hes happy to take advantage of others for his own ends. 

Ethics are not some ideology that you believe in for the sake of it, although they could be, but really its an attempt to have a society where everyone is better off. If everyone did think like Tate, in that their ethics only extended to themselves it would be a terrible society, most likely someone like Tate would rule over it. 

I already told you what my ethics are. I believe exceptional men should assert their will on the world.

There are really only two choices you have: Either you believe in exceptional men, or you believe everyone should follow the golden rule. In other words, either you believe in the Übermensch or you believe in some egalitarian utopia - or you are just not thinking about this very much.

[zurew]

16 hours ago, Nilsi said:

I don't see how some universal ethics are necessary for my wholeness though.

Because you live in a society - if everyone could do whatever the fuck they wanted to do,  you wouldn't be able to do half the things you can do right now. You would constantly have to worry about getting killed,shot, stabbed, robbed etc.

[Nilsi]

4 minutes ago, zurew said:

Because you live in a society - if everyone could do whatever the fuck they wanted to do,  you wouldn't be able to do half the things you can do right now. You would constantly have to worry about getting killed,shot, stabbed, robbed etc.

Thats why you peasants can keep following your categorical imperative.

[Consept]

19 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

I already told you what my ethics are. I believe exceptional men should assert their will on the world.

There are really only two choices you have: Either you believe in exceptional men, or you believe everyone should follow the golden rule. In other words, either you believe in the Übermensch or you believe in some egalitarian utopia - or you are just not thinking about this very much.

For me an exceptional man would have to have ethics that extended beyond himself otherwise he wouldnt be exceptional he would just be a narcissist at best or psychopath at worst and I wouldnt want them asserting their will on the world in anyway. Some of the biggest genocides in human history have been because of these types of people asserting their will on the world. If you had an exceptional man who had empathy for others and his cone of concern went beyond himself into the actual world then thats fine, assert your will as it would be beneficial for all, but if its just how much you can get and dominate and destroy then whether you like it or not society will have a backlash against you.  

[zurew]

19 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

Thats why you peasants can keep following your categorical imperative.

No. We will do what you do - think that we are exceptional and then try to force our will on the world and we will see what comes out of that.

[Nilsi]

5 minutes ago, zurew said:

No. We will do what you do - think that we are exceptional and then try to force our will on the world and we will see what comes out of that.

What you miss is that > 99% of people are not even interested in that much responsibility and freedom - they just want an easy comfortable life in the herd; that we can supply.

[Consept]

You say 'we' so i take it you class yourself as an exceptional man, what puts you in this bracket as an exceptional man?

Edited February 6, 2023 by Consept

[zurew]

2 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

What you miss is that > 99% of people are not even interested in that much responsibility and freedom

A lot of narcissists and  psychopaths would want that kind of freedom and power - but that would be a disaster. Whats your definition of an exceptional men, other than self-id?

[something_else]

54 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

I already told you what my ethics are. I believe exceptional men should assert their will on the world.

There are really only two choices you have: Either you believe in exceptional men, or you believe everyone should follow the golden rule. In other words, either you believe in the Übermensch or you believe in some egalitarian utopia - or you are just not thinking about this very much.

This is so black and white, I think you could do with some more nuance in this viewpoint.

Exceptional people come in all shapes and sizes. To say "exceptional men should exert their will on the world" is problematic because plenty of exceptional people should actually have their ability to assert their will on the world stripped. Hitler being the classic example.

Men and women can both be exceptional in good and bad ways, and it requires an exceptional amount of wisdom to judge whether those exceptional people are helpful or harmful towards building a healthy and strong society.

 

[Nilsi]

47 minutes ago, Consept said:

You say 'we' so i take it you class yourself as an exceptional man, what puts you in this bracket as an exceptional man?

I have the guts and will to power to proclaim myself an exceptional man - thats the only qualification you need.

[zurew]

1 minute ago, Nilsi said:

I have the guts and will to power to proclaim myself an exceptional man - thats the only qualification you need.

A lot of psychopaths and a lot of crazy people have the will to proclaim themselves as an exceptional man. Under your system we would have a lot of lunatic people "governing" the world, unless you give more qualifications to your system.

[Consept]

10 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

I have the guts and will to power to proclaim myself an exceptional man - thats the only qualification you need.

Yeah you had to give more qualifications, exceptional would denote that you are 'better' than others, you have to be clear in what ways you are 'better'. Just being able to proclaim yourself an exceptional man would be indistinguishable from a deluded man or even someone who is very low confidence and has to say that hes exceptional, hoping that one day he believes it. 

[Nilsi]

14 minutes ago, zurew said:

A lot of psychopaths and a lot of crazy people have the will to proclaim themselves as an exceptional man. Under your system we would have a lot of lunatic people "governing" the world, unless you give more qualifications to your system.

What do you mean "under my system?" No one's stopping anyone from proclaiming themselves exceptional.

[Nilsi]

"Lift up your hearts, my brothers, high, higher! And for my sake don't forget your legs as well! Raise up your legs, you fine dancers, and better yet, stand on your heads!

This crown of the man who laughs, this crown wreathed with roses — I have placed this crown upon myself. I myself declare my laughter holy. Today I found no one else strong enough for that.

Zarathustra the dancer, Zarathustra the light hearted, who beckons with his wings, a man ready to fly, hailing all birds, prepared and ready, a careless and blessed man. —

Zarathustra the truth-teller, Zarathustra the true laugher, not an impatient man, not a man of absolutes, someone who loves jumps and leaps to the side — I myself crown myself!

This crown of the laughing man, this crown of rose wreaths: you my brothers, I throw this crown to you! Laughter I declare sacred: you higher men, for my sake learn — to laugh!”

[something_else]

35 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

I have the guts and will to power to proclaim myself an exceptional man - thats the only qualification you need.

Not really. Some of the dumbest people I've ever met believed they were exceptional and proclaimed it to others all the time. Not saying that's you, simply that you need some kind of qualification to determine what an exceptional man actually is and whether or not that is actually you.

If I sit at home playing video games and eating cheetos for 12hrs a day but I've convinced myself I'm an exceptional man then I'm actually delusional, not exceptional.

Edited February 6, 2023 by something_else

[zurew]

8 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

What do you mean "under my system?" No one's stopping anyone from proclaiming themselves exceptional.

What I mean is that when you say, that you want exceptional men to exert their will and power, I assume you mean that they should be allowed to do whatever they want, because if they are not, they can't express themselves fully. - that can't happen unless you have a system for it that agrees with your premise that (exceptional men can do whatever they want or at the very least allowed to do more things than a normal person).

Edited February 6, 2023 by zurew

[Nilsi]

13 minutes ago, zurew said:

What I mean is that when you say, that you want exceptional men to exert their will and power, I assume you mean that they should be allowed to do whatever they want, because if they are not, they can't express themselves fully. - that can't happen unless you have a system for it that agrees with your premise that (exceptional men can do whatever they want or at the very least allowed to do more things than a normal person).

Or so you assume. 

Thats why I gave the example of the mob boss earlier. You can actually assert your will freely if you are determined enough. And look how far Tate got before giving up his will to power to some false idol - the muslim God.

Also, isnt it funny that you people always associate psychopathic and criminal stuff with free self-expression?

Edited February 6, 2023 by Nilsi

[Israfil]

55 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

I have the guts and will to power to proclaim myself an exceptional man - thats the only qualification you need.

That's a pretty low bar. Almost every western woman thinks she's exceptional, and plenty of narcissistic men would equally say so. Probably more like 15 or 20%.

[Consept]

@Nilsi

Bro just get to the point, what makes an exceptional man? And none of this just me seeing it means I am, because if you were in prison and you said that shit youd definitely be an 'exceptional' man's bitch 

[zurew]

15 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

You can actually assert your will freely if you are determined enough

Maybe in some but not in all cases, unless you are actually willing to break many currently exisiting laws. The point is that you would preferably have a system where you are allowed to do whatever you want to do and exercise your power freely without any backlash or without the potential of getting arrested.

Bottom line is, that you can't assert your will freely forever, if that entails breaking laws.

15 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

And look how far Tate got before giving up his will to power to some false idol - the muslim God.

Tate got caught because he potentially broke some laws. - this demonstrates again that if you have an already existing system that doesn't agree with your belief (that "exceptional" people should exercise their power and will fully and freely), then eventually it will stop them from doing so.
 

15 minutes ago, Nilsi said:

Also, isnt it funny that you people always associate psychopathic and criminal stuff with free self-expression?

Nope, thats not true. The idea that self identification is alone enough to be exceptional and exceptional people should be allowed to do whatever they want, automatically leads to the conclusion that a lot of psychopaths and lunatic people will be governing the world.

Edited February 6, 2023 by zurew