The Association for Spiritual Integrity — honor code of ethics for spiritual teachers

[zurew]

7 minutes ago, roopepa said:

Keep on with your stories built on insecurity and bloated self-image. ? Just blatant manipulation and narcissism.

"there is no one to be narcissistic and there is no one to manipulate" - thats how retarded is to say that there are no teachers.

That level of dismissiveness and inability to engage with the topic at hand is fabulous.

Edited December 24, 2022 by zurew

[Nilsi]

The serious student wouldn't care about this nonsense. 

The only legitimate tenet is "does this help me awaken, or not?"

[Moksha]

54 minutes ago, roopepa said:

Keep on with your stories built on insecurity and bloated self-image. ? Just blatant manipulation and narcissism.

You are no more or less a character in the story as everyone else. There are certainly manipulative and narcissistic teachers, but to claim that all are is to dismiss the wisdom of every spiritual tradition. If you believe it is possible for you to awaken to your true nature, surely you see that others may already have.

[SeaMonster]

6 hours ago, zurew said:

So brainwashed and manipulated people should get fucked or should we protect them from getting fucked?

By definition, every spiritual seeker is brainwashed and manipulated to begin with, since they believe certain things inculcated in them by their upbringing.  The irony here is that the people telling them "there are no teachers" ARE serving the function of teachers.

A nondual or solipsistic teaching is still a teaching.  So you can't get around it -- you can't pretend what you are offering isn't teaching.

At that point, you have to take actual responsibility for the teaching you're offering and this is the issue here.

Edited December 24, 2022 by SeaMonster

[Carl-Richard]

1 hour ago, Nilsi said:

The serious student wouldn't care about this nonsense. 

The only legitimate tenet is "does this help me awaken, or not?"

Yep. It's the most serious students who get taken advantage of. They're willing to sacrifice their wordly integrity for that spiritual juice. "It's just my body, it's just my money, it's just my family, it's just my friends".

Edited December 24, 2022 by Carl-Richard

[Nilsi]

8 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

Yep. It's the most serious students who get taken advantage of. They're willing to sacrifice their wordly integrity for that spiritual juice. "It's just my body, it's just my money, it's just my family, it's just my friends".

It's the most serious student for whom spirituality will be more than just belief and hearsay.

Edited December 24, 2022 by Nilsi

[roopepa]

1 hour ago, zurew said:

"there is no one to be narcissistic and there is no one to manipulate" - thats how retarded is to say that there are no teachers.

That level of dismissiveness and inability to engage with the topic at hand is fabulous.

I'm not even talking some nondual "there is no you".

I'm talking about the atmosphere and "spiritual teacher" propaganda. No nonduality, just some good ol "let's not allow ourselves to be manipulated".

[roopepa]

1 hour ago, Carl-Richard said:

You're posting cringe right now.

I hope you don't talk to yourself the same way. Shame is bit of a troublemaker, and a sweet spot for manipulation you know.

[roopepa]

58 minutes ago, Moksha said:

There are certainly manipulative and narcissistic teachers

Yeah, cause often (especially on this forum)  the word "teacher" is manipulation.

It's belief in insecurity/unworthiness projected as teachers and students. Not always, but you smell the obvious poop when it's there.

[Ulax]

@Carl-Richard I like it.

I think ethics codes are great, though I think they are particularly useful when people can actually report practioners to an ethics board.

[Carl-Richard]

15 minutes ago, roopepa said:

I hope you don't talk to yourself the same way. Shame is bit of a troublemaker, and a sweet spot for manipulation you know.

There is no me. It's manipulation to state otherwise.

[Nilsi]

10 minutes ago, Ulax said:

@Carl-Richard I like it.

I think ethics codes are great, though I think they are particularly useful when people can actually report practioners to an ethics board.

You want to institutionalize awakening to moralize and punish truth? Sounds like you have some serious issues my man.

[Ulax]

@Nilsi Who took the jam out of your doughnut?
 

[Nilsi]

2 minutes ago, Ulax said:

@Nilsi Who took the jam out of your doughnut?
 

The death cult ethics board.

[Ulax]

@Nilsi I think you need a massage lad

[Carl-Richard]

1 minute ago, Nilsi said:

You want to institutionalize awakening to moralize and punish truth? Sounds like you have some serious issues my man.

The lack of up to date institutions is causing a lot of unnecessary suffering. The idea that spirituality has to be this hyper-individualistic "every man for himself" is a New Age fantasy and reminds me of libertarian brain rot.

[Someone here]

@roopepa @Carl-Richard

do we "need " gurus to become enlightened? 

I think The good news is we don’t. Not until you vet them, check them out, spend extended time with them, and see if you still feel like they are the perfect reflection of you and for you, long after the honeymoon period is over. Even then, many years down the road, you may find your benevolent, glowing, enlightened spiritual master to have hidden ulterior motive‘s, and even committed sexual atrocities, that you were not aware of.

I guess what @roopepa is saying The “good” news is there is no “you” or “spiritual master.” There is only the One Reality, and the whole purpose of working with a spiritual master is to find that out, to directly realize that.

Since there are not two, but One, the true guide is You, within You, as You and your Life.

@Carl-RichardIf you feel called to work with an outer spiritual teacher, take your time, be patient, spend time with many, and find the one that most feels like a reflection of you and your perfect path. Be open to the fact that you may have several spiritual masters in your lifetime, and be prepared that you may later find the master you felt so much kinship with in the beginning, now feels alien or even repulsive to you, much later.

[Nilsi]

Just now, Carl-Richard said:

The lack of up to date institutions is causing a lot of unnecessary suffering. The idea that spirituality has to be this hyper-individualistic "every man for himself" is a New Age fantasy and reminds me of libertarian brain rot.

That's not the point.

It's not "every man for himself." It's "truth is sacred and shouldn't be outlawed just because it hurts your feelings."

[Carl-Richard]

5 minutes ago, Someone here said:

@roopepa @Carl-Richard

do we "need " gurus to become enlightened? 

Tell me, in what other facet of life is seeking guidance looked upon with suspicion? Especially when it comes to something dangerous like spirituality, where you're deconstructing your sense of reality. It's quite ridiculous.

Edited December 24, 2022 by Carl-Richard

[Nilsi]

3 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

Tell me, in what other facet of life is seeking guidance looked upon with suspicion? Especially when it comes to something dangerous like spirituality, where you're deconstructing your sense of reality. It's quite ridiculous.

What is philosophy?

Actually, what is all of culture, if not this conversation?

Edited December 24, 2022 by Nilsi