Highly Submissive Romantic Relationships

[Devin]

My question is spurred by my curiosity from some discussion I've read in other posts, I think @NoSelfSelf has alluded to it a few times if you don't mind discussing it.

In relationships where the woman is highly submissive, do you as the man consider the woman a friend? Do you enjoy her as a friend?

I come from the new age equality era, and when I try to imagine this relationship I get the sense it is a cold one. I see how it would and has worked for millennia, it just feels like you'd be missing out to me.

[NoSelfSelf]

@Devin i dont get what are you even asking?

And you have to submit to yourself before she can submit to you, its not im saying she will be submissive to anyone its earned,you just dont get it for free...

[Devin]

12 minutes ago, NoSelfSelf said:

@Devin 

And you have to submit to yourself before she can submit to you, its not im saying she will be submissive to anyone its earned,you just dont get it for free...

Yeah, say you earned it, is she still like a friend to you? Do you enjoy her as a friend, not just her utility value and the sex. My view of romantic relationships is an intimate friendship, the man is more dominant but both work as a team in making decisions.

[NoSelfSelf]

@Devin Thats what im saying if you are a man she will want you to make a decisions if she sees you as a male she will want to make decisions..

Yeah when i earned my spot then she has to earn her spot and after she earned it she can talk about her emotions etc.  its all earned for her at that point where average guy just gives it all for free...

First i need to earn my spot for myself which is a tough process im laying only groundwork here not there yet ...

 

[Devin]

11 minutes ago, NoSelfSelf said:

@Devin Thats what im saying if you are a man she will want you to make a decisions if she sees you as a male she will want to make decisions..

Yeah when i earned my spot then she has to earn her spot and after she earned it she can talk about her emotions etc.  its all earned for her at that point where average guy just gives it all for free...

First i need to earn my spot for myself which is a tough process im laying only groundwork here not there yet ...

 

Do you discuss and decide decisions with her? To me without that it seems you would lose most of the sense of a friendship in the relationship.

[NoSelfSelf]

@Devin Im having decisions with myself on how my game gonna go and i communicate it  clearly ,she is fine to not follow that she can leave, otherwise im manipulating with lets decide it together because its always some hidden agenda...

[John Paul]

If she is submitting out of fear you will feel empty inside.

if she is submitting out of humility you are probably already in heaven.

[Devin]

18 minutes ago, NoSelfSelf said:

@Devin Im having decisions with myself on how my game gonna go and i communicate it  clearly ,she is fine to not follow that she can leave, otherwise im manipulating with lets decide it together because its always some hidden agenda...

Alright, I'm asking more in terms of an established relationship such as a marriage. Yeah early dating I think I completely agree. 

[Devin]

2 minutes ago, John Paul said:

if she is submitting out of humility you are probably already in heaven.

In a scenario where she essentially has no say? Where she will follow you, but voices concerns that go unconsidered? Eventually just stopping voicing concerns.

[Tyler Robinson]

Why is equality important? 

 

[John Paul]

@Devin there is no scenario where she essentially has no say unless I imagine an abusive situation. (She needs to get out now.)

if she is voicing the same concern more than once and the man is completely ignoring it then she really needs to consider who she is with (she needs to dump his ass). I think it’s important to note though that being passive-aggressive and dropping hints is not the same as legitimately communicating a concern clearly- especially in the example you are giving of marriage etc…. Clear communication should be established well before a relationship reaches a stage such as marriage IMO so none of this would realistically be a problem. 
 

edit: and if there was clear communication but now there isn’t then they need counseling or psychedelics or something- it takes two to communicate- the man and the woman 

Edited December 21, 2022 by John Paul

[Devin]

4 minutes ago, John Paul said:

@Devin there is no scenario where she essentially has no say unless I imagine an abusive situation. (She needs to get out now.)

if she is voicing the same concern more than once and the man is completely ignoring it then she really needs to consider who she is with (she needs to dump his ass). I think it’s important to note though that being passive-aggressive and dropping hints is not the same as legitimately communicating a concern clearly- especially in the example you are giving of marriage etc…. Clear communication should be established well before a relationship reaches a stage such as marriage IMO so none of this would realistically be a problem. 
 

edit: and if there was clear communication but now there isn’t then they need counseling or psychedelics or something- it takes two to communicate- the man and the woman 

Well you said submission from humility, that means submitting to her man's decisions, if she agrees with the decision that's not submission.

[Tyler Robinson]

It's one thing if I don't have a say in a relationship versus I don't want to decide much in a relationship and let the other person decide most of the time. 

I have been in highly submissive relationships where the guy decides and does everything without even involving me. I never felt like there was no friendship and I never felt that there was no equality. Or that it was abusive. 

As long as the decision was for my best and for his best, it didn't matter if he took the decision. 

I'm not equality obsessed in a relationship. If there's power struggle, I actually like it because I want him to have power. I want to see him do better than me so I can look up to him and admire him. It automatically makes me respect him more. 

I want to see him as a man who can do everything for both of us  and so I have no problem no worry if he makes decisions. I'll gladly give him all the power as long as he loves and protects me. 

I only care about love. 

[Devin]

1 minute ago, Tyler Robinson said:

It's one thing if I don't have a say in a relationship versus I don't want to decide much in a relationship and let the other person decide most of the time. 

I have been in highly submissive relationships where the guy decides and does everything without even involving me. I never felt like there was no friendship and I never felt that there was no equality. Or that it was abusive. 

As long as the decision was for my best and for his best, it didn't matter if he took the decision. 

I'm not equality obsessed in a relationship. If there's power struggle, I actually like it because I want him to have power. I want to see him do better than me so I can look up to him and admire him. It automatically makes me respect him more. 

I want to see him as a man who can do everything for both of us  and so I have no problem no worry if he makes decisions. I'll gladly give him all the power as long as he loves and protects me. 

I only care about love. 

I fully believe most women want that, despite saying otherwise, I'm more interested in the man's experience.

[Devin]

@John PaulMy understanding of what I've read on here, what is in question, is not just about a slight imbalance of relational power where the man is just the lead but still confers with the woman, I take what is being said as what you might expect to see in Taliban Afghanistan, the woman is highly submissive.

Edited December 21, 2022 by Devin

[Tyler Robinson]

I think submissive is a relationship where the woman submits to the power of the man. 

Whether it's good or bad is decided by the man's actions. 

A woman's submission is like food.

If the man eats the food, he is respecting it. If he trashes the food, he is abusing it.. 

So a good healthy non-abusive guy uses a woman's submission to create loyalty and trust and makes her vulnerable to connect and learn about her. 

And a bad unhealthy abusive guy uses a woman's submission to break her trust, manipulate her, see her as weak, destroy her physically and mentally, test her limit to how much she can take before she stands up, and use her Vulnerability to control her and against her and take her for granted and use her to his will and reduce her to a slave. 

 

Edited December 21, 2022 by Tyler Robinson

[Devin]

14 minutes ago, Tyler Robinson said:

I think submissive is a relationship where the woman submits to the power of the man. 

Whether it's good or bad is decided by the man's actions. 

A woman's submission is like food.

If the man eats the food, he is respecting it. If he trashes the food, he is abusing it.. 

So a good healthy non-abusive guy uses a woman's submission to create loyalty and trust and makes her vulnerable to connect and learn about her. 

And a bad unhealthy abusive guy uses a woman's submission to break her trust, manipulate her, see her as weak, destroy her physically and mentally, test her limit to how much she can take before she stands up, and use her Vulnerability to control her and against her and take her for granted and use her to his will and reduce her to a slave. 

 

Yeah I'm more concerned with whether the man gets anything more out of the relationship than just the utility value of having a submissive woman. I don't see it being a friendship, more like a relationship of a younger kid following a much older kid, or a boss and employee.

Edited December 21, 2022 by Devin

[Tyler Robinson]

7 minutes ago, Devin said:

Yeah I'm more concerned with whether the man gets anything more out of the relationship than just the utility value of having a submissive woman. I don't see it being a friendship, more like a relationship of a younger kid following a much older kid.

The man loves the woman and finds happiness in fulfilling her. He is bonding with her. You're acting as though he is just a provider or an ATM machine and reducing the woman to a kid who only keeps demanding. 

You have a bias against such relationships and that's why you don't see them as of much value to either party. 

These relationships are just as valuable as any other. The man is simply doing more than what average men do, and yes, it's not that the woman cannot give him emotional support when he needs it. 

If a man is already confident and fulfilled in his man's role, for what reason in this world would he look up to the woman for any advice. What can a woman do that he cannot himself? 

The same applies to the women as well. But let's not bullshit here and assume that relationships are all about parity. How else are you going to generate attraction and polarity in a relationship? There should be some meat for the woman to gorge on? She is not marrying her brother, is she? She is marrying a man precisely because of the value he has to offer. If she can do everything he does and is completely similar to him in every possible way, where's the polarity and magnetism to hold them together. Why will she even need a man? Sorry but that's how feminists think? A woman wants to respect a man. Respect is earned when you see someone being and doing better than you. This is human psyche and if you didn't understand this, you didn't understand human psyche. 

Your are talking about stuff that weak men talk about. They rely on the woman and the woman is soon tired of it unless she is the kind of woman who likes to be the boss. And those relationships emasculate men and look trashy and weak, the man being more like a servant than a leader, he turns into a bauble for her to carry around. What is that even, where a man has no growth and the woman is simply draining him dry for her needs and uses him as repairman/agent /ATM machine to feed narcissistic stupid egoic needs like Paris Hilton carrying her puppy around. 

 

Edited December 21, 2022 by Tyler Robinson

[Devin]

24 minutes ago, Tyler Robinson said:

The man loves the woman and finds happiness in fulfilling her. He is bonding with her. You're acting as though he is just a provider or an ATM machine and reducing the woman to a kid who only keeps demanding. 

You have a bias against such relationships and that's why you don't see them as of much value to either party. 

These relationships are just as valuable as any other. The man is simply doing more than what average men do, and yes, it's not that the woman cannot give him emotional support when he needs it. 

If a man is already confident and fulfilled in his man's role, for what reason in this world would he look up to the woman for any advice. What can a woman do that he cannot himself? 

The same applies to the women as well. But let's not bullshit here and assume that relationships are all about parity. How else are you going to generate attraction and polarity in a relationship? There should be some meat for the woman to gorge on? She is not marrying her brother, is she? She is marrying a man precisely because of the value he has to offer. If she can do everything he does and is completely similar to him in every possible way, where's the polarity and magnetism to hold them together. Why will she even need a man? Sorry but that's how feminists think? A woman wants to respect a man. Respect is earned when you see someone being and doing better than you. This is human psyche and if you didn't understand this, you didn't understand human psyche. 

Your are talking about stuff that weak men talk about. They rely on the woman and the woman is soon tired of it unless she is the kind of woman who likes to be the boss. And those relationships emasculate men and look trashy and weak, the man being more like a servant than a leader, he turns into a bauble for her to carry around. What is that even, where a man has no growth and the woman is simply draining him dry for her needs and uses him as repairman/agent /ATM machine to feed narcissistic stupid egoic needs like Paris Hilton carrying her puppy around. 

 

The sole provider part isn't what bothers me at all, I don't see where I alluded to that at all. Just wondering if it is a friendship, I don't see how it possibly could be. I think it's clear the man makes out more in that type of relationship than woman, it's not like he would buy what she wants, she'd just be a food vending machine and a hole. Buying her fancy stuff he doesn't care about would be him being the submissive one, he'd tell her what to wear and how to act.

Edited December 22, 2022 by Devin

[Tyler Robinson]

22 minutes ago, Devin said:

she'd just be a food vending machine and a hole.

This is because you don't see value in companionship and intimacy. 

You think that companionship can only exist when a man derives some benefit. That's a selfish mindset. 

Case 1 - A man who is abundant doesn't care what he is going to get in a relationship. He cares more about how he makes his companion feel and enjoys her happiness and makes her happiness his. 

Case 2 - A man who is not abundant is constantly trying to leverage a relationship with arguments like —"what can I get in return if I'm offering so much?" 

A woman is never a hole and a food vending machine. This is simply not possible at all whatever maybe the dynamic of a relationship. No true man will ever see a woman as a hole and a food Vending machine. This attitude can only come from a man who has never respected a woman for being a woman. He sees her as an object that should fulfill his needs. Seeing a woman as a hole and a food vending machine is the highest patriarchal form of objectification of women and not a sign of a true man 

Case 1 is an Alpha man

 

Case 2 is a non Alpha man

A woman doesn't need to do anything to prove her worth. She is a container. She is a bowl.. A vessel of joy. 

A man is the builder. He is a the penis. He is the seed. 

That's why  the vagina is shaped like a bowl and the penis is shaped like a serpent or a giver, a hose. 

The man finds joy in the companionship of a woman and the woman finds joy in the Alpha nature of a man, in his strength and protection. 

Together they create a perfect relationship of joy and magnetism. A beautiful friendship. 

If you judge a friend, you are no longer a friend 

If you judge a woman, you are no longer her friend. 

Alpha men don't see the value in a woman, they first seek value in themselves and then automatically attract women who see this value as well. 

The reason why you see women as a hole and a food vendor is because you're simply not connected to the feminine. You are unable to cherish the feminine. You are unable to value the feminine or understand the feminine. You don't drown into her pleasure. You don't submit to her. You just look at her superficially. 

A man who is connected to the feminine sees value in her femininity and dives into her blissful state. Is attached to her like a child is to a woman's breasts.