Indonesia Bans Premarital Sex

[kieranperez]

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2022/12/05/asia/indonesia-new-code-passed-sex-cohabitation-intl-hnk/index.html

[Leo Gura]

Classic Blue move.

[integral]

“Under the version passed Tuesday, sex outside marriage carries a potential one-year prison term though there a restrictions on who can lodge a formal complaint. For example, the parents of children who are cohabitating before marriage have the authority to report them. 

As well as introducing new offenses, the code also expands on existing laws and punishments. Blasphemy laws have increased from “one to six provisions” and can now lead to a maximum five-year prison sentence, according to a draft document.”

 

[Danioover9000]

@kieranperez

6 hours ago, kieranperez said:

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2022/12/05/asia/indonesia-new-code-passed-sex-cohabitation-intl-hnk/index.html

   Good for them! Even though this is a classic blue action, I don't think this is too regressive. There could be some explanations to this rule being implemented, maybe to curb down rates of population growth?

[Danioover9000]

@integral

3 minutes ago, integral said:

“Under the version passed Tuesday, sex outside marriage carries a potential one-year prison term though there a restrictions on who can lodge a formal complaint. For example, the parents of children who are cohabitating before marriage have the authority to report them. 

As well as introducing new offenses, the code also expands on existing laws and punishments. Blasphemy laws have increased from “one to six provisions” and can now lead to a maximum five-year prison sentence, according to a draft document.”

 

   Are there some benefits and justifications for them implementing this rule?

[hyruga]

More people having premarital sex and not getting married.

[Sucuk Ekmek]

This is not Blue. In any country*(if such a thing still exist)  you can't be a lawmaker or  technocrat  with  your Blue absolutist ideas. This is heavy materialism abusing leftover blue values. Are you messing with sex in the year of our Lord 2022 ?  It's like Apple scanning your device for C.P.

Sounds promising !

[Peter-Andre]

That is highly concerning. Didn't realize Indonesia was so conservative. I'm also amazed that this was voted on unanimously.

[Danioover9000]

@Peter-Andre

6 hours ago, Peter-Andre said:

That is highly concerning. Didn't realize Indonesia was so conservative. I'm also amazed that this was voted on unanimously.

   Actually Indonesia is one of few countries, regarding it's geographically location, hosts a diverse range of tribes and cultures that contain ALL the Spiral Dynamics stages, from the native tribes that live in 3,000 plus islands, to Singapore, and every region in between, like Jakarta, Bandung, Sunatra, and many other places. Similarly to India, but very tropical and way more exotic plants and animals. Indonesia being mostly conservative minded despite the SD stages is not surprising given tbe history it has, and increases in population. Also, Indonesia has a mixture of religions like Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism, Christianity, and depending on where you go, you'll find more or less.

[Danioover9000]

@Sucuk Ekmek

11 hours ago, Sucuk Ekmek said:

This is not Blue. In any country*(if such a thing still exist)  you can't be a lawmaker or  technocrat  with  your Blue absolutist ideas. This is heavy materialism abusing leftover blue values. Are you messing with sex in the year of our Lord 2022 ?  It's like Apple scanning your device for C.P.

Sounds promising !

   Of course countries still exist, and so do stage blue groups, as they makeup 75% of the world. This is nothing new, nor worth being sarcastic for. I'm just guessing here, but there may be legitimate reasons why they want to enforce no premarital sex, maybe their population is large and they don't want children born out of wedlock. Maybe it's the larger percentage of religions there such as Islam, Christianity and Buddhism they are basung their decision in. There's not much we don't know about the current situation.

[King Merk]

What a bunch of cock blockers 

[Danioover9000]

@King Merk

5 hours ago, King Merk said:

What a bunch of cock blockers 

   Better than paying child support for unintended pregnancy out of wedlock. Oh, and the stigma of being the child born out of wedlock is strong.

   Keep in mind how Indonesia's government is similar yet different to western styles of government.

[Danioover9000]

   Best to do your research and study, and even go vacationing to Indonesia. You better understand why the majority are conservatively minded, yet also be exposed to a lot of paradoxical ways of thinking about their world and the world in general. A news article ain't enough to give you the rest of the picture.

[Sucuk Ekmek]

7 hours ago, Danioover9000 said:

@Sucuk Ekmek

   Of course countries still exist, and so do stage blue groups, as they makeup 75% of the world.

Yeah, remnants of it still do but I think more or less we are all living in Anywhere City, USA.  

 

8 hours ago, Danioover9000 said:

@Sucuk Ekmek

    This is nothing new, nor worth being sarcastic for. 

I am trying to be realistic.

 

8 hours ago, Danioover9000 said:

@Sucuk Ekmek

    I'm just guessing here, but there may be legitimate reasons why they want to enforce no premarital sex

I also guess here and there, for me Trump has legimate reasons too. But concerning Indonesia now that sounds fishy. I approve no premartial sex but enforcing it is another thing. 

 

8 hours ago, Danioover9000 said:

@Sucuk Ekmek

    maybe their population is large and they don't want children born out of wedlock. 

Yeah, maybe they don't want new products to tinker with. It's all speculation, a question of good will or bad will. See I am very Blue concerning good or bad will. 

[JuliusCaesar]

In the overwhelming majority of the world, these kind of strong blue type values are normal. Hell, even in my country we have states where anal sex is banned. The fact we have so little awareness of the collective human species ethics and values demonstrates how disconnected Americans are with the rest of the world.

[LordFall]

@Danioover9000 Doubt there's a legitimate reason for it, usually, these ideologies are conscious enough to be based on rationality; it's' generally just superstition. 

I wonder if this could lead Bali to be a bit more sovereign politically as they're generally much more liberal than mainland Indonesia AFAIK. 

I think perhaps some of it has to do with sexpats/sex tourism, I doubt that the local men are generally fond of this concept. It's interesting how the law is being written though, someone related to you has to report you for it to be considered a crime. So if tourists fuck it's fine and if you fuck a local whose family approves of it it's also fine. It hinders LGBTQ relationships too, as long as their family are disapproving of it.

It's like community policing which I don't know if it's good or bad.

[JuliusCaesar]

8 hours ago, Danioover9000 said:

   Best to do your research and study, and even go vacationing to Indonesia. You better understand why the majority are conservatively minded, yet also be exposed to a lot of paradoxical ways of thinking about their world and the world in general. A news article ain't enough to give you the rest of the picture.

Well said, foreign countries in general have a tendency not to conform to the expectations of Americans. Especially the ones that don't speak English. English speaking countries like the Canada and England are so similar to us culturally that you usually won't be too surprised by it. Of course, there can even be room for faux pawing and awkwardness in exchanges between for instance between Brits and Americans. 

[JuliusCaesar]

5 hours ago, LordFall said:

Doubt there's a legitimate reason for it, usually, these ideologies are conscious enough to be based on rationality; it's' generally just superstition. 

Studies show that couples who wait until marriage to lose their virginity tend to remain married longer. Which obviously indicates that such couples are likely to have a better relationship. Which makes them better more loving parents, which of course makes for a stronger society as a whole.

 

But as Americans, we don't like the government telling us what to do. So, when we hear about something like this it seems backwards and overly draconian.

[something_else]

8 minutes ago, JuliusCaesar said:

Studies show that couples who wait until marriage to lose their virginity tend to remain married longer. Which obviously indicates that such couples are likely to have a better relationship. Which makes them better more loving parents, which of course makes for a stronger society as a whole.

It doesn't mean they have a better relationship, nor that they are better parents. People who remain virgins until marriage are likely also religious and part of cultures who will force you to stay married whether or not you are happy and satisfied with each other.

Unhappy couples who are forced to stay together do not make good parents.

[LordFall]

 

33 minutes ago, JuliusCaesar said:

Studies show that couples who wait until marriage to lose their virginity tend to remain married longer. Which obviously indicates that such couples are likely to have a better relationship. Which makes them better more loving parents, which of course makes for a stronger society as a whole.

 

But as Americans, we don't like the government telling us what to do. So, when we hear about something like this it seems backwards and overly draconian.

That's not at all what that implies, it's a correlation, not causation. Meaning that there could be like @something_else pointed out religious coercion to not get divorced or my favorite explanation being that it leaves you with more options so you're more inclined to get out of a stale/toxic relationship. 

There is also the point that it's actually irrelevant if it's better or not, you are entitled to autonomy and to make your own decisions. I can't barge into your house and stop you from drinking a beer even if maybe hypothetically it'd be better if you didn't.