How To Improve Actualized.org - Mega-Thread

[Optimized Life]

On 28/11/2022 at 10:48 AM, mmKay said:

Maybe add some sort of social credit system

Yuck. 

Edited December 11, 2022 by Optimized Life

[mmKay]

Add "heavy metal detox" To " Start here" Section. 

[OBEler]

New moderator: chatgpt bot. 

The threadmaker should be trained to be bot friendly and asks questions with a marker at the end of his Post so that the bot can recognize this part and can answer this. If he wants an answer from bot of course 

 

 

 

 

 

[Tyler Robinson]

Making an Actualized.org app is like the worst idea in my opinion. It will be very buggy, slow and loaded. It will become a joke. 

The website itself slows down often. Making an app will totally ruin it. 

It's just good as it is. 

 

[Gesundheit2]

6 minutes ago, Tyler Robinson said:

Making an Actualized.org app is like the worst idea in my opinion. It will be very buggy, slow and loaded. It will become a joke. 

The website itself slows down often. Making an app will totally ruin it.

That would mainly depend on the developers who would make the app. If they know what they're doing, there wouldn't be that many bugs, and if there would be any bugs, they would be able to fix them easily.

The website slowness is probably a server issue which would have the same effect on a mobile or a desktop app. The server probably needs an upgrade or something, and this will probably cost Leo some more money on a monthly rate.

[Tyler Robinson]

10 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

That would mainly depend on the developers who would make the app. If they know what they're doing, there wouldn't be that many bugs, and if there would be any bugs, they would be able to fix them easily.

The website slowness is probably a server issue which would have the same effect on a mobile or a desktop app. The server probably needs an upgrade or something, and this will probably cost Leo some more money on a monthly rate.

Actually maintaining an app also needs money. No? Research on that next time. 

Maintaining an app is not cheap at all. Developers demand a ton of money for that. 

And now please don't suggest some member should do this for free. Generally freelance app work is shitty in quality. 

Plus this website is being maintained by Invision  community that maintains ethical guidelines and standards necessary for forum that I won't talk about in much detail because it goes against confidential privacy rules. 

The same cannot be said of some low pay  grade random app developers. 

Many apps have actually gone to shit due to breaking App framework guidelines. Look at the complaints Google play store receives - a million. 

 

The surest way of totally destroying this website is to make an app. You have little idea. 

Leo already knows about the app market - he knows its prone to unethical business, that's why he doesn't do it. 

 

 

Edited December 16, 2022 by Tyler Robinson

[Gesundheit2]

@Tyler Robinson It wouldn't need maintenance beyond the initial release and developer support. It's just a simple forum app, not a super complex corporate app like Facebook or something.

[Tyler Robinson]

5 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

@Tyler Robinson It wouldn't need maintenance beyond the initial release and developer support. It's just a simple forum app, not a super complex corporate app like Facebook or something.

That's just a joke. Every app needs a lot of maintenance. Even simple apps. And like I said there's an ethics issue. Why and how would you trust an app developer? How do you know they won't break privacy guidelines for their own personal purposes? 

App developers are notoriously known for scamming people/clients. 

 

[Gesundheit2]

Some amateur devs might be like that, but most professionals are wise enough to not risk their reputation. I'm a professional web developer but I'm still junior to mid-level. I could create a similar forum on the web with a similar functionality, but it would take me more time and I will likely make more mistakes than an expert/senior developer, so there will likely be more bugs in my production and they will be harder to fix and the site will be generally harder to debug, update, and add features to. But that would not make me a scam, just not the best in the market of web devs, yet of course.

[Tyler Robinson]

2 minutes ago, KH2 said:

Guess what, great apps are still being made constantly, and will continue to be made.

Only by trusted companies that charge a heft. That's the whole point. 

 

[Tyler Robinson]

19 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

I'm a professional web developer

Whats the guarantee of your profession? If I want to hire your service, why should I trust you? Anyway I can know if I can trust you other than actually risking my trust? 

I've been approached by many devs who talked about hacking for a minimum fee and I said a big NO. 

Leo works on high integrity. The last thing he would want is someone who breaks the very foundation of his organization - integrity. 

 

Edited December 16, 2022 by Tyler Robinson

[Gesundheit2]

12 minutes ago, Tyler Robinson said:

Whats the guarantee of your profession? If I want to hire your service, why should I trust you? Anyway I can know if I can trust you other than actually risking my trust? 

Mainly the company that I work for. And/or if I'm on some freelancing site, the admins of the site.

12 minutes ago, Tyler Robinson said:

I've been approached by many devs who talked about hacking for a minimum fee and I said a big NO.

Random devs are risky. There are no guarantees.

[Tyler Robinson]

18 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

Mainly the company that I work for. And/or if I'm on some freelancing site, the admins of the site.

Random devs are risky. There are no guarantees.

My whole point is that you can hire a company to do the job instead of a person. Having a single person contract like the "cup of coffee" developers is very risky. Through a company, it's much safer although quite expensive. The company bears all the risk. If I make a contract with a person, even though he is affiliated with a company, I'm taking a risk if he is working independent of the company at low charge, since the company is not involved in the contract, they are absolved of any responsibility. Hiring companies to do your job is always expensive versus hiring a single person no matter the level of expertise. I've never known companies that charge low fees for app development and maintenance, so far not in my personal experience dealing with the app market. 

If there's a company that charges low, I would still be skeptical of their overall reputation because maintaining a company of software developers is not a cheap thing at all, most high quality highly trustworthy software developers ask a high pay, so to maintain a consistent supply of these developers has to be a pricey thing. Most software developers monkey jump from one company to another to get higher pays, so it's extremely hard to keep them unless it's a high end biz company. Which basically means high costs to the client. 

It's a lose lose situation either way. 

 

Edited December 16, 2022 by Tyler Robinson

[Gesundheit2]

@Tyler Robinson Hiring a freelance developer is a great alternative, especially if your needs are simple like this. It can be a lot cheaper as cuts a lot of company costs, because it connects the developer and client directly on a platform that charges minimal fees for providing the market environment and moderation services.

Edited December 16, 2022 by Gesundheit2

[Tyler Robinson]

@Gesundheit2 I'm not sure if the app can be made available for free. I'm not sure about the hidden costs like hosting the app on Google Play Store or Apple Store. I've seen most apps being pay-for-play or pay-for-subscription so I'm assuming they are some hidden costs apart from just developing an app. 

Making an app is more like a business unless you are providing the app for free. For example my Twitter app is totally free. But that's because the costs of the app are born by a large corporation like Twitter, they won't need subscription fees to cover up costs. Most small businesses need a paid subscriptions. 

Leo is providing this forum for free which is already a great great privilege to all the people here. It's a service not a business. I guess if he has to make an app, he might have to charge people for a subscription. It can surely become a lucrative business, this is something that Sam Harris did with his meditation app, but that's because Sam Harris wants to run a business off meditation and spirituality. Leo is not looking for making money off the advice he gives here which is just the greatest free gift ever. 

I don't know if the app can be completely free. Maybe not. I'm just happy that this forum is totally free of cost to me. 

 

[Gesundheit2]

8 minutes ago, Tyler Robinson said:

@Gesundheit2 I'm not sure if the app can be made available for free. I'm not sure about the hidden costs like hosting the app on Google Play Store or Apple Store. I've seen most apps being pay-for-play or pay-for-subscription so I'm assuming they are some hidden costs apart from just developing an app.

I don't know a lot about developing mobile or desktop apps. But I can say with confidence that there would not be much hidden costs in this case, if any at all. The server hosting the platform is already up and running. The user interface is already designed, so there is no need for a UI/UX designer.

Quote

Making an app is more like a business unless you are providing the app for free. For example my Twitter app is totally free. But that's because the costs of the app are born by a large corporation like Twitter, they won't need subscription fees to cover up costs. Most small businesses need a paid subscriptions. 

Leo is providing this forum for free which is already a great great privilege to all the people here. It's a service not a business. I guess if he has to make an app, he might have to charge people for a subscription. It can surely become a lucrative business, this is something that Sam Harris did with his meditation app, but that's because Sam Harris wants to run a business off meditation and spirituality. Leo is not looking for making money off the advice he gives here which is just the greatest free gift ever. 

I don't know if the app can be completely free. Maybe not. I'm just happy that this forum is totally free of cost to me.

Here's an idea: Tell ChatGPT to replicate this forum in code. Tell it that you want a mobile app. Then sell that app to Leo, or give it for free.

[Tyler Robinson]

33 minutes ago, KH2 said:

@Tyler Robinson

 @Tyler Robinson 

Monthly subscribtion app with Discord-like chat? I'd take that

Another coffee please

You might have to buy your own coffee, because the day you host a monthly subscription for this forum  is the day you lose all the freeloaders who spend their time here which is the majority populace. 

Half the population is broke or unemployed or looking how to make some money. You think that they would pay monthly for an app when they don't even regularly visit this place. 

Yea lol, your strategy is a sure shot way of losing half the forum members. 

The other half will be lost to splintering off by random Discord groups. 

Kudos to an empty forum.  enjoy your coffee. Lol. 

Your idea is like charging homeless people to sleep on the streets. Brilliant!!!

I think the best thing I love about this website is that it's for free. Leo couldn't have been more charitable. 

On the flip side if you assume that you are going to improve the quality of this place by charging people, you also have to be ready to morally compromise with the fact that you will lose a lot of people who are a part of this community and who genuinely need help. You might have an improved more competitive forum I agree, but you're also causing a subset of people to lose the benefits of free help, if that sits right with you. There's very few stuff out there which is both good as well as free and you have no idea how valuable it is for people who desperately need help, maybe they need a place like this more than you do. 

There are loads of wonderful paid places on the internet that you can pay for and explore. 

Maybe leave a few places free for the homeless and the destitute. 

I don't know if Leo's decision was out of charity or business or both, but either way it is hugely beneficial. 

 

Edited December 16, 2022 by Tyler Robinson

[Tyler Robinson]

10 minutes ago, KH2 said:

and would be something of an elite enlightened society?

That's exactly the evil Leo doesn't want. Leo is not Sam Harris and that's why Leo is the OG of free spiritual communities. And that's why people love Leo. 

Love love love love Leo. Yay!!! 

 

 

Edited December 16, 2022 by Tyler Robinson

[the_void_of_chaos]

@Tyler Robinson @Gesundheit2  You can use Upwork for hiring freelance developer. Hire a professional with good rating, submit the money in escrow...if you don't like the work, tell the dev to fix it and if you still don't like it, your money is safe, you don't have to pay. Also, there are no hidden charges when submitting an app to Google Play Store or Apple App Store. The developer just needs an account (which obviously he has), complete the app, show it to you and if you like it then you can approve for submitting for review. The app store will review the app. When it's approved (note that app store will know if the app has any hidden features or virus in which case it won't get approved), you can create your own developer account which costs ~25 dollars for android and 100 dollars for iOS and transfer the app to your account. The source code will also be included so if in future your app needs some changes, you can hire the same person or some other freelancer. Also, freelancers don't cost much...if you want to hire a professional freelancer, it will cost ~500-1000 dollars. Also, there are agencies you can work with...high reputation, senior developers. But given the site's UI, I don't think it will be a great idea to build an app for it.

[Tyler Robinson]

 

1 minute ago, the_void_of_chaos said:

@Tyler Robinson @Gesundheit2  You can use Upwork for hiring freelance developer. Hire a professional with good rating, submit the money in escrow...if you don't like the work, tell the dev to fix it and if you still don't like it, your money is safe, you don't have to pay. Also, there are no hidden charges when submitting an app to Google Play Store or Apple App Store. The developer just needs an account (which obviously he has), complete the app, show it to you and if you like it then you can approve for submitting for review. The app store will review the app. When it's approved (note that app store will know if the app has any hidden features or virus in which case it won't get approved), you can create your own developer account which costs ~25 dollars for android and 100 dollars for iOS and transfer the app to your account. The source code will also be included so if in future your app needs some changes, you can hire the same person or some other freelancer. Also, freelancers don't cost much...if you want to hire a professional freelancer, it will cost ~500-1000 dollars. Also, there are agencies you can work with...high reputation, senior developers. But given the site's UI, I don't think it will be a great idea to build an app for it.

Well that's good. I'll leave it to Leo and watch his opinions on this.