Ramification of Non-Duality Paradigm vs. Jesus Paradigm

[PepperBlossoms]

12 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

You can certainly explain those things without invoking a heaven, no? 

Sure.  Yes.

[Carl-Richard]

5 minutes ago, PepperBlossoms said:

With their mouth/words.  But yeah I am not them so I can't verify it nor can I verify that you exist or I exist or any of this is happening or if everything is fake and this whole reality is nothing.  It's just that believing that reality is imagined wasn't working when I was super sad and felt like I had no reason to live.  Believing that there IS LOVE was more helpful.  But I am still kinda feeling like, well even if there is a Heaven or Hell, what is the point of that?  But I would have to wait till I die to find out.

I've heard of near-death experiences which talk about heaven and hell, but the descriptions are less literal than what the Bible proposes. Nevertheless, I don't fundamentally dispute the possible existence of other realms. Seeing what DMT can do, nothing is impossible

[How to be wise]

@PepperBlossoms You should read Bart Ehrman. The historical Jesus was as far away from enlightenment as you can get. He was a Jewish apocalyptic preacher, basically teaching that the world was about to end. 

There’s nothing wrong with reinventing him as an enlightenment teacher, but you should remember it isn’t true. 

[PepperBlossoms]

@Leo Gura

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

God is HERE, NOW. The future is imaginary.

How do you KNOW this with zero doubt?  If the future is imaginary, how is it that psychic/premonition stuff happens?  

[PepperBlossoms]

21 minutes ago, How to be wise said:

You should read Bart Ehrman. The historical Jesus was as far away from enlightenment as you can get. He was a Jewish apocalyptic preacher, basically teaching that the world was about to end. 

There’s nothing wrong with reinventing him as an enlightenment teacher, but you should remember it isn’t true. 

@How to be wise I guess there is the possibility that this universe exists forever but also the possibility that it did have a beginning and could have an end.  Both are possible... 

I guess it could be he's super far away from enlightenment, or it could be he's not and he's accurate.

It's like two sides of the coin and you just pick one to be on.

[Leo Gura]

59 minutes ago, PepperBlossoms said:

@Leo Gura

How do you KNOW this with zero doubt?

That's what Awakening reveals.

Quote

If the future is imaginary, how is it that psychic/premonition stuff happens?  

They are imagined, just like everything else.

I am not saying you cannot be psychic.

Edited November 1, 2022 by Leo Gura

[StarStruck]

There is not 1 Jezus paradigm thought. The catholic one is very different than the gnostic one for example. 

[PepperBlossoms]

6 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

That's what Awakening reveals.

They are imagined, just like everything else.

I am not saying you cannot be psychic.

@Leo GuraBut how do you know you are awakened?

What if you've imagined that stuff is imagined but it's not?

2 hours ago, StarStruck said:

There is not 1 Jezus paradigm thought. The catholic one is very different than the gnostic one for example. 

@StarStruck True.

 

I guess another one is, well, how do you explain someone having died and then come back to life for awhile and then people seeing them resurrect? And how do you explain that evil spirits are reported to have a negative reaction to religious things?  You would think that evil spirits would have ZERO reaction to religious things if religion was fake and that it would have no power over them.  How do you know that most of you on this forum aren't being invaded by evil spirits right now which is causing doubt that this is a possibility and they don't want you to think that way because they don't want you to believe because that is how they operate?

Okay, I could say that someone coming back to life was witchcraft or that seeing someone being resurrected was a massive group hallucination.  But then what, the priest and the people experiencing the evil spirits are hallucinating the entire time?

I guess my thinking was like, if evil exists, love exists too and love exists via God and evil exists via Satan.

I guess another one, why would people report being able to see angels and why would angels bother wanting to do good things and why would people report being able to see demonic things and why would people report them doing bad things? 

It could be that people who do evil things aren't necessarily low conscious or selfish but rather have demons leading the way.  This could be possible and shouldn't be discarded as not if one was wanting to be studious and check out every possibility for reality possible.

Another one is, do you find that you have hate and doubt inside for religious people and if so, could that be demons inspiring that hate?

I guess for me, I was wanting to check out every possible paradigm for reality and was even writing a book and reading books about different paradigms and I was acting like each one at the time was absolutely true in order to do that and that is also how I got here... whereas if I would have explored this like it was fake the entire time, I wouldn't have gotten here at all.

Edited November 1, 2022 by PepperBlossoms

[PepperBlossoms]

@Pudgey

10 hours ago, Pudgey said:

Jesus paradigm: Greatly impacted by Fear of God, Fear of Death and Fear of Love.

They are more attuned to fear, which makes them controlling and conservative.

Love is death. 

What if the fear is legit though because they are aware of what is actually happening whereas for the others that don't believe, yes they have no fear, but they also are blind to what is going on?

10 hours ago, Pudgey said:

Entities do exist and the paranormal is far more radical than Jesus paradigm. 

Entities are also playing games with you to further allude you from realizing you are God. 

There are certain states in consciousness that will actually allow you to possess dominance over spiritual entities - but not guaranteed to reach. 

The bible is also bullshit when it comes to understanding paranormal and is heavily influenced by duality (evil/good). You can also break these dualities when you come to realize that entities can be chaotic neutral, amorale and have varying degrees of existence. 

If you want to understand paranormal, take Ayahuasca or straight DMT.

These bible dualities are playing games with you. 

Why would entities want to play games with me to trick me from realizing I am god?  So you are saying the demons want you to think you are separate and the loving entities want you to think you are one being with God... but still sounds like a combination of non-duality and Christianity then... but I guess the difference is whether God is oneness or God is a separate thing and what God really is.  I guess I could see that.  I feel like reality is a fight between oneness and separation and there is conflict there.

Wow having dominance over an entity... that's crazy.

I guess the book I was reading was saying, doing stuff like psychedelics, ouija boards, astral projection, witchcraft, etc. could allow evil entities in... and those entities could trick you.

So it is hard to say what really is evil and what is not... and one just has to go with what they want.

I guess another one is that my friend's friend's mom died and she visited her after her death and said, 'I gotta go, I have a bunch of work to do in Heaven' and so that is another example and well why would she say that?  But I guess one could say that that too was a hallucination.

....

[PepperBlossoms]

@PeaceOut96

10 hours ago, PeaceOut96 said:

All of what you wrote is imaginary. It's filled with dualistic thinking and it got a religious overtone. Evil is not what you think it is. The duality of love/good and evil its purely illusory, evil does not exist at the highest level. Everything is already God, Gods will and Absolute Perfection. Now its our job to realize that Tune your self towards God and be filled with Love and Beauty. Awaken! Or just keep dreaming your illusory dreams. Up to you. Peace out. 

I guess it is really hard to say what is and is not imaginary.  It is hard to say if good/evil are imaginary or if they are legit.

It is hard to say xyz is real and abc is not.

I guess that is why whatever we believe in, whether A or B, it is going to be a belief.

I had thought evil was just relative to whatever hurt me.  Yes.

But with religion, evil is different.

That topic of evil is hard for me.

Like I had thought, oh killing animals and trees is evil.  But in the religious paradigm, its not evil.

So that is still confusing for me.

I think in the religious paradigm, it is partly, 'we are not of this world' and therefore, stuff like animals and trees may belong to this world and it could be we don't and so it is not necessarily evil to kill things of this world.

Whereas in the non-dual paradigm, 'we are of this world and this world only' and so everything that hurts stuff for this world is evil. Or one could say in the non-dual paradigm divisions are made up and so evil is a made up concept.

I feel like its also tough because the non-dual paradigm makes it where one is more likely to hate stuff that is bad whereas the religious paradigm may be more open to loving bad stuff...

I guess this also makes survival tricky.  It is hard to survive when you can't eat meat or kill trees or kill anything really and so it is super hard to exist and have a job in the non-dual paradigm because, oh look my job cuts down trees! Or oh look my job saves humans who kill the planet!  I can't support humans because I am killing stuff.  Whereas in the religious paradigm, it is okay to do those things and so having a job is much easier.

Edited November 1, 2022 by PepperBlossoms

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, PepperBlossoms said:

@Leo GuraBut how do you know you are awakened?

What if you've imagined that stuff is imagined but it's not?

You are God, sweetie. Everything is imagined by you.

It's time to stop playing games and Wake Up.

There is no such thing as evil. Everything you call evil is Good, you're just too unconscious to see it.

Edited November 1, 2022 by Leo Gura

[StarStruck]

22 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

You are God, sweetie. Everything is imagined by you.

It's time to stop playing games and Wake Up.

There is no such thing as evil. Everything you call evil is Good, you're just too unconscious to see it.

Everything is Ain Soph Aur. 

[Gesundheit2]

Go to the nearest chipmunk and ask it how you should live your life. You will only find the absolute truth in the chipmunk paradigm.

[PepperBlossoms]

57 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

You are God, sweetie. Everything is imagined by you.

It's time to stop playing games and Wake Up.

There is no such thing as evil. Everything you call evil is Good, you're just too unconscious to see it.

@Leo Gura Okay so if I get a thought in my head to push someone off a cliff or strangle someone's neck just because I feel like it or thought it up, that's Good.. I guess I am just open to the possibility that a demon could have inspired that.  I guess it could just be the universe doing random things and not necessarily thinking about the consequences and loving everything so much it is willing to do that stuff.  

I get the paradigm of, the only stuff that exists is what I am directly seeing in this exact visual view, directly hearing, directly touching.  I have experienced that one.  That there is nothing behind me, that I see these hands and legs and no face.  That there was no past or future.  That if I close my eyes, I see that the 3D visual world no longer exists and if I have no more ears, the 3D sound world no longer exists and if I take away the other senses, the world is gone.. but I still have a brain and it can still dream stuff up.

I get that one.  It's super terrifying.  I guess I don't want to live in that one.  I don't want it to be that I am all alone, or that I don't even exist and I am imagining myself.  I want y'all to exist.  I want this chair or that potato to exist.  So sure maybe I am god wanting all of this to exist and I want to exist and I as god don't even understand myself. But also, if I am god, I don't feel like I have any knowledge for how I created all of this in the first place?  How could I have imagined stuff that I don't have any memory of?  How could I have imagined the say antibiotics or France or ghosts?  How can I be imagining stuff so quickly without any prior knowledge?   How can I be imagining an entire movie or book on the spot?  How can I be imagining you and your response without any memory of doing it myself?

19 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

Go to the nearest chipmunk and ask it how you should live your life. You will only find the absolute truth in the chipmunk paradigm.

@Gesundheit2 Ha.  Yeah I struggle with that too and that was another reason I had a hate for Christianity and had left it in the past.  But one could also say, you will only find the absolute truth in the paradigm of everything is imagined too.

[Gesundheit2]

@PepperBlossoms You seem to be struggling with two things that might be related, or not.

1. You seem to be searching for something called "the absolute truth", and you seem to assume that it's somewhere to find within thought, when it's not.
2. You seem to be searching for an authority figure or something like that to ground your life and give you directions. You don't know what to do, you don't believe in yourself, and you have a tendency for overthinking.

Is this right so far?

[PepperBlossoms]

3 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

@PepperBlossoms You seem to be struggling with two things that might be related, or not.

1. You seem to be searching for something called "the absolute truth", and you seem to assume that it's somewhere to find within thought, when it's not.
2. You seem to be searching for an authority figure or something like that to ground your life and give you directions. You don't know what to do, you don't believe in yourself, and you have a tendency for overthinking.

Is this right so far?

@Gesundheit2 I get told that I overthink all the time.  I think I've heard that like 3 times just this week, ha. I think it depends on how much the other person thinks relative to me.  But the answers are yes and yes.

[Gesundheit2]

@PepperBlossoms Alright, so you are searching for absolute truth. Did you try Jed McKenna's method?

[Leo Gura]

47 minutes ago, PepperBlossoms said:

@Leo Gura Okay so if I get a thought in my head to push someone off a cliff or strangle someone's neck just because I feel like it or thought it up, that's Good.. I guess I am just open to the possibility that a demon could have inspired that.

Demons are as Good as anything else. Don't demonized demons.

Quote

I get that one.  It's super terrifying.  I guess I don't want to live in that one.  I don't want it to be that I am all alone, or that I don't even exist and I am imagining myself.  I want y'all to exist.  I want this chair or that potato to exist.

It all exists, if you imagine it. It's your dream. Have it your way.

What's super terrifying is playing the human games you play.

Edited November 1, 2022 by Leo Gura

[PepperBlossoms]

18 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

@PepperBlossoms Alright, so you are searching for absolute truth. Did you try Jed McKenna's method?

@Gesundheit2 I am watching it.  My reaction was: We don't even know what's not true so we may not ever know what is.  

But Abrahamic religions sure do throw in a pretty big threat.  Like the comparison of, if you had 99 well-behaved kids and 1 psychopath, you'd want to pay attention to the psychopath or else you'd think, everything is okay here, and then the psychopath goes and kills the other kids.  So then, even though like Hell/demons/Satan are something I don't want to think about, if they are the 1 psychopath, and I choose to ignore them...  it's really hard to say what the 'right' thing to do is.

@StarStruck

1 hour ago, StarStruck said:

Everything is Ain Soph Aur. 

Thanks.  This reminds me of some various non-duality/you are god experiences I have had where one has various levels of consciousness.

[PepperBlossoms]

5 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Demons are as Good as anything else. Don't demonized demons.

It all exists, if you imagine it. It's your dream. Have it your way.

What's super terrifying is playing the human games you play.

@Leo Gura  What part about the human games that I am playing is terrifying?  What do you mean by 'playing human games'?  Just like convincing myself I am a human is a scary thought in terms of - why do I keep convincing myself I am human?

I guess I feel like if I had some sort of demonic thing in my house, it would be hard to think of it as good ha.  I guess especially if it was trying to hurt me.. but I guess I hurt things too so I am just as bad?  But I guess there are spiders and cockroaches and I don't see those as good or bad.